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PatW5 (Washington)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Recently in my community, two condo units were seriously damaged by a fire that was caused by oil heating on a stove top. The homeowner had forgotten he was cooking something, until he was alerted by the smoke alarm. It was clearly an accident, but one where the homeowner was clearly negligent.

The Association insurance paid for the repairs to the building, which totaled over $50,000 dollars, but the issue is with the Associations $5,000 deductible. Because the homeowner was negligent the Board feels he should be held responsible to pay the $5,000 deductible. However, our attorney has stated we cannot go after him unless it specifically states in our CC+R’s that homeowners are responsible in cases of negligence. But it doesn’t mention that they are not responsible either.

However, the subject is clearly outlined in our house rule book;
“In the event of a loss resulting from the negligent act or omission of any owner, the owner shall be responsible for any deductible amount of such loss charged to the Association.”

When I brought this to the attention of our attorney, he said it was not enforceable unless in was in our CC+R’s.

Common sense tells me “You broke it, you pay for it”, but as we all know living in HOA’s common sense doesn’t always work. Does anyone have any advice as to what my Board should do?

And in case you’re wondering about the homeowner own insurance, apparently he doesn’t have any.

Thanks,
HOA Prez
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Let this example serve as a lesson for all HOAs that do not have a carefully worded article on insurance in their CC&R's. If in doubt ask your insurance agent for their opinion on this.
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
I'm surprised the bank (the owner gave a mortgage to) doesn't require a minimum insurance on the condo.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:
Does anyone have any advice as to what my Board should do?


Secretly you already know what to do, you just don't want to do it. Sue him!

Personally? For $5,000 I wouldn't even bother.
DanielH1 (California)
Posts: 482
Posted:
If it were me, I'd vote to have the HOA pay the deductible.

Upon reflection, it is a little strange to have the homeowner pay the deductible. Suppose that the HOA had a $100 deductible rather than a $5,000 deductible. The homeowner would pay far less but, somehow, that would be equivalently "fair". In other words, what does the deductible amount have to do with fairness? Nothing, really.

So, I would have the HOA pay the deductible. Then, if appropriate, I would vote to have the HOA file a claim with the homeowner's umbrella insurance (if any) or sue for some amount of appropriate compensation separately (which might be $0). It seems to me that compensation to the HOA from the homeowner should be unrelated/unlinked from the HOA's insurance.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Gerald

When financing a condo, a bank is looking only for the master policy of the condo to cover the loss of the structure. The homeowner would typically get "renters insurances" top cover their personal contents.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Richard, not "renters insurance" but HO6 Condominium Owners insurance.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Oh, not to get on my soapbox or hijack the thread, if you live anywhere around water, you need flood insurance. Regular homeowners insurance won't pay for items damaged in a flood as people in Nashville are finding out. Just as people who live in areas subject to earthquakes need earthquake insurance and if you are in a condo in CA you need to make sure the Association is maintaining earthquake insurance or you could find yourself responsible for paying your mortgage holder for a pile of toothpicks. See: http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/insurance/articles/?storyId=34319&bIndex=5 from the news page.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JeanneK3 (Maryland)
Posts: 562
Posted:
To stop all the arguments about who pays what in insurance, Maryland passed a law last year saying the deductible is the responsibility of the condominium unit owner where the damage originated, whether negligent or not. See www.marylandhomeownersassociation.info for the actual bill.
Jeanne
PatW5 (Washington)
Posts: 5
Posted:
If our HOA attorney says we can't collect because of the CC+R's, we sure can't ask the same attorney to sue him. Sue him on what grounds? According to the CC+R's he doesn't owe.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:
we sure can't ask the same attorney to sue him.


I'm sure he would take the case. I've never seen an attorney refuse a paying client, no matter what the reason. They will do anything you ask them to do.

He may know he will loose, but he wont tell you that. Your paying him to win.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Steve,

That is a general statement that certainly does NOT apply to all HOA attorneys. I know of quite a few who have advised not to sue. But, does the BOD always take the advice of their attorney? The answer is "NO". And oftentimes when they don't and the results are not good they most likely will blame the attorney. Afterall, the members really don't know what has transpired between the BOD and the attorney. No, I'm not an HOA attorney and I'm not coming to their aid. Just stating the facts that apply in many instances. On the other hand, I know of a number of HOA attorneys that I wouldn't give you a dime for. Let's just not put the blame all in one place.

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