AnitaT (Arizona)
Posts: 18
Posts: 18
Posted:
When are HOA dues collected on an incomplete multi-residental development? When each unit is sold or whenever a certain percentage is sold?
A service of:
Community123.com
Professional websites for HOAs & condos, since 2004
Professional websites for HOAs & condos, since 2004
🎁 1st year FREE for HOATalk members! →
HOA DUES
Started by AnitaT • 23 replies • 2119 views
💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.
Create Free Account →
⚡ Takes 30 seconds
Already a member? Log in
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Anita,
Your CCRs should outline the assessment collection procedure.
Your CCRs should outline the assessment collection procedure.
RenaeW1 (Florida)
Posts: 42
Posts: 42
Posted:
In our neighborhood, it's when you buy your property, not matter the percentage sold. If a neighborhood waited until a certain percentage sold, they may not ever get to start collecting dues.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Anita,
I would say the dues should be collected as each home is sold; otherwise the assn wouldn't have any money to operate on if they waited until all lots were sold.
I would say the dues should be collected as each home is sold; otherwise the assn wouldn't have any money to operate on if they waited until all lots were sold.
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
Voluntary dues association now wants to restrict benefits for non paying members. Park access, voting privileges, attend meetings. Charge new buyers for previous sellers that did not pay. 40 years volunteer community and this new board member over stated and increased the dues. Participation dropping fast. Please advice. We are a non profit with state of MI. THANK YOU
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
I don't think it unreasonable that non-paying members have restricted use, in fact NO use of common facilities. What's the real problem here?
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
Based on our bylaws and Roberts Rules of Order it does not state that dues must be paid. One person making policy without members vote or motions has caused havac. Voluntary means....not required. How could there be restrictions if dues are not required? We are not a mandatory dues organization with the state. Yes it seems unfair that some pay dues and some don't. But based on poor management and over stated dues and dues that are used for expenses this "one person" has created has caused property owners to mistrust the organization. State won't allow liens on voluntary organization how could one person force a buyer to pay for previous owner's dues? THANK YOU>
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
Am i reading your issue correctly?
For years, someone hosted a buffet, with all you can eat for anyone, no need to pay a dime. But, if you wanted to chip in, feel free.
ANd now, there's not enough money to keep the buffet open, so the management has said "if you want to eat, you have to pay. No more freeloaders at the buffet.".
is that about right?
For years, someone hosted a buffet, with all you can eat for anyone, no need to pay a dime. But, if you wanted to chip in, feel free.
ANd now, there's not enough money to keep the buffet open, so the management has said "if you want to eat, you have to pay. No more freeloaders at the buffet.".
is that about right?
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Linda - what is the purpose of the group? WHY would anyone want to join? Is there a beach or pool or something that a person would want to support, so he/she could use it?
If your group is voluntary, then the people who WANT to participate can.
Those who don't want to, can't.
Your "voluntary" group needs to get together and decide how you are going to govern yourselves and pay for your programs or assets that you have to take care of.
It sounds like one person is acting like he/she is running the organization. Do you have bylaws?
If your group is voluntary, then the people who WANT to participate can.
Those who don't want to, can't.
Your "voluntary" group needs to get together and decide how you are going to govern yourselves and pay for your programs or assets that you have to take care of.
It sounds like one person is acting like he/she is running the organization. Do you have bylaws?
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LindaH9 on 10/22/2008 1:06 PM
Based on our bylaws and Roberts Rules of Order it does not state that dues must be paid. One person making policy without members vote or motions has caused havac. Voluntary means....not required. How could there be restrictions if dues are not required? We are not a mandatory dues organization with the state. Yes it seems unfair that some pay dues and some don't. But based on poor management and over stated dues and dues that are used for expenses this "one person" has created has caused property owners to mistrust the organization. State won't allow liens on voluntary organization how could one person force a buyer to pay for previous owner's dues? THANK YOU>
Based on our bylaws and Roberts Rules of Order it does not state that dues must be paid. One person making policy without members vote or motions has caused havac. Voluntary means....not required. How could there be restrictions if dues are not required? We are not a mandatory dues organization with the state. Yes it seems unfair that some pay dues and some don't. But based on poor management and over stated dues and dues that are used for expenses this "one person" has created has caused property owners to mistrust the organization. State won't allow liens on voluntary organization how could one person force a buyer to pay for previous owner's dues? THANK YOU>
Linda,
Who is this one person that everyone has allowed to take charge and just do as she pleases? Doesn't the org. have a BOD or officers? What, exactly is the purpose of this voluntary org? Are there common areas or other amenities to maintain?
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
The President. We have bylaws and he does his own thing which is the reason why some of us are up in arms over the chaos he's creating. At our last meeting he actually lied and said we had a board meeting and there was a vote and motion on an issue and there wasn't. We don't have any reason to be a paying member except few expenses of lawn maintenane and taxes on small park and that we love our community.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
Linda, i can't see yet how your HOA can be voluntary when you have taxes on common property. IF no one pays, how can the taxes be paid?
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
There are two whole different issues in this thread:
The first is in relation to dues in a mandatory HOA. Unfortunately most developers make it so they never pay dues.
The second issue is with a voluntary association wanting to limit benefits to non-paying homes. I think the first question is, "Who owns the park?" You can't restrict use if you don't own and maintain the park. I don't believe I have ever seen such, but I would tend to assume the park was public.
I would make a suggestion That you consider asking for donations for projects. You might find many willing to help pay for such even if they don't care to join.
I would also expect membership rates to be inversely proportional to the cost of dues.
The first is in relation to dues in a mandatory HOA. Unfortunately most developers make it so they never pay dues.
The second issue is with a voluntary association wanting to limit benefits to non-paying homes. I think the first question is, "Who owns the park?" You can't restrict use if you don't own and maintain the park. I don't believe I have ever seen such, but I would tend to assume the park was public.
I would make a suggestion That you consider asking for donations for projects. You might find many willing to help pay for such even if they don't care to join.
I would also expect membership rates to be inversely proportional to the cost of dues.
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
The developer donated the park to the association as long as we remain non-profit, keep it a playground (notice we can't get anymore equipment besides the 1 original swing set) and as long as it is actively used by property owners. If any of the 3 requirement stop...after 3 years the park goes back to the developer's family. Taxes $200 and only the last few years lawn care $1000. Dues were $5 and 95% members paid. Then $15 and 95% paid. Then the president came in and increased to $75 and people dropped off. The increase was not warranted and now he's threatening us that is we stop paying our dues he will keep track and charge the future home owner. The money is in the general fund, not being used, we want park equipment, and instead he used a portion of the money without anyone's knowledge for something that was not approved in advance. No one shows for meetings to vote him off. People don't care and after 25 years I've lost my desire to support the organization. Just wanted to make sure though no one can charge dues from one property owner to another. The dues go to the person not the property? If an assessment I would think the assessment could tie to the property? Does anyone know if dues are a different matter?
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
To create an assessment you would have to have a covenant. I can promise you that if some clown showed up asking me to pay some past dues to an organization I would tell him to piss up a rope. If there was any concern at all I would call the title company. They would know if there was an obligation to pay.
It is no wonder that things have dropped off. I wouldn't pay $75 a year for the thing. How much money did he spend without authorization? If it is enough, then perhaps legal action can be taken to rid the association of the idiot. I would guess that he wants to turn your voluntary association into a mandatory one.
It is no wonder that things have dropped off. I wouldn't pay $75 a year for the thing. How much money did he spend without authorization? If it is enough, then perhaps legal action can be taken to rid the association of the idiot. I would guess that he wants to turn your voluntary association into a mandatory one.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
i cannot see a way to charge future homeowners for voluntary fees that a previous homeowner didn't pay. after all, they are voluntary. how do you attach a debt for something there is no debt owed?
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
Thank you for advice. If I could ask for input on our own website the one our president created and manages....... uses the association name but he controls the questions posted on it and he controls who has access. He posts these newly created rules and no one can dispute or ask for clarification when he deletes the person and the questions....... $1,000 association money for his lawyer for a retainer fee.......
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
if you do not approve of the officers actions, look into a recall or remember to vote them out every election.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
The best advice I could offer is to get this clown out of office as soon as possible. If the Board of Directors won't reign him in, then there really isn't much else you can do other then to elect new members to the Board.
LindaH9 (Michigan)
Posts: 14
Posts: 14
Posted:
THANK YOU TO ALL. I sent an e-mail to our President and asked for clarification of his new policy and of course he would not respond. I told him it was illegal to charge one homeowner for another's debt and voluntary dues are not past due nor are the accrued dues for present or future homeowners. He said he did not have to answer any of my questions but HE DID TAKE THE RULE OFF HIS WEBSITE. I then sent a certified letter warning him to not act on this new rule. I think he got the message. There are many other issues with this leader so I'll be sure to stay connected with this great service. THANKS AGAIN..............
PS Someone asked if he wanted to make voluntary dues mandatory. The answer is "YES".
PS Someone asked if he wanted to make voluntary dues mandatory. The answer is "YES".
StevenP3 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 2
Posts: 2
Posted:
We have two questions.
Should I be making out my HOA dues check to the treasurer by name?
Is it out of line to ask for a bank statement for the HOA account?
This is the first time my wife and I have lived in a home with an HOA and I find it odd that they require checks to be made out in the name of the treasurer rather than the HOA itself.
The only financial information they have provided is a very basic excel spreadsheet which I only question because of the ask of the HOA for homeowners to make checks out to the name of the treasurer.
Should I be making out my HOA dues check to the treasurer by name?
Is it out of line to ask for a bank statement for the HOA account?
This is the first time my wife and I have lived in a home with an HOA and I find it odd that they require checks to be made out in the name of the treasurer rather than the HOA itself.
The only financial information they have provided is a very basic excel spreadsheet which I only question because of the ask of the HOA for homeowners to make checks out to the name of the treasurer.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Steven,
Welcome to the forum.
It would have been best had you started a new topic vs. reactivating an eight year old thread.
To answer your question, the check should be made out to the Association (not to an individual).
Typically, through governing documents and applicable statutes, you have a right to review Association records. Depending on statute, copies may have to be provided as well, but the Association may also normally charge you for those copies.
In my opinion, your larger concern would be if the Association has it's own bank account or is utilizing an account in the name of the Treasurer (which is a not allowed).
Welcome to the forum.
It would have been best had you started a new topic vs. reactivating an eight year old thread.
To answer your question, the check should be made out to the Association (not to an individual).
Typically, through governing documents and applicable statutes, you have a right to review Association records. Depending on statute, copies may have to be provided as well, but the Association may also normally charge you for those copies.
In my opinion, your larger concern would be if the Association has it's own bank account or is utilizing an account in the name of the Treasurer (which is a not allowed).
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
oops didn't notice that Steven also created a new topic.
Please post responses to Steven in the following thread:
http://www.hoatalk.com/Forum/tabid/55/forumid/1/postid/209490/view/topic/Default.aspx
Please post responses to Steven in the following thread:
http://www.hoatalk.com/Forum/tabid/55/forumid/1/postid/209490/view/topic/Default.aspx
PitA
Posts: 1,416
Posts: 1,416
Posted:
HOA DUES are never collected.
HOA ASSESSMENTS are payable as per the Covenants on file for the 'lot' or 'unit'.
Dues implies voluntary social club.
Assessments are required by mutual covenant/contract.
rant: words have meanings .. different words have different meanings
HOA ASSESSMENTS are payable as per the Covenants on file for the 'lot' or 'unit'.
Dues implies voluntary social club.
Assessments are required by mutual covenant/contract.
rant: words have meanings .. different words have different meanings
🎯 You've read this entire discussion
Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:
- ✓ Ask follow-up questions
- ✓ Share your experience
- ✓ Get expert advice
- ✓ Access 350,000 discussions
Create Free Account →
⚡ Takes 30 seconds
Already a member? Log in here