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LoriL1 (Florida)
Posts: 78
Posted:
This request is specifically for those familiar with Florida Statute Chapter 718. Our condominium association has quite a number of homeowners who are seriously delinquent in their dues. We have placed liens on some and are in the process of placing liens on others, but we would like to take additional steps to "encourage" them to pay up. There is nothing in our condo docs that specifically addresses other actions, particularly the restriction of use of amenities, such as the pool. We have recently gotten a request for the pool gate access code from a homeowner who owes $1500+ in assessments and has been sent an intent to lien letter. We want to decline his request, but our PM says we are not allowed to deny homeowners access to the pool. I have not yet found anything in the statutes that specifically prohibits this. I would greatly appreciate your advice/input. Thanks!
MikeS1
Posts: 521
Posted:
Please review your CCRs. I find it very diffult to believe that this isn't addressed somewhere in your documents. Since our parking spaces are not deeded (in fact assigned), we suspend pool, parking and voting. You cannot prohibit them from entering their property and there are some "Reasonable Accomodation" considerations if the resident is handicapped, but the process of suspending parking privileges is a very effective collections tool. Create a collections policy if you don't already have one. We send a collections letter at 60 days advising the owner that this is being turned over to an attorney and they will be responsible for late fees, interest, attorney fees and lien filing fees, etc. Once it hits 90 days, the package goes to the attorney and a lien is filed. Suspending parking privileges works!
LoriL1 (Florida)
Posts: 78
Posted:
Thanks so much for your reply. We have reviewed all our documents and the only action addressed is the collections policy which is very stringent and similar to your policy. Each resident has 2 parking spaces - garage & driveway, so we wouldn't be able to put parking restrictions in place. Since our docs don't specifically address restrictions on pool use and we consider this to be a luxury afforded to responsible, dues-paying homeowners, our thinking was that as long as we weren't in violation of Fl Statutes, it would be an incentive to get them to pay. It might not work anyway because one his neighbors would probably just give him the pool gate access code!
PeterB1 (Florida)
Posts: 257
Posted:
We are an HOA (governed by FL 720) and our Bylaws specifically state we my restrict use of common facilities.

We sent a letter to delinquent owners and explained that they were not paying their fair share. We advised them that effective 'immediately', they were not permitted to use the common area facilities (pool, tennis courts, walking path, and security guards).

Most of these folks responded with a check - withing days. 90 percent responded in weeks. We were very pleased with the results - and wondered why we never did it before.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Lori,

I don't doubt you've reviewed your docs, but sometimes items are hidden in places that may be overlooked. In the CCRs of my former assn, this provision is in the article titled "Easements and Rights of Enjoyment in Common Areas" and in the CCRs of my current assn in the article titled: "Enforcement - Sanctions". The prohibition may not explicitly say "pool use", but rather the use of all amenities.

If it is determined that there is no prohibition stated anywhere in the gov docs, whether it be for only pool use or for all amenities, then I'm not sure the BOD would have the authority to make a new rule addressing this. IMO, it would be like adding a new provision to the CCRs which is the same as amending and requiring a vote of the members. BTW, I don't think this is addressed in statute.
MikeS1
Posts: 521
Posted:
So it's my understanding that these are Condo Townhomes? No that's interesting. Doesn't that mean that the Garage and driveway are Limited Common Elements. Areas that are owned by the COA, but designed for the exclusive use of the Unit owner. Does this sound correct? I know that some COAs have inspection clauses that state that the COA or PM has the right to inspect the garage once per year in order to make sure that the garage is only being used to store the vehicle and also make certain that there are no hazardous materials being stored.

The Garage and driveway aren't actually owned by the unit owner. Now I'm wondering if a COA can restrict access to a limited common element in the event that the unit owner is delinquent on their dues. You can't restrict ingress/egress to the unit, but can you restrict the use of the limited common element due to non-payment of Dues?
LoriL1 (Florida)
Posts: 78
Posted:
I really appreciate all the great responses & advice. Upon that advice, I have re-reviewed our docs for "hidden" references, but the only thing relative is that "the Assn. shall have the right to establish the rules & regs governing the use & enjoyment of the common elements & all easements over & upon the same." I only wish that the drafters of our docs had the foresight to be more specific. I suppose we could establish a rule that homeowners' accounts must be current to use & enjoy the pool (our only amenity).

Mike, you are correct in your assumption regarding our garages & driveways and yes, we are condo townhomes. If we were to restrict access to the limited common elements, I think we might be pushing the legal limits regarding ingress/egress to the unit. Wouldn't want to test that one.

The only reference I can find in Fl 718 is:

718.123 Right of owners to peaceably assemble.--

(1) All common elements, common areas, and recreational facilities serving any condominium shall be available to unit owners in the condominium or condominiums served thereby and their invited guests for the use intended for such common elements, common areas, and recreational facilities, subject to the provisions of s. 718.106(4). The entity or entities responsible for the operation of the common elements, common areas, and recreational facilities may adopt reasonable rules and regulations pertaining to the use of such common elements, common areas, and recreational facilities. No entity or entities shall unreasonably restrict any unit owner's right to peaceably assemble or right to invite public officers or candidates for public office to appear and speak in common elements, common areas, and recreational facilities.

Thanks again for all the great input. Over the last few months of referring to the posts on this site, I have most definitely learned a lot from everyone's experience & knowledge. I think I'm going to call DBPR & see what they have to say. I'll keep you posted.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LoriL1 on 08/26/2009 9:12 AM
I really appreciate all the great responses & advice. Upon that advice, I have re-reviewed our docs for "hidden" references, but the only thing relative is that "the Assn. shall have the right to establish the rules & regs governing the use & enjoyment of the common elements & all easements over & upon the same." I only wish that the drafters of our docs had the foresight to be more specific. I suppose we could establish a rule that homeowners' accounts must be current to use & enjoy the pool (our only amenity).

Um. You just found it. Your documents do give you that ability. As long as state law doesn't conflict, then have your board create the rule then pass that along to your PM.
DwightT (Idaho)
Posts: 664
Posted:
I agree with Michele. Since your docs give you the right to establish rules on the use of the pool, you can pass a rule that states that anyone who owes the HOA any money does not have the privilege to use the pool. We did something similar a couple of years ago when we installed an access control system at our pool. People who don't pay their assessments don't get a key card. People who already have a key card and then have a balance due (from CC&R enforcement actions or similar) will find that their key cards have been disabled.

We do give people the opportunity to request a meeting with the Board, and we have still allowed access in some cases - typically when dues haven't been paid because of something like a job-loss, but they are trying to make payments. But very few people have actually requested a meeting. Most just pay once they realize that they can't get into the pool.
EllenS1 (Florida)
Posts: 1,148
Posted:
Dwight,

Good for you..it seems this is only right.
TracieS (Colorado)
Posts: 460
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LoriL1 on 08/26/2009 7:22 AM
It might not work anyway because one his neighbors would probably just give him the pool gate access code!

If you can prove it, then disable that member's access, as well. Write it into a rule. Anyone who provides access to anyone who shouldn't have access will have their/his/her own access terminated.

I don't know if it's legal, but if you can track it, maybe give it a shot.
EllenS1 (Florida)
Posts: 1,148
Posted:
Tracie,

I agree. Whether it is legal or not who is going to sue with all the expenses that involves because they can't have access to a pool. They may say they will but after an initial meeting with an attorney (which will probably never happen when they find out they need to pay more than their outstanding assessments) they will soon change their mind. We had an owner who threatened to sue the board and he had no case. After a few months of terrible emails and threats of suing back and forth between him and the management company and board members I recommended to ignore him and if we got a notice from his attorney that would be the time to respond. It never happened. After almost 40 years in the legal field it still amazes me how frightened folks get when they are "threatened" with a law suit. Mostly it's just a bluff.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Ellen,

I agree with you that in most instances, it's only a bluff. However I don't believe a BOD should pass a rule that they think may be illegal on the premise that no one will sue them over it. Just when you say "no one" "someone" will pop up. But, frankly, I think it's an irresponsible position to take! If the board isn't sure whether it's legal or illegal they should seek legal advice. Actually it reminds me of some errant boards who break the law or violate the gov docs, then thumb their noses at the members and say "So sue us!" knowing full well they won't be sued, mainly because of the cost.
DwightT (Idaho)
Posts: 664
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TracieS on 08/26/2009 3:19 PM
Posted By LoriL1 on 08/26/2009 7:22 AM
It might not work anyway because one his neighbors would probably just give him the pool gate access code!


If you can prove it, then disable that member's access, as well. Write it into a rule. Anyone who provides access to anyone who shouldn't have access will have their/his/her own access terminated.

I don't know if it's legal, but if you can track it, maybe give it a shot.

This was why we switched from access codes to key cards this year. Previously some codes were passed around to anyone who asked, even from outside of our neighborhood. Needless to say this upset some homeowners since it resulted in the pool often being crowded with rowdy teens. This year we went to key cards with a $20 refundable security deposit. There were a couple of incidents at the start of the year where some teens tried to sneak in, but other than that it has been a very quiet year at the pool.

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