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DianeW (Maryland)
Posts: 147
Posted:
We recently moved into a new POA in GA. This is a small asssociation and currently only 4 families reside here. Some of the current owners want to change some of the covenants. They want to make the covenants more restrictive in regards to building. ie - we do not have a minimum sf home requirement. If they want to now add that, will it impact the current owners or does it only apply to new lot owners? It seems to me that you can't change the rules in midstream to owners who bought before the requirements changed. Here we are with only 4 owners and already dissension - not good for the long run to me.
CharlesW1 (Georgia)
Posts: 826
Posted:
Diane,

You mentioned that there are only four families in your POA. You asked if the change would apply to new or previously built homes. I personal feel it wouldn’t be right for the board to make these changes. That’s just my opinion though.

Is there still lot’s available for building? If so the builder himself has to follow these same rules in building any house in your community. I would think.

Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
changes made to covenants apply to everyone, unless the change made also includes exemptions.

So, if you decide to say "no yellow houses", but the ones that are yellow now are okay, you must state that in the change (After May 24th, 2006, no more yellow houses, or houses painted before X date exempted, no more yellow allowed).

JoeS4 (Kentucky)
Posts: 77
Posted:
Changes would only take effect the date after they have been voted on and approved and recorded. You should also include this in your document if you decide to change. You can't go back and change a home that has already been finished with restrictions that weren't in force at the time of construction. Check with an attorney as always and come on people some of this is common sense.

Good Luck
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
I have to disagree Joe, you certainly can force compliance after the fact. Granted, it is difficult, and I don't recommend it for major things, but it can be done. You could give the owner a time frame to comply, and then begin enforcing compliance, etc.. Cities and states do it all the time, and an HOA can do it as well, since essentially, the codes are a civil contract. Changing them is also a civil contract, usually requiring a large majority of owners all agree, so in essence, they are agreeing to the change.

For instance, imagine your HOA decides no more parking on the street. You change your CC&R's to state that. Must you allow all owners currently living there to continue parking on the street forever? Not if you worded the change and had the vote properly, ie, after June 1, all owners must park their vehicles off the street. House colors could be done the same way: Give an owner one year, or five years, to comply with the new codes, whatever is "fair". So too can pets, landscaping, etc. be retroactively applied, with care.

If done correctly, any change could be made retroactive and made to apply to all owners. The key is to choose what you want to do, and make sure all owners agree (or enough agree to be legal).

JoeS4 (Kentucky)
Posts: 77
Posted:
Brain you may disagree but after 12 years in real estate I know that unless your state is different you can't ask someone in a 1800 square foot brick house to four years after living there be required to have 2000 square feet unless your paying for the upgrade or buy the home to make it conform. All real estate laws on the federal level are to protect homeowners and thats all I was saying, there is always an exception or a way around the facts but you can't turn back time or rewrite history, you can only enforce new restrictions to new owners or from a certain date forward. Thats all I'm saying.
DianeW (Maryland)
Posts: 147
Posted:
I get that the no parking on the street after a certain date would apply to everyone, but I bought here because there was no sf requirements for the size of the house. If a 2500 sf requirement is voted in, I will have to sell because I cannot afford, nor do I want to, build a 2500 sf house. I am afraid there will be a majority voting on this change to the ccr's and I would like to feel somewhat confident that I am not going to have to conform to those new restrictions.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
Diane (and Joe), I agree with you that an ex post facto covenant about the square footage of a house is wrong. I do not believe that any court would uphold that contract/covenant.

I also believe that as an owner, you would vote against such a proposal, and convince others to do so as well, thus denying the HOA the required number of owners the votes needed to pass such a *stupid* covenent.

I was simply pointing out that a general statement that HOA's cannot enact covenants retroactively is incorrect. They can and do in many situations.

JoeS4 (Kentucky)
Posts: 77
Posted:
Diane remember if they increase the square foot requirements that over time it makes your home more valuable because its the smallest in the neighborhood, and you don't have to sell because they can't make you upsize your existing home.

Good Luck
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Diane, you didn't say how many total units will be built in the association. The Developer will probably be in control for some time. Be patient, until the owners take control of the Board they will have little if any say in changing Covenants or rules.
DianeW (Maryland)
Posts: 147
Posted:
There are 12 lots with four current homes, built or in the process, plus mine which only has a hangar(airpark) with an apartment upstairs at this time. We have not submitted plans for the house yet. The hangar was approved by the ACC, such that it was at that time. The developer has already turned control over to the POA since there is only one lot left. Most of the other lot owners are speculators. I feel totally outnumbered about this issue and feel cornered into building something we don't want or moving.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Diane, if your Covenants require approval of 2/3 of the lots it will take at least 8 of the 12 to approve an amendment to the Covevents. That means if 3 homes want to amend they will need 5 of the other lot owners approving in order to amend. So approval of stiffer requirements is not likely when speculators own most of those lots.
LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526
Posted:
Good thread--- Now my question- We live in a horse community.....Presently our Decs allow for you to have a trailer- I am not talking about horse trailers .....The kind of enclosed trailers that you see parked outside Home Depot-- Those Pace things... Well, we a farrier who lives here - has for 6 years- has one of those trailers.. as do alot of other people-- Now the farrier does not have any lettering or advertising on his trailer...now the board wants to change the decs to say that the farriers trailer will now be deemed a COMMERCIAL vehicle and NOT ALLOWED to be parked overnite on his property.Howver I cn keep mine becuase I use it for personal things....moving furniture, my go cart etc... So when I questioned the committee and said why if he has no lettering are you deeming this a commercial vehicle? But yet all the other people can keep theirs?Their reply was "Because it's general knowledge that he has his farrier equipment in the trailer" ....Replys ???? thanks LindaC
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
i would check the plates he has on his trailer. If they are commercial plates, then he has a commercial vehicle. if not, then he doesn't.

I would also check the definition of commercial vehicle in the CC&R's. What does that state qualifies as a commercial vehicle? If there are none in the codes, then you must default to the next higher authority, which would be city, county or state. And i pretty much bet they don't consider a trailer to be a commercial vehicle.

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Linda, you would have to get sufficient owners to approve amending the Declaration. Even then I would not want to take this to court since he would have had the trailer for over 6 years before the amendment was approved and filed. Plus, he would probably win based on discrimination alone since there are other trailers. Tell the committe it is not a good idea. It would be a very expensive lesson for all of the members if it went to court and the HOA had to pay both parties expenses.

Why do people come up with such stupid ideas?

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