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ElieX (Florida)
Posts: 1
Posted:
Our Condo Board consists of three members. One of our Members stepped down and the HOA called a special meeting (in July) to appoint a new member. The problem is, the Annual Meeting of the Board is coming up in September. For the upcoming election, all of the Board Members are up for re-election and there are 4 people running for re-election (1 new person). The property manager has informed me that if we don’t get a quorum at the Annual Meeting (which is 51% of the owners in a 400+ building), which we’ve never had in the history of the condo, it doesn’t matter how many votes are received by proxy or before the actual meeting, the current board will stay. Thus, it would be impossible to elect any new members since we will never have a quorum. It also means that this new appointed Board members who has never presented qualifications to the owners, and has never been duly elected will stay on the Board. Is this even legal? What can we do to ensure a fair election?? There is no reference to any of this in our by-laws.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Elie,

Surely your bylaws state what the quorum is for the annual meeting. If a quorum cannot be attained there cannot be a meeting which means there cannot be an election. That may not be explicitly stated in the bylaws but that is how the process works.

The bylaws should also outline the procedure for filling vacancies on the board. It's not uncommon for the BOD to have the authority to make an appointment to fill a vacancy.

I think you should thoroughly read your bylaws so that you will be familiar with the election process and know what the quorum requirements are. From what you have written I cannot see anything that would make me think that the election would not be fair.

If it is impossible to get enough proxies and members to attend a meeting and meet the quorum requirements then perhaps your bylaws need to be amended to allow mail-in ballots. With mail-in ballots a member can cast his own vote but not have to be bothered to attend the meeting.This has worked for my assn and, in fact, is now the law in AZ.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
ElieX,
The question "What can we do to ensure a fair election??" should be restated as What can we do to ensure an election? You need to first amend the Bylaws to reduce the percent from 51% to a percentage which will allow your HOA achieve a quorum so a meeting can be held.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Elie X

We have had the same problem in our HOA for 7 years. Last year after another failed attempt at an election, a few of the homeowners got together to re-write the Bylaws. No matter what anyone else on this forum says, quorum is not required or necessary to hold elections of any kind in an HOA or Condo. You will have some argue that you may get a small group controlling the HOA, when in fact that is happening now. Two people from the current BOD elected a new Board Member, while if you were to be nominated and run as outlined in the Bylaws, you need 204 people to cast a ballot or proxy for even one vote to be opened. You can re-write the Bylaws and have the proper safeguards put in place.

Mail in ballots is not the answer. It may work in an HOA made up primarily of 55+ in age or a HOA that really communicates with their homeowners. We have mail in ballots and our last election we fell 120 short of quorum. If you have a community of mixed ages, you WILL have to go door to door to collect enough votes to pass new Bylaws. Our election date is this coming Thursday, but going door to door we have collected just under 200 votes, we needed 162 yes votes. This will now ensure that we have elections that count from now on. If you don't like the candidate you voted in, the process to remove is easier or can be removed easier at the Annual Meeting.

Wish you the best of luck!!
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Richard,

Don't be so quick to say that mail-in ballots is not the answer. IMO, it all depends upon the HOA. I do not live in a 55+ community. Since AZ changed the law several years ago, it is required for all HOAs in AZ. I haven't heard any complaints and the legislature is not being petitioned to change the law so it must be working. I know it worked for my assn (1700 homes). Our bylaws were changed several years before the law was changed. Mail-in ballots means you don't have to leave the comfort (except to mail the ballot)of your home to vote in the HOA election (except to mail the ballot). The HOA provides the envelope and some even provide the stamp!
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
I don't have a problem with mail-in ballots. Even though it's not mandatory, we use mail-in ballots here. Actually, I think all elections should be done by mail-in ballot from local governments to electing the President. Oregon has done it for years and has been very, very successful.

My point was that mail in ballots are not the answer to obtaining quorum. We have used since 2006 and the Association couldn't achieve quorum. The issue is finding a way to get homeowners to vote. Our BOD and PM don't do a good job in communicating with the residents. To get our Bylaws changed we had to go door to door to get people to vote. I don't mind if it was for amendments, recalling a director or for annual or special assessments, but I will be damned if I am going door to door and helping another candidate that chooses to sit on their butt. Having a quorum ONLY benefits those in power and has the tendency to keep outsiders out. I think we see enough posters that come on and mention that their Association hasn't made quorum in some time.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Richard,

I agree, attaining a quorum is a problem with many assns. However, I do believe there should be a quorum for a meeting. If 51% (a majority) is too high then perhaps it needs to be reduced to 30% or whatever. According to Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised, Tenth Edition, the "requirement for a quorum is protection against totally unrepresentative action in the name of the body by an unduly small number of persons." Note that the BOD cannot conduct business w/o a quorum of the BOD present. Why should it be any different for the members?

Don't blame the quorum requirement for your assn not being able to hold an annual meeting for several years. Instead, put the blame where it belongs -- on the members for their apathy.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Mary,

The argument does not fly. Currently, an Association, can and does operate with a small number of potentially unelected Directors who knowing that quorum can't and hasn't been achieved are Directors for as long as they choose and when they decide to step down the Board chooses another friend in secret without ever having to get approval from the Members. This happens day in and day out.

Where you are wrong is that Corporation Code states that ONLY items stated on the agenda may be acted upon if quorum is not 33 1/3 of the Voting Power of the Association. So ONLY items noticed and posted according to law may be voted or acted on.

There is absolutely no harm in electing directors by those willing to be involved in Association business. Apathy is caused by how the governing documents are written and applied. Our CCR's state that to vote on a special assessment over 5% of the annual budget, there must be a quorum of a majority of members and an affirmative vote of 51% of the membership. Makes no sense at all.

If California, who benefits the most from HOA's. want more involvement from homeowners in these communities, they need to pattern elections after other elections conducted in the state.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Richard,

Ditto to you!

The reason your assn operates with a small number of participants -- board members who serve year after year is not because the quorum requirements are too high,but rather because the members allow it. If enough members were interested that would change. But as long as only a handful of member care to attend board meetings and annual meetings there will continue to be no meetings because of a lack of quorum and the same board members year after year. I doubt you'll see more people attend the annual meeting -- other than the ones who are there year after year, if you are successful in getting your bylaws amended to remove the quorum requirement. There might be one or two new board members elected (probably from that same loyal group) and will be because they were the only ones there to vote. The only difference will be that you and your group will be running the assn now instead of the current board members. How will that be any different? It will still be the same people year after year until another group becomes dissatisfied with you and your group.

Your assn, like many others, is infected with apathy. Not because of the way the gov docs are written but because people today have too many other things to do which they feel are more important than assn business. They are content to let someone else take care of things while they just sit back. They don't care who is on the board, how much the assessments are increased, whether the board is violating the gov docs and/or state law, whether there is a balanced budget, etc.,etc. As long as they are left alone they don't have a care in the world about the HOA.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Mary,

Your second paragraph sums up many HOA's today. Having spent two years working in an election division, I understand the problem, because it doesn't just reside in HOA's. Two and a half years ago when I moved in I saw that the Association had a lack of community and looking into it further I saw a lack of communication and transparency from both the BOD and both Management companies. Quite frankly both parties would be happy if their were no involvement from the homeowners, or the troublemakers as they like to us.

As far as new changes, we have the votes to pass the new Bylaws, so quorum is a thing of the past. No more proxies and no more cumulative voting. The old guard from the Board will be gone and we will have at least 4 new Board Members, if not more. We already have new volunteers to take their places within committees. Things can happen within a dormant Association, but it won't happen overnight. Trust has to be restored and communication restored and followed up on and that comes from the top down. This Association allowed a Management company to completely take over this Association. The new Board will take charge and be leaders within a community. It's a challenge that a few of us are willing to sacrifice the time and energy to make sure it happens.

A Member should not be discouraged from volunteering their time on the Board because not enough show interest in voting. If you can present your qualifications to the Membership and garner more votes than your opponents, then you should have that opportunity. Period. We do that for local elections and I don't see a problem.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Richard,

Like I've always said, whatever works for your HOA. . .

Just don't be surprised that down the road, after the same people have served on the board year after year (people from your group of concerned HOA members) some other group of members don't start complaining the same as you and your group did. I just find it hard to believe that a lack of a quorum requirement is going to get the HOA members out to vote. It just does not make sense to me!
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Mary,

If what we are doing is wrong, what would you do to in get more community involvement? It sounds like it's suppose to happen without anyone caring or doing anything.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Elie - look at your bylaws about the terms board member serve.
Your board may be out of a job if it says they serve for their term.
If it says they serve until a new board replaces them, then they may continue to serve until that happens.

Our Annual Meetings require a quorum only when there are monetary issues to be voted on i.e. the dues amount is stated in the bylaws, so an amendment is needed to change them.

All other business can be conducted by those present or by proxy vote.

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