Condo HOA Board Member's Company Contracted to Provide Our Lawn Service?

AndreaP4 (Montana)
Posts: 1

Posted:

One of our board members owns a lawn service and was paid $23,000 last year (6 months with no snow that actually need mowing) for 47 units with VERY small lawns. I was told that board member didn't vote on that particular topic, but he was always able to beat the bid of the lowest bidder as he knew the lowest bid. This smells funny to me. If he is indeed offering the lowest price, that is GREAT!! Further, the board president said they have not solicited bids for lawn care this year because they couldn't find vendors that are willing to take the time to provide bids.

I am not on the board, but I want to see if we can find a better price. I also don't want to bother the board by asking them if they mind that I solicit bids (or just ask a local lawn service to come check us out and give me a quote). But, How do I find out if this board member's company is charging too much for our lawn service?

What is a decent rate for condo lawn care service? Anyone know a good resource for area rates, or should I just ask the local vendors? I would hate for a board member to catch me obtaining a quote from a lawn service. Haha. A penny for your thoughts.

GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491

Posted:

Andrea I applaud you wanting to save the HOA money but you need to go through the Board; you could offer to form a committee to solicit bids for them. The BOD may not have been able to get other companies to bid if they suspect that the “fix” is in and may not want to waste their time bidding. While it is not improper for this person to bid on the job they should be treated as any other vendor and should not see any of the other bids; which you don’t know that he did only that you were told he did. Also there is often more to the landscaping contract than just mowing; like weed control, fertilizing, edging and mulching; so you will need to know exactly what the contract calls for so all bids can be compared equally.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Andrea,

As a member you really have no authority to obtain bids for the HOA. Also, you may not know what the BOD wants included in the bid. Normally there are many services provided not just mowing. Also I know for a fact that oftentimes a small assn with limited common areas has problems obtaining bids; most landscaping company's prefer to deal with the larger assn's. Also, if a company does bid, the bid will generally be higher because the assn is small. The landscape company will have a break even amount that must be taken into consideration when bidding on a job, no matter what the size of the job is.

If the board member is bidding on the job he should not be party to bids from other landscapers and he should not vote on awarding the bid. His conflict of interest should be noted and handled accordingly.

LynetteB (Texas)
Posts: 141

Posted:

Andrea,
I am President of our board and I would love help from members to solicit bids for various services. Sounds like you had a conversation with your board President already. Go back to him/her and ask if they would mind you getting bids and find out the specifics of what needs bid, (as the other posters referred to).
Before I became a board member, I used to do plenty of work that should have been done by the board. They just weren't doing it. Maybe you could run for your board or ask to be part of a committee, (or in most cases you would be the committee, haha)
The only way to find out for sure if the current rate is too high, is to get other bids or maybe check with other Condos in your area.
Lynette

DanielH1 (California)
Posts: 482

Posted:

Personally, I'd ask the Board if I could obtain bids.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Andrea,

You might want to approach the Board and request that the bids be sealed. This would prevent the appearance of impropriety by not allowing the Board member to see the actual bids until all are submitted.

Tim

HB (Oregon)
Posts: 143

Posted:

Ok, this isn't a government job where you would need "sealed" bids. If all the bids came in at $25,000 for the year and this homeowner/Board member can do the same work for $5,000 less why not?? I think it is a great way to save YOU some money.

We own a retail garden center and we often get bids on landscape material (trees, plants, etc.). My husband then looks around at all the wholesalers he does business with to see who might be auctioning stuff off at the end of the season and gets our HOA a smokin deal. We are talking less than 1/2 price. I would welcome anyone in our association to find a better price.

Does it make it wrong that we know what the price is beforehand from other companies? No, it enables us to save the association a bunch of money each year. The alternative is to pay more.

I would just ask the Board if they would like any help soliciting bids, that you would be willing to volunteer your time.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HB on 02/26/2010 6:38 PM
Ok, this isn't a government job where you would need "sealed" bids. If all the bids came in at $25,000 for the year and this homeowner/Board member can do the same work for $5,000 less why not?? I think it is a great way to save YOU some money.

HB,

The problem is an ethical one.

If your business is the one submitting a bid and you don't get the job, not because it wasn't a fair bid but because your competitor was shown your bid enabling them to place a lower one and you were not given the same opportunity I believe that you also would be ticked off. I suspect in time, you would quit even applying for the business.

This practice may not be illegal but it does show that the Association does not conduct business ethically. If enough people no longer even bid on the jobs because of this practice, the sole remaining contractor may start charging what they wish. The Association will then have to start paying possible higher prices then they should. All of this because of unethical business practices. These practices do not help the Association.

The OP already said that the Association was no longer getting anyone to bid. Without bids, how do you know if you are paying a fair price for the work done? That is why I suggested sealed bids. If the contractor was not a member of the Board and didn't have access to other company bids, then sealed bids wouldn't be needed.

As for the end of year deals you are getting for your Association. I think that is great. I also don't believe it is related to this issue. Those items would have been sold at that price anyway. It's irregardless who is buying them.

Tim

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 02/26/2010 2:48 PM
Andrea,
You might want to approach the Board and request that the bids be sealed. This would prevent the appearance of impropriety by not allowing the Board member to see the actual bids until all are submitted. Tim

I agree Tim. I think that is the only proper way of handling bids. Plus, without sealed bids some companies will not bid.

HelenK1 (Washington)
Posts: 68

Posted:

I would have to agree with Lynette I am also on the board and somehow stuck with all the hiring of contractors.I am the only one here during the day because I work nights I am supposed to be sleeping during the day but you know how that goes I would love some help. Collecting bids can be a real pain. First I have find contractors to call. Then they often have an answering machine and I have to leave a message. Then they call back and wake me up. Then we schedule an appointment, They often don't show up at all, show up late and leave me waiting, or show up early and wake me up. Then we look over and discuss whatever the issue is. Some of them don't even bother to come back with a written bid. So as you can see collecting bids is a timeconsuming project just by itself.The only thing that really annoys me is when we have already picked a contractor and agreed to let them do the job then at the last minute someone wants to call someone else out to get a bid. Too little too late.As for finding the cost of competing bids the only way you can do it is to contact contractors in your area. Different areas have different wage scales and noone here can tell you what is reasonable for your area. One thing I have discovered though is that if the contractor is close to you, you can often get a better deal. We have a tree cutter that according to our roofers and siding contractor gives us a "great deal" They even want his card. He told me that the reason he charges us what he does is because we are in the neighborhood and he doesn't have any drive time.

HB (Oregon)
Posts: 143

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 02/26/2010 10:18 PM

Posted By HB on 02/26/2010 6:38 PM
Ok, this isn't a government job where you would need "sealed" bids. If all the bids came in at $25,000 for the year and this homeowner/Board member can do the same work for $5,000 less why not?? I think it is a great way to save YOU some money.

HB,

The problem is an ethical one.

If your business is the one submitting a bid and you don't get the job, not because it wasn't a fair bid but because your competitor was shown your bid enabling them to place a lower one and you were not given the same opportunity I believe that you also would be ticked off. I suspect in time, you would quit even applying for the business.

This practice may not be illegal but it does show that the Association does not conduct business ethically. If enough people no longer even bid on the jobs because of this practice, the sole remaining contractor may start charging what they wish. The Association will then have to start paying possible higher prices then they should. All of this because of unethical business practices. These practices do not help the Association.

The OP already said that the Association was no longer getting anyone to bid. Without bids, how do you know if you are paying a fair price for the work done? That is why I suggested sealed bids. If the contractor was not a member of the Board and didn't have access to other company bids, then sealed bids wouldn't be needed.

As for the end of year deals you are getting for your Association. I think that is great. I also don't believe it is related to this issue. Those items would have been sold at that price anyway. It's irregardless who is buying them.

Tim

Tim,
It is only unethical if you promise a sealed bid process (IMO). I am a broker by profession and get bids for my customers everday. My main job is to haggle over prices to get the best deal . . it's business. If this association wants things to appear "fair" at the expense of the members than so be it, but they should ask the members how they feel. If there was no benefit to the members of the HOA (ie. saving them thousands of dollars each year), then I would say go with someone else.

We solicit bids for landscaping every other year to make sure we are getting a competitive price. It is not a sealed bid process, and we always work with the landscaper we want to use to get the price we want. If one of our members had a landscaping business and spoke up to say he could do great work for less than what we pay (ie. save everyone money), then we would seriously consider it.

I am working with other people's money, so I feel obligated to fight for the best deal available. We have had no problem getting the same businesses submitting bids for our landscaping. If there is a chance they might get the job, they will provide a bid.