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DwightT (Idaho)
Posts: 664
Posted:
In reviewing our CC&Rs yet again I recently noticed a possible conflict:

Section 4 "Off-street Parking" - All Lots shall have a driveway that allows a minimum of two off-street automobile parking spaces within the boundaries of each Lot.

Section 12 "Vehicle Storage" - Parking of boats, trailers, motorcycles, trucks, truck-campers, and like equipment, or junk cars or other unsightly vehicles, and like items, shall not be allowed on any part of said properties nor on public ways adjacent thereto excepting only within the confines of an enclosed garage or other approved enclosure, and no portion of same may project beyond the enclosed area. Parking of automobiles or other vehicles on any part of the properties or on public ways adjacent thereto shall be prohibited except within garages, carports, or other approved areas. Garage driveways shall not be extended on either side for additional parking. For the purpose of this Section, an approved area may be beside the house, but not on a street side, and screened with a six-foot (6') solid vinyl or cedar fence or landscaping enclosure, which screening is approved by the Architectural Control Committee. If the height of the stored item is greater than the height of the front fence, the item must be stored two (2) feet farther from the front fence for each part of a foot the item extends above the fence, and the item must be stored two (2) feet away from any side yard fence for each part of a foot it extends above said fence, but in no case will the item be allowed to be stored if its height is greater than ten feet (10') or length greater than thirty feet (30'). Any variance to allow a deviation to these vehicle storage requirements must be approved in writing by the ACC and all surrounding neighbors. The Architectural Control Committee shall be the sole and exclusive judges of approved parking areas.

Since the emphasized part of Section 12 does not allow parking in the driveway, but Section 4 requires all lots to have parking places for two vehicles, are they in conflict? Maybe it just a logical conflict and not an enforcement conflict: houses must be built with driveways big enough for two cars to park, but that doesn't mean you can actually park there.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Dwight,

It could be that Section 4 is just reiterating the requirements of the city/county development guidelines. But, frankly I think your CCRs should be amended to state: "except within garages, carports, DRIVEWAYS, or other approved areas." At first I thought "approved area" could mean driveway, but after reading further I noted that is not the case. Why shouldn't members be allowed to park a vehicle that is not one mentioned under "vehicle storage" on their driveway? What if you have a 2-car garage and 3 vehicles?
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
".... or other approved areas." - DOH! That would be the DRIVEWAY.
"Garage driveways shall not be extended on either side for additional parking." - DOH!

If I bought a home in your developement asnd was told I could not park a properly maintained registered passenger vehicle in MY OWN DRIVEWAY - I would hide or mortgage all my assets and fight you all the way to the supreme court - if I lost (not likely) I would 'walk away' leaving you with the legal bills.

NO CONFLICT
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
John,

You should read further. An "approved area" does NOT include the driveway!
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
John,

You should read further. An "approved area" does NOT include the driveway!
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

John,

My HOA had No Overnight Parking of any vehicle on the driveway. All vehicles were required to be within the parking structures after 10 p.m. .NO OUTSIDE OVERNIGHT PARKING. Went to court and court stated that it was indeed an enforcable covenant. So your interest in fighting all the way to the surpeme court might not be a done deal.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
your BOD can add driveways as approved areas. the current rules state that an approved area MAY BE XXX... so it could also be other things.

get them to add the language.
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
do we know the difference between a boat and a car ?
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB7 on 07/03/2009 5:37 AM
do we know the difference between a boat and a car ?

"We" do.

Do We?
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
Are you sure?

http://www.turbinefun.com/Aqua_Car.asp
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
I'm sure
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DonnaS on 07/02/2009 12:39 PM

John,

My HOA had No Overnight Parking of any vehicle on the driveway. All vehicles were required to be within the parking structures after 10 p.m. .NO OUTSIDE OVERNIGHT PARKING. Went to court and court stated that it was indeed an enforcable covenant. So your interest in fighting all the way to the surpeme court might not be a done deal.

Define:
Overnight
Parking
Stopping
Standing

If a HO came home at 11:30, stopped in his driveway to eat or unload vehicle, then left - would he be in violation?

If the vehicle were to be moved every 4-8 hours is it still 'parked overnight'?
If it is 'standing' with a door left open?
'Stopped' with keys in ignition? (legal on private property) (how would you prove the key in the ignition works?)

My HOA has a similar rule which was targeted at motorcycles:
Daytime parking in driveway is OK, but bike must be in garage at night.
(when it can be seen - leave it out, when it's dark - hide it)

Some asinine rules are simply unenforceable.
DwightT (Idaho)
Posts: 664
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MaryA1 on 07/02/2009 12:08 PM
Dwight,

It could be that Section 4 is just reiterating the requirements of the city/county development guidelines. But, frankly I think your CCRs should be amended to state: "except within garages, carports, DRIVEWAYS, or other approved areas." At first I thought "approved area" could mean driveway, but after reading further I noted that is not the case. Why shouldn't members be allowed to park a vehicle that is not one mentioned under "vehicle storage" on their driveway? What if you have a 2-car garage and 3 vehicles?

RE: Section 4 reiterating city requirements. Probably true. The first few sections of that Article stipulate various initial construction requirements (floor area, garage size, roofing material, etc). But construction is complete, and those sections are still there, so they still need to be considered when enforcing the CC&Rs. By itself, I would think that Section 4 implies that parking in the driveway would be allowed. But then comes Section 12.

This is coming up because I have finally convinced the Board to document our policy on parking enforcement. In the past the Board has not wanted to do anything about car parking. Other Board members have argued that we can't prevent people from parking on the public streets, especially if the car is not owned by a resident. They have also argued that we can't prevent people from parking in their own driveways. Thanks mostly to past discussions on HOATalk, I have been able to show that we can enforce the parking restrictions. And because of a couple of recent issues combined with a growing number of complaints about parking, they have finally decided that we should have a consistent, documented policy.

I agree that a person should be able to park the vehicle that they drive every day in their driveway. However, long-term parking (storing) in the driveway is not allowed. We recently had one home where they had a car that looked like it had been dragged home from the junkyard sitting in the driveway for several weeks. Neighbors started to complain, so we started our standard enforcement process. When we got to the certified Demand stage, the owner got belligerent and came in to the Board meeting to try to bully us. He claimed that the car was functional, but it belonged to his teenage son who couldn't afford the gas to drive it (which is why it sat for so long). We told him that the fact that the car was functional didn't matter. It was still an unsightly vehicle, and it couldn't be left in the driveway. He claimed that it was not unsightly (beauty is in the eye...) and if we were going to tell him that he couldn't park it in the driveway then we had better be telling everyone else that they can't park in their driveways.

I have no problems with enforcing the unsightly part (it was god-awful ugly, with spray-painted "racing flames" over several rust spots), but he is basically correct about the other people part. We got past it this time by telling him that we enforce the parking restriction on an as-complaint basis, and if he would like to file complaints about specific homeowners, we would look into it. Haven't heard anything from him since, but because of this the other Board members agreed to let me document the policy.

I think everyone would agree that it would be ridiculously excessive to start sending violation letters as soon as we see any car parked in any driveway or even on the street. Friends/family coming over to visit shouldn't be violations. At the other end, it would also be unreasonable to have cars sitting without moving for weeks at a time. We need an enforcement policy that respects the restrictions in the documents without being excessively overbearing. I've proposed that first the policy continues to be complaint driven. If the neighbors aren't concerned, then neither are we. If a complaint does come in, then we will attempt to verify. If we check several times over a specified time period (say 3 days for driveway, 1 or 2 for street) and it appears that the car never moves, then we will start the enforcement process.

I like to think that this strikes a reasonable balance. I'm still getting some push-back though from one Board member who basically doesn't want to tell people anything about parking their cars (but he's OK with telling them they can't park utility trailers in view).
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Dwight,

First of all I must say that I'm am vehemently opposed to any "complaint driven" policy that some boards operate by. We recently discussed this issue on another thread. IMO, it's the resp. of the BOD and/or A/C committee to notice violations; by relying on the members to notify them of violations means they are shirking their resp. The mgr or the A/C members should be checking the area for violations on a regular basis. Of course any complaints received from members should be checked out also, but the BOD should not rely on member complaints and definitely not do anything until a member complaint is received.

IMO, the board needs to take a good look at the CCR restrictions regarding parking and develop a policy. If need be, a rule can be passed to interpret the CCR restriction. Also it would be a good idea to develop a rule defining a "stored" vehicle (hasn't moved in 24-48 hrs, has a cover on it). It would also be a good idea to develop a rule defining an inoperable vehicle (up on jacks; expired tags). BTW, saying the vehicle is "unsightly" should not be a reason to disallow it being parked on the driveway. Sorry! Remember, it's up to the h/o to prove there is no violation.

H/o's are resp. for their guests, meaning a violation can be issued for a vehicle belonging to a guest of a member. Our mgr does not send a violation notice unless the vehicle is parked "illegally" for at least 24 hrs. That eliminates sending notices for vehicles of party guests and visitors.

Good luck with your efforts! Hopefully the one board member who doesn't want to enforce parking cars will NOT be able to sway the other board members to his thinking. Let them all know they have a duty to enforce the CCRs and if they don't they may be faced with legal at some point in time. There is a well-known case in AZ where this happened and the HOA lost the case. The judge ruled that they had a "duty" to enforce the CCRs. Read your CCRs very carefully to determine exactly what the board's obligations are concerning enforcement.
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MicheleD on 07/03/2009 6:20 PM
I'm sure


JohnK3 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 967
Posted:
JohnB7 exclaims:

>>>"Garage driveways shall not be extended on either side for additional parking." - DOH!<<<

Clearly, I would agree the "implication" of this language is that a driveway is an appropriate parking area; if not, then why forbid extensions?

Another tempest in a teapot.
DonN (Michigan)
Posts: 357
Posted:
DwightT

I don't think there is a conflict. Section 4 defines an approved area for parking — "minimum of two off-street automobile parking spaces within the boundaries of each Lot"— and requires a minimum of two spaces.

Your highlighted sentence in the Section 12 states, "Parking of automobiles or other vehicles on any part of the properties or on public ways adjacent thereto shall be prohibited except within garages, carports, or other approved areas." The parking spaces in Section 4 are other approved areas.

Re enforcement, CC&Rs are given strict interpretation, meaning that all ambiguities will be construed against the party seeking enforcement.

I agree that the quoted language is poorly worded. Section 12 is titled "storage" but is concerned with parking.

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