💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

LeanneT
Posts: 1
Posted:
Do homeowners have anything to stand on when facing due increases? Past management companies stole from the homeowners and were arrested but the books can't be found so nothing is being done to try and get that money back, and the HOAs are faced with all this debt from the bills that piled up. In response the HOAs are turning around and charging the homeowners 2-3X the amount they expected to pay when they bought their properties, and because the HOAs are in so much debt the money is all going to the debt not to grounds upkeep. Do the homeowners have any recourse? Is there anything they can do?
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Is this happening in more than one HOA?

Regarding your question, the point of the assessments is that the Association, meaning ALL members, not simply the Board or the Management Company, ALL members have an obligation to maintain the CC&Rs . . . which includes, most likely, maintaining common areas and such, so if the members have to pay more, then all of them pay more.

Your governing documents should determine how much of an increase to the assessments can be made without a vote from the membership.

In which case, you probably can't do anything about that amount.

However, it's also very likely that the CC&Rs require a membership vote to increase anything above that threshold. If that's the case, then the members can vote the increase down.

Now, if it's a special assessment, the same thing should apply.

Whatever entity increases your assessments, whether the general assessments or special assessments, they will have to follow what's in your governing documents.

If they do, there is likely not anything one owner can do.

RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
LeanneT,
Do me the favor of going back and reading your post and see if anything stands out to you. I assume you are talking about your HOA.
So your HOA includes you, so you are really charged to know a lot of the questions you are asking. You will find a lot of help here, and you will get much more out of this advice if you set it your mind what HOA's are. Is all these things you are referring to possible? Yes and more, but the HOA's don't do anything, it is the members that hold all responsibility. The Board is charged to conduct the HOA business, the owners elect the board and are charged to oversee the Board. The Management Company is hired by the Board so the board is responsible for the actions of the Management Co, or manager.
Understand that and you can then pick apart your post and find the answers to where to go to lay responsibility.

Also it is now plain those homeowners you are concerned about are the same ones that have to share the blame.

Bottom line, if your dues or fees or whatever you want to call them are increasing, you have to find out why before you can try and effect change.........if proper. If change is proper, only the owners can make change.............you can make a difference.......get involved and take charge. We here can not speak to the individual homeowners, we only have access to you.
Think a while, read some of the posts here on this site, learn some more and keep posting, it will help.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
What do you mean: do homeowners have any recourse?

Of course, the bills need to be paid. And yes, if it comes down to electricity or grass mowing, which one has priority, do you think?

Did your board establish a Finance Committee? Has the board adequately informed the Members about all this mess?

You really don't have a choice, here.

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Leanne, There are many things the homeowners can do. I would start by being more proactive in your HOA. You could start with:
1) Never allow the MC to be a signer on any financial account.
2) Make sure your Board has purchased fidelity (theft)insurance.
3) The Board can require the MC to provide monthly financial accounting to the Treasurer and preferrably all Board members.
4) Sue the management company if the HOA can prove the MC theft (coordinate through the fidelity insurance carrier.
5) Volunteer as a candiate for the Board or for the finance committee so you will become knowledgeable on the HOAs finances.
6) Expect assessments to go up with time.
7) Cut expenses as necessary to keep the lights on
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Leanne,

The members should be made to understand that, through no fault of the BOD, the money just is not there to adequately operate the HOA therefore they have no choice but to raise the assessments. Make certain you thoroughly check your docs to determine if there is a limit or if a member vote is required and also check out state laws. Some states have limitations on the amount of the increase.
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
Mary,
Maybe I missed something. Is there a post here that establishes the Board is fault free?
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LeanneT on 02/18/2009 6:48 PM
Do homeowners have anything to stand on when facing due increases? Past management companies stole from the homeowners and were arrested but the books can't be found so nothing is being done to try and get that money back, and the HOAs are faced with all this debt from the bills that piled up. In response the HOAs are turning around and charging the homeowners 2-3X the amount they expected to pay when they bought their properties, and because the HOAs are in so much debt the money is all going to the debt not to grounds upkeep. Do the homeowners have any recourse? Is there anything they can do?

Robert, the part in bold and italics.

The board appears to have done what it could (turned the management company over for prosecution), but if the books are gone, they are gone. Not much a board can do in that case to reconstruct the finances out of thin air.

Not sure what the debt is for, but no doubt in connection to the amok management company somehow.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Well it seems to me that there must be some financials somewhere if someone was arrested. Police don't generally snap the cuffs on unless there is some reason to believe a crime has in fact been committed.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
Michele,
I am not suggesting the Board pull records out of thin air, why would I do that?

I am pointing out the fact that the Board is their employer (M/C). This sheds loight on how well the board has been operating. Nothing in this post indicates the Board is free and clear of responsibility, all it says is someone got arrested. In fact this post speaks to the pural (past management companies stole from the homeowners) under board control I assume. I did not see any mention in this post about the Board, any Board. The post mentions HOA's and also mentions the bills piling up. It could be the board is squeaky clean, all I said was this post did not establish this fact. You say the Board had them arrested? Which one of the HOA's.

When the original poster first posted I responded and asked for clarification and suggested she learn her documents and find out more about what was going on, that was my intent then and now. And in my humble opinion not nearly enough information is posted to start exonerating Boards or anyone else. You will notice I did not and do not point any fingers at the boards, if there are HOA's involved. I asked for information.
MicheleD (Kentucky)
Posts: 4,491
Posted:
I agree with you Robert.

But I don't see anything that says the board is part of anything nefarious, either.

I completely do not understand the use of the plurals for management companies and HOAs.

Very confusing.

But, now this is just me reading between the lines, what I DO see is a resident who has lived there for who knows how long while this theft of funds was going on. . . .which means the management company was probably not fulfilling all its obligations, which means things were probably not getting done. . .

So the board may well have been working to get this straightened out for, again, who knows how long, but the residents don't pay attention until they are hit with an increase, THEN they want to know why and how to stop it.

I'm sure this just didn't develop overnight, and it's very possible that an untold number of communications went out (or none, who knows), and that people just tossed them aside until they get the notice that says, "And the increase is: $XXXX"

Just sayin. . .

Also, keep in mind that, yes, my perspective is colored by my length of time on my board and dealing with clueless residents all the time, until it hits their pocketbooks.

Case in point, I just received THIS note with a resident's VERY LATE payment today. The payment includes a late fee and penalties.

Just so you know, we sent out the first billing in November. It's an annual billing. The bill was for 2009 assessments. In early November the first notice goes out. There is a warning on there indicating late fees and penalties that will accrue if not paid by December 31.

In early December we send out a courtesy reminder.

On January 2, we send out a late reminder and provide people with the drop-dead date, after which all late fees and penalties will be added.

On February 1, we send out another billing, with the new amount due, and remind owners that if payment is not received by March 1, liens will be placed.

Here is the note I received TODAY, with the late payment: (again, keep in mind that this is an annual payment, not monthly, annual.)

"I am sending you my check for the 2009 homeowners' dues in the amount of $225. What I wish to express is my total displeasure with the way that you handle your billing. As a homeowner I have yet to see any benefit for which I pay these yearly dues. While I do not blame you for the Windstorm or Ice storm, I have lost power both times due to this. Supposedly we are on underground lines, yet whenever the power is out I notice that residents on XXXXX always get their power restored shortly after an incident. The rest of us on XXXXXX Lane are always without power for days after. I have yet to see what value your group adds, in that there is no notification to new residents about your group. What I do see is your perpetual harassment of resident to pay a fee that you charge late fees very quickly. While I love my neighborhood and neighbors, I can't say the same about your organization."

Besides coming to their homes and asking nicely if we can help them fill out their checks, I don't know what else we could do.

Oh, and we are single-family, detached homes. A neighborhood of about 300 homes. We had an ice storm not long ago, and everyone in our neighborhood lost power. We do not supply utilities, nor do we maintain them. That honor goes to our local utility company. Our lines are all underground, but the neighborhoods around us are not, and they have many mature trees. You do the math.

Plus, our "group" is HER "group." Our "organization" is HER "organization."

All homeowners receive information about the deed restrictions and the HOA at closing. If they don't that's something they need to take up with their closing attorney and realtor, not us. We are not a party to the sale!

So sometimes I'm not too keen on taking a resident's perspective as gospel.

Again, just sayin. . .
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
MicheleD,
Sometimes, I wonder why folks like you and I am all the other Caregivers of HOA's and Associations have anything at all to do with this stuff. I posted on this site one time, "if you are going to get involved with HOA's in any capacity, DO NOT do it if you need any support, recognition and allacades. My position as a sort of maverick Homeowner is also subject to the same assaults that the Boards suffer. At times I expect they, meaning the Board and the owners want to ride me out of town, and I feel like telling them both to stuff it. But a day dawns when everything seems worth while and you feel good about yourself. I think that somewhere in my last couples sentences is the reason we do this. It's not the money! I think we like to feel we have a little of the old town Marshall in us. The good guy sheriff's never had to qualify, they walked into town and picked up a badge and started saving the town and winning the day. I think we would like to be like that. Trouble is we can't catch up to the bad guys because we can't pin down who they really are. Like your letter writer about her electricity, how do you deal with this that it makes a difference. Some days you eat the bear and some days, the bear eats you. I suspect the reason we post here is with the hope that someone will stop and change their mind and start thinking of what this association life is all about. As bad as it is, it is a tribute to people being people and sometimes that works. I was driving to town yesterday and went by several miles of volunteers clearing up the trash that other folks allow to get tossed along side the highway. It just makes you feel good, and the job they are doing is worthy and commendable. It is not picking up trash, it is the mutual collection of different folks directing their efforts to something that makes a difference. Maybe that is why we have volunteers in HOA's.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Michele,

What an ungrateful board member you are. This lady did not blame you for the windstorm and the ice storm only for the power failure! LOL

Frankly, she should feel lucky that your assn doesn't charge the late fee on the first month the dues are late. Our assn -- and many (if not most) others would have charged the late fee if not paid by 12/31.

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

  • ✓ Ask follow-up questions
  • ✓ Share your experience
  • ✓ Get expert advice
  • ✓ Access 350,000 discussions
Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here