LindaF3 (Oklahoma)
Posts: 1
Posts: 1
Posted:
Is a homeowner not is good standing allowed to spreak at meetings. I know they are not allowed to vote but this homeonwer still wants to say whatever he/she wants to during a meeting.
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speaking at meetings
Started by LindaF3 • 12 replies • 1429 views
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MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
It depends.
You need to look at your controlling documents and local/state laws.
In our development, people who are not in good standing do not even receive notice of a meeting.
And it would also depend on what type of meeting it was anyway.
Is it a board meeting? We do not have open board meetings, as a rule, but when we do, residents can only speak when called upon by the chair.
Is it an annual residents meeting?
If so, then the chair would still need to recognize the resident before that resident can speak.
But, as I mentioned, if a homeowner were not in good standing, s/he would not even receive notice of our annual meeting, would not be able to vote in the elections or for amendments, and certainly would not be provided a platform at a meeting if s/he did show up.
However, again, you really need to check your controlling documents and also what OK laws are regarding HOAs/COAs and member rights.
You need to look at your controlling documents and local/state laws.
In our development, people who are not in good standing do not even receive notice of a meeting.
And it would also depend on what type of meeting it was anyway.
Is it a board meeting? We do not have open board meetings, as a rule, but when we do, residents can only speak when called upon by the chair.
Is it an annual residents meeting?
If so, then the chair would still need to recognize the resident before that resident can speak.
But, as I mentioned, if a homeowner were not in good standing, s/he would not even receive notice of our annual meeting, would not be able to vote in the elections or for amendments, and certainly would not be provided a platform at a meeting if s/he did show up.
However, again, you really need to check your controlling documents and also what OK laws are regarding HOAs/COAs and member rights.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
With all due respect Michele, I have to disagree with you on this one. Any laws or covenants that I've seen on the matter limits the right to vote and to use common elements; they do not limit the right to speak. This H/O should be afforded their 3-5 minutes whatever is allowed to any other H/O as long as they remain civil.
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MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Our documents specify that we are not even to provide notice to people not in good standing.
Therefore, they are not even invited to the meetings.
Therefore, they are not even invited to the meetings.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
I think you had it answered when it was said that it depends on the documents.
Personally, I believe that notices should be given to all members and all members have the right to attend and be heard. Those not in good standing may not vote. As this is what are documents and State laws say, I have no issues.
If other documents and/or State laws differ, so be it.
The bottom line is to follow what the documents and law says to do.
Personally, I believe that notices should be given to all members and all members have the right to attend and be heard. Those not in good standing may not vote. As this is what are documents and State laws say, I have no issues.
If other documents and/or State laws differ, so be it.
The bottom line is to follow what the documents and law says to do.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
I don't see how a member could be prevented from attending an Annual meeting of the members and speaking, if recognized by the presiding officer. That is preventing the member from receiving information that may impact his/her issues with the board.
Taking away voting rights or other privileges is optional by policy or documents, but attendance at an annual meeting is a whole nuther thing.
Still, the documents should back up any kind of policy like this.
Taking away voting rights or other privileges is optional by policy or documents, but attendance at an annual meeting is a whole nuther thing.
Still, the documents should back up any kind of policy like this.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SusanW1 on 05/26/2010 4:57 AM
I don't see how a member could be prevented from attending an Annual meeting of the members and speaking, if recognized by the presiding officer. That is preventing the member from receiving information that may impact his/her issues with the board.
Taking away voting rights or other privileges is optional by policy or documents, but attendance at an annual meeting is a whole nuther thing.
Still, the documents should back up any kind of policy like this.
I don't see how a member could be prevented from attending an Annual meeting of the members and speaking, if recognized by the presiding officer. That is preventing the member from receiving information that may impact his/her issues with the board.
Taking away voting rights or other privileges is optional by policy or documents, but attendance at an annual meeting is a whole nuther thing.
Still, the documents should back up any kind of policy like this.
It's not a "policy," Susan, our documents specify that only members in good standing as of the date required for a notice to be sent are to be given notice.
That includes any required notices, including notices of meetings.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Michele,
If the member gets caught up in Assessments and returns to good standing after the notice has been sent, are they informed of the meeting?
Just asking. Like I said before, each Association has to follow what is in their documents or change them.
Tim
If the member gets caught up in Assessments and returns to good standing after the notice has been sent, are they informed of the meeting?
Just asking. Like I said before, each Association has to follow what is in their documents or change them.
Tim
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
MicheleD,
Just because a member is not given notice does not mean they won't know about the meeting. Your documents don't state the member (not in good standing) is barred from attending, correct? IMHO it's not in an Association's best interests to disenfranchise a member, even though the member disenfranchised him/herself from not being in good standing. Too much energy is being misspent on not permitting the member to speak. It's unproductive and creates more tension than it's worth.
Just because a member is not given notice does not mean they won't know about the meeting. Your documents don't state the member (not in good standing) is barred from attending, correct? IMHO it's not in an Association's best interests to disenfranchise a member, even though the member disenfranchised him/herself from not being in good standing. Too much energy is being misspent on not permitting the member to speak. It's unproductive and creates more tension than it's worth.
DanielH1 (California)
Posts: 482
Posts: 482
Posted:
A member not in good standing is still a member. If a member not in good standing decided to sue, I am sure that a judge would decide that there are at least a few basic inalienable rights for all members that couldn't be stripped. A member, even one not in good standing, cannot be treated like a non-member and cannot just be run over. Still, the basic rights are likely specific to the HOA and its location.
For my HOA, fines and collection agency fees are sufficient motivation to get a member into good standing, if they possibly can. Denying them the right to vote or attend meetings would be meaningless and idiotic: few people care to do those things anyway. Denying them access to our Common Areas doesn't make sense due to the nature of our Common Areas.
For my HOA, fines and collection agency fees are sufficient motivation to get a member into good standing, if they possibly can. Denying them the right to vote or attend meetings would be meaningless and idiotic: few people care to do those things anyway. Denying them access to our Common Areas doesn't make sense due to the nature of our Common Areas.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 05/26/2010 6:13 AM
Michele,
If the member gets caught up in Assessments and returns to good standing after the notice has been sent, are they informed of the meeting?
Just asking. Like I said before, each Association has to follow what is in their documents or change them.
Tim
Michele,
If the member gets caught up in Assessments and returns to good standing after the notice has been sent, are they informed of the meeting?
Just asking. Like I said before, each Association has to follow what is in their documents or change them.
Tim
No. Our documents do not allow for that.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GeraldT4 on 05/26/2010 6:24 AM
MicheleD,
Just because a member is not given notice does not mean they won't know about the meeting. Your documents don't state the member (not in good standing) is barred from attending, correct? IMHO it's not in an Association's best interests to disenfranchise a member, even though the member disenfranchised him/herself from not being in good standing. Too much energy is being misspent on not permitting the member to speak. It's unproductive and creates more tension than it's worth.
MicheleD,
Just because a member is not given notice does not mean they won't know about the meeting. Your documents don't state the member (not in good standing) is barred from attending, correct? IMHO it's not in an Association's best interests to disenfranchise a member, even though the member disenfranchised him/herself from not being in good standing. Too much energy is being misspent on not permitting the member to speak. It's unproductive and creates more tension than it's worth.
That is correct. However, without notice they are not likely to attend. In addition, residents can only address the meeting when recognized by the chair. We do not require that those addressing the meeting be in good standing, however, if someone did attend the meeting, s/he would have the same chance as any other resident to be noticed by the chair.
We do not expend energy disenfranchising members. We simply don't provide them notice, as is stated in our documents.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielH1 on 05/26/2010 11:22 AM
A member not in good standing is still a member. If a member not in good standing decided to sue, I am sure that a judge would decide that there are at least a few basic inalienable rights for all members that couldn't be stripped. A member, even one not in good standing, cannot be treated like a non-member and cannot just be run over. Still, the basic rights are likely specific to the HOA and its location.
For my HOA, fines and collection agency fees are sufficient motivation to get a member into good standing, if they possibly can. Denying them the right to vote or attend meetings would be meaningless and idiotic: few people care to do those things anyway. Denying them access to our Common Areas doesn't make sense due to the nature of our Common Areas.
A member not in good standing is still a member. If a member not in good standing decided to sue, I am sure that a judge would decide that there are at least a few basic inalienable rights for all members that couldn't be stripped. A member, even one not in good standing, cannot be treated like a non-member and cannot just be run over. Still, the basic rights are likely specific to the HOA and its location.
For my HOA, fines and collection agency fees are sufficient motivation to get a member into good standing, if they possibly can. Denying them the right to vote or attend meetings would be meaningless and idiotic: few people care to do those things anyway. Denying them access to our Common Areas doesn't make sense due to the nature of our Common Areas.
Members not in good standing in our development also cannot access/use the common areas.
However, your initial premise above is faulty when dealing with a contract by which the homeowner agreed to abide when s/he purchased her/his home.
The covenants clearly state that a member not in good standing cannot vote, is not to receive notice of meetings (nor the notice of the call for nominations -- if not in good standing on the date the notice is required -- we have a timetable notice requirement in our documents), and is not allowed to access the common areas.
Those are not "inalienable" rights since the controlling documents are what the homeowner agreed to abide by and that is how it is spelled out.
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