Officer compensation. Florida

Started by SteveP5 • 16 replies • 1928 views

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SteveP5 (Florida)
Posts: 50

Posted:

Is it legal for a president to take a deduction in dues if the majority of homeowners when asked vote yes?
If that president steps down can the next BOD rule that the president was not entitled to such a compensation and ask that the HOA is refunded for the deductions and add late fees for each month that the deduction was in place?

JohnK3 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 967

Posted:

I would guess:

1. Probably, if the docs don't prevent it.
2. Can? Sure. But if challenged in a court, former Prez would probably prevail.

EllenS1 (Florida)
Posts: 1,148

Posted:

Steve,

Our Florida bylaws state "No director shall receive compensation for any service he may render to the Association. However, any director may be reimbursed for his actual expenses incurred in the performance of his duties."

I don't know if the association goes through the formalities of amending the bylaws and it passes if this would conflict with State law.

RobertG12 (Arizona)
Posts: 160

Posted:

Please search recent discussions about "thinking out of the box" or "novel ideas" or something similar. There is a discussion on this topic.

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Steve,

If your bylaws do not prohibit directors or officers from being compensated then it's OK. In fact it may NOT even require a vote of the members. I would think it should be an adopted policy so that it would apply to every director/officer not just one. Also, IMO, you should check out the HOA state laws including the nonprofit corp act. The AZ nonprofit corp act states: "Unless the articles of inc or bylaws provide otherwise, the BOD may fix the compensation of directors." My assn bylaws states: "No compensation shall be paid to officers for their services as officers and no renumeration shall be paid to an officer for services performed by him for the assn in any other capacity, unless a resolution authorizing such renumeration shall have ben adopted by the BOD."

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Steve - the fact that the motion "passed" leads me to believe that the board did its duty of qualifying the motion, legally and ethically.

Please say they DID "vet" this motion1

SteveP5 (Florida)
Posts: 50

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanW1 on 05/02/2009 12:51 PM
Steve - the fact that the motion "passed" leads me to believe that the board did its duty of qualifying the motion, legally and ethically.

Please say they DID "vet" this motion1

The vote was done. ballades were collected and the vote came back 4 out of seven yes and three non votes.....they did not return their ballads.
The question now. Does the president's vote to reduce her own rate count?

AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960

Posted:

Steve, Ellen was correct where she quoted the State Statutes. What your president did was not legal and the general membership had no authority to vote for that person to have a reduction of dues.

If someone in our association did that, we would demand that the "past due" maintenance fees be repaid.

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Anna,

Ellen was quoting her bylaws not state statute. I took a look at the FL 720 statutes and couldn't find anything addressing compensation of directors/officers???

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Again, I'm going to ask: HOW did that even get on the ballot? According to your own bylaws, there is no compensation, except for reimbursement.

The Board had no right to even put this to a vote before the membership and it needs to declare the ballot vote null and void.

KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343

Posted:

Statute 617 states:

617.08101 Compensation of directors.--Unless the articles of incorporation or the bylaws provide otherwise, the board of directors may fix the compensation of directors.

It is all determined by the articles of incorporation or bylaws... if they state you can or can't then you can or can't...

I personally think it is a bad idea but if the governing documents allow for it and the membership approves this measure, then I don't see much you could do then to try to vote it away.

DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671

Posted:

Mary,
Kevin is correct in this post. Statutes 617 are the Not For Profit Corp laws which all HOAs are filed under. They were the governing Laws prior to 2000 when Fl wrote 720 HOAs and 718 for condos. BUT these still govern any issues which are not covered under the HOA and Condo laws.

Great Job Kevin!!! People always forget or ignore these 617s.

Now to the vote for compensation. The President should NOT have voted on this but should have abstained.DUH! Vote for my own compensation? What a deal that was.

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Donna & Kevin,

Thank you both! As you know, I'm not a resident of FL. I knew Donna, at least, would correct me if I had it wrong. :-)

Now it's up to Steve to let us know what his bylaws say. I don't recall him mentioning whether or not compensation is addressed.

DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671

Posted:

Thanks Mary,

That is why we all work here on the "share a brain" system

MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043

Posted:

Donna,

I think that's a given since all we have are "uninformed opinions", aren't capable of discussing "subtle points" and have a penchant for "spouting' nothing but "falderal". LOL

SteveP5 (Florida)
Posts: 50

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MaryA1 on 05/03/2009 8:21 AM
Donna & Kevin,

Thank you both! As you know, I'm not a resident of FL. I knew Donna, at least, would correct me if I had it wrong. :-)

Now it's up to Steve to let us know what his bylaws say. I don't recall him mentioning whether or not compensation is addressed.

Thanks for everybody's response.
The copy I have of our by-laws sates clearly that compensation is not allowed.
However as far back as ten years the presidents have all taken a deduction in their dues because they all believed that the by-laws were amended by vote of the majority of homeowners each time a new president took on the responsibilities of running the HOA.

For years this has been the way things were done to get people to actually do the job because nobody wanted to be president or be on the BOD because it was just another job, but unfortunately it was never done properly because they never actually updated the By-laws, held proper meeting or took minuets of meeting this was discussed in, so each new homeowner was just given the original by-laws that were drafted by the developer.

Because the HOA was run on friendly basis when things were good and everybody was doing well there were no problems. Today we have two units in foreclosure layers are involved and there is no friendly environment to speak of so every misstep in the past has become a foothold for a layer to make a case on.

let this serve as a warning to all BOD who take a lax attitude to the way things should be done.

I'm just getting involved now and honestly I don't know why anybody would want to volunteer to be on a BOD because it's just so much work with so little reward.
I'm even regretting buying a condo vs. a free standing house. Really, who needs this (insert expletive here)

DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671

Posted:

Steve,
Being on a Board is like a really cheap roller coaster ride. UP! and then DOWN! and along the way, there are just plain old boring days. Don't loose your spirit because you are working your butt off now and it is the down side but it will get you personal satisfaction when the job is over and well done.

If I had my choice, I would not buy into a HOA either but somewhere along the line, a free standing, non HOA house is a rare commodity now. Even up here in Tennessee, it is hard to find any new construction that is not under a HOA.

Lots of credit to you for trying to better your community.

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