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TinoS (California)
Posts: 85
Posted:
in California:
Does the board need to vote in an open meeting to take action to contact an attorney to write an amendment?

At our past open board meeting we discussed under new business that we should consider doing this but we did not vote to approve funds or vote to do it. The Meeting Minutes if that meeting that was sent out to all owners afterwards mentions that the topic was discussed and mentions some board members thoughts about it and that one of the board members would contact attorneys about the prices to do so.

At this point can we contract to do this or do we need another open board meeting to vote to contract a lawyer?
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Tino

If you referring to amending your Bylaws, there is a proper process that works and is transparent to the Membership. Our Board started the process backwards and found out afterwards that they had done it all wrong. Like adopting Rules and Regulations, you must inform the Membership before and after for input. Unlike the Rules and Regulations, amendments to either the Bylaws or CCR's reguire some pretty high percentages to pass. Those numbers would be found in your respective CCR's or Bylaws. From experience, you don't need an attorney to write an amendment, only to review the wording before going out to vote.

To answer your question, the proper procedure would be to discuss and vote in open session. If you are looking to re-state your Bylaws, you might want to form a committee of residents to have input. Depends on how extensive the change(s) could be.
TinoS (California)
Posts: 85
Posted:
I can see that I wasn't very clear and I even had words in one sentence that shouldn't have been there making it confusing. Let me try to clear up my concern.

I've read that boards can only take action in a board meeting. This is very difficult but we want to at least make some attempts to try to comply with the open meeting laws of the state, as I understand them. We want to add an amendment to our CC&Rs (not the By Laws, and not the Rules and Regulations) for a rental restriction clause. Our CC&Rs state that it takes 51% of the owners to approve an amendment. We want to contract an attorney to write the amendment to the CC&Rs.

We have informally polled enough of the membership to know that we now have at least 51% in favor of what we would probably put in the rental restriction amendment and this is prior to contracting an attorney. We also have announced in a recent open board meeting that we are considering amending or rewriting the CC&Rs although we were not specific and at the time were not officially asking for input.

I am asking on this forum if the board needs to hold another open meeting to vote to take the action to approve funds to contract an attorney to do the work? After that the attorney will produce the amendment and the ballot and we will then send it out to membership. And then at a followup meeting we will tally the votes per the laws (another thing I will need to learn) for tallying these type of votes.

I am asking whether this next open meeting to approve funds to start the process is necessary or can we at this point just contract the attorney considering that we did state that we were looking into doing this in the last meeting?

I hope that was a clearer explanation of my question.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Tino IMO you can go ahead but if you really want to be on the safe side, if all of the Board members approve the action in writing, it can be added to the minutes of the next open meeting.

Corporations Code ยง7211. Board Meetings; Notice; Quorum; Consent to Act Without Meeting.

(a) Unless otherwise provided in the articles or in the bylaws, all of the following apply:

(b) An action required or permitted to be taken by the board may be taken without a meeting, if all members of the board shall individually or collectively consent in writing to that action. The written consent or consents shall be filed with the minutes of the proceedings of the board. The action by written consent shall have the same force and effect as a unanimous vote of the directors. For purposes of this subdivision only, "all members of the board" does not include an "interested director" as defined in Section 5233, insofar as it is made applicable pursuant to Section 7238.


Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Tiono,

I agree with Glen 100%. Make sure that whatever action was voted upon is put into the minutes of the next Open Board Meeting.

I also agree your Board did the proper thing and getting community assent prior to starting this process. WE wnet through a similar process, and while I am not on the Board, while the 30 day election was going on, checked to see where we stood and then went door to door to make sure the amendment passed. Last thing you want to do is spend the amount for the process and fail at the ballot box.
TinoS (California)
Posts: 85
Posted:
So per your suggestion here is how I see things proceeding now that we believe that we have at least 51% of the owners willing to approve an amendment when asked to vote on it:

- We announce the next open board meeting with a 10 day notice (10 days is defined in the CC&Rs) announcing our intent to discuss the specific rental restriction amendment. **** see comment below ***

- We contract an attorney to write the amendment and write the ballot.

- We receive the attorney's preliminary amendment and bring it to the next open board meeting.

- At the meeting we state that the board in the interim between the last meeting and that meeting voted and approved hiring an attorney to write the amendment. That gets it in the minutes.

- We discuss the amendment at the board meeting taking in final comments.

- We have the attorney finalize the amendment language and give us the amendment and ballot.

- We send out ballots with due date and annoucement of next meeting.

- Owners fill out ballots and either mail them or bring them to the next meeting where they are counted.

- If it passes we file the amendment with appropriate county agency (will figure that out when we get to that point.)

*** we are a little concerned about an absent owner that has moved away and his house on the market and can't sell it at the price he is asking. He has told people that he will rent it if he can't sell it. We are concerned that he will decide to rent it before the amendment is passed, and if he did so this unit would exceed our rental restriction limit.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TinoS on 08/28/2010 7:37 PM

- If it passes we file the amendment with appropriate county agency (will figure that out when we get to that point.)

*** we are a little concerned about an absent owner that has moved away and his house on the market and can't sell it at the price he is asking. He has told people that he will rent it if he can't sell it. We are concerned that he will decide to rent it before the amendment is passed, and if he did so this unit would exceed our rental restriction limit.

That would be the County Recorder aka the Registrar of Deeds; at least locally it must be in a specific format for the CR to accept it.

Which would you rather have another rented property or someone who walks away and abandons the property.

Do not forget the first mortgage holders; depending on your documents they may also have to approve the amendment but at the very least they will need to be notified. Our CC&R's state that even if the mortgage holders do not respond or agree; that the amendment is valid among the homeowners.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Tino,

At this point, IMO, it would be OK for a board member to bring back names of different HOA attorneys. The board can then vote on which attorney to contact. Since CA has an open meeting law I would say the board cannot discuss this issue except at an open board meeting. Since no decision was made at the last board meeting you have no other choice but to make it at the next open board meeting. This is not cause for a closed session. IMO, your board Pres should get in the habit of asking for a motion to take action so that the board does not have to wait another month to do so.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Directing the president to get the wording for an amendment from an attorney is not that big of a deal. That could have been handled by a motion outside of a meeting, and then ratified at the next meeting. But since the topic was on the table, the president could have requested the wording anyway, since you probably are on retainer or have an annual budget for attorney fees.

It's what you do with that Proposed wording that would require the open meeting.

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