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AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960
Posted:
Hotly debated subject at Board Meeting last night.

I know I've discussed this topic here before so just a recap:
Our By-laws state NO PETS. Period. The developer (when selling units, condos) told buyers they could have a cat or other small pet, because the "Board" wouldn't say anything. They WERE the Board. When the owners took over, the new board was left with the mess.

They made a rule stating that pets only 15 pounds or less who are 100% indoor pets are allowed. Now a few people who have "pocket pooches" are requesting they be allowed to walk the dogs on leashes from their units to their cars and off the property.

Some of us argue that that rule should not be changed without a vote of the entire membership because the majority of people bought here with the expectation that there would be no animals. Our property manager says the Board can change any of the rules....I told him they can't; if it's a direct violation of the by-laws. Am I wrong about that?

So at the meeting it was suggested that we post an informal poll for people to make known if they want the rule to remain unchanged or to allow people to walk their dogs. They suggested that the majority of poll opinions "wins".

I'm beating my head against the wall because this seems like such an unprofessional way to go about this....and is it legal? Especially when the majority of the people never bother to read the postings on the bulletin boards and only think things are important if they receive a mailing about business.

Thank you.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Hi Anna,

You could have figured that I would jump in on this, right?

Okay, Bylaws say "NO PETs" That means no pets.

Developer allowed small indoor pets--BAD BAD DEVELOPER!

Board made rule to allow small pets--BAD BAD BOARD--a violation of the BYLaws

A great idea is to post for an opinion on whether to allow pets or not. This will give you an idea on what the membership wants. Do not allow the renters to have a vote. I remember that you have quite a few.

IF the Board in it's infinite wisdom wants to allow the membership to change the pet rule, IT MUST BE THRU AN AMENDMENT TO THE BYLAWS!!! No rule can change that.

If it fails to pass, then pets currently on record may stay. Make sure that all are documented and vested in. Future pets will not be allowed and NO replacement pets.

If it passes to allow pets, then rules must be enacted such as size limitations, leashes, clean-up, etc.
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
Donna,
If I read right, then what you end up with is a By-law about animals.
In my opinion, this would be a statement of what is allowed as to size, number, etc?

May I suggest that any other rules as to leashing, where to walk, etc, etc, be covered under a Rules of conduct and would not require an amemdendment to tweak. These Rules of conduct are constructed by the Board and enforced by the board and can be changed by the board.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Robert,

Many, many association bylaws have animal restrictions. Mine has number of (#2) and size (total 120 pounds) and lots of other wording. And mine to be more restrictive have it in the CC&Rs so there is no just simple voting on pet issues without going the whole nine yards. If Annas association passes Bylaws on pets, only then can they make rules and regs off of those. She does have pet restrictions in her CC&Rs
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
No polls, no surveys, no fudging it.

You must amend your bylaws according to your documents, whether that is to call a meeting of the members to approve a motion to amend OR if your board can change the bylaw at a duly called meeting.

More and more people have pets and this deserves another look. Set up an exploratory committee to feel out the community.

Just who will monitor the entire process is another question. (animal police??)

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
No polls, no surveys, no fudging it.

You must amend your bylaws according to your documents, whether that is to call a meeting of the members to approve a motion to amend OR if your board can change the bylaw at a duly called meeting.

More and more people have pets and this deserves another look. Set up an exploratory committee to feel out the community.

Just who will monitor the entire process is another question. (animal police??)

DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Susan,
It does not work that way in Florida. All changes to the CC&Rs or Bylaws must be done by a vote of the members. It only passes to change if the required percentage is acheived and no other way. Many associations need a 2/3 % of the membership, sometimes a little lower, sometimes a little higher.

I commend Annas association for wanting to do a survey first. If they see an overwhelming percent of the respondants are in favor of a pet rule change, then they will procede to spend the time, money and energy on going to the vote process. The survey carries no legal authority, only advising the Board of the mood of the membership.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Anna, what the Developer did was not legal. And a restriction on pets which is based on a "straw poll" does not make it legal. Legal is different than failure to comply and enforce. This restriction usually would be in the Covenants, not in the Bylaws. To make the restriction legal would require amending the appropriate governing document in accordance with the amendment requirement of that document.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
I have to jump in here, too.

The developer gave a verbal approval. Too bad for the owners of the pets. No Pets means No Pets, unless they have some sort of waiver of the covenant in writing.

The board had no jurisdiction to make ANY "rule" regarding pets since the covenants do NOT allow pets. Therefore, any rule in direct conflict to the covenants is void.

Those people are not entitled to keep their pets.

Now, that's going to get ugly.

However, the only way to rectify the situation is to propose an amendment to alter the covenant regarding No Pets.

If it passes, everyone is happy. Everyone gets to keep their pets.

If it fails, then all those with pets do NOT get "grandfathered" since the covenant regarding NO PETS existed already and is NOT a change to the by laws. They were in violation, and still are.

The pets will have to go.

That is still going to be ugly, but I don't know of any other way to handle it and still maintain the integrity of the governing documents.
AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960
Posted:
Thank you everybody for your comments, advise and opinions!

Michelle it's NICE to see you back catching up with all these posts! You must have been up all night!
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Just curious:
what is the threshold for bylaws changes in Forida? majority? 2/3s?
and CCRs - 2/3's?

AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960
Posted:
Susan, OUR documents state 66 2/3%.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Susan,

The Statutes state, 2/3% unless otherwise stated in the governing documents. That is for 720(hoas), 718(condos) and 723(mobile home)

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