Application Denied

Application was put in to the ARC for temporary parking of our motor home for loading and unloading as per covenants. A denial letter arrived just before the 30 day limit. Outright denied without any conversation with the ARC members. When we finally talked with them, they said that the guilelines were going to be changed in the future(they did't mention the covenants). and that our request would be included in that change. The covenants, as written, when we put our application in states that "prior approval by the ARC was needed for parking of RV's, boats, etc.". Should the ARC have handled our application on present covenants or are the allowed to deviate from the present covenants to deny our application? Their change of the guidelines would be "no prior approval needed for a certain number of days each month". No change mentioned of the existing covenants which state "prior approval by the ARC needed....". The board approves of this decision. It seems to me, if I violated the covenants, they would be fining the heck out of me per day. What is my recourse? The ARC and board are definately in violation of the covenants and no one seems to care.

John, did you read my post? The covenants do not say no parking as you stated and they do not specifically say "RV's, boats, etc." are prohibited. I know that you gave an off the cuff answer because it was easy (since you have not read any of our CCR's), but my husband has served on the ARC of our subdivision for 4 1/4 years (no one wanted to be bothered with the every day workings of the ARC)and has been down many a road with the covenants, by-laws and guidelines. So he knows what they say. The ARC and board are clearly in violation of the covenants. He finally resigned and we go on the road four times a year thus the motor home. If you have an honest answer that you would like to share with me, I really want to hear it. I value other peoples opinions, and that's why I joined HOATalk.com. We are older people, and we have (all our adult lives) believed mediation is the best for problems. If no one wants to talk, there cannot be any mediation. I value all views from everyone on these boards, yes even John's.

Lenore;

Copied and pasted from your post:

>"prior approval by the ARC was needed for parking of RV's, boats, etc."<

Your request to PARK was denied. Therefor -> DO NOT PARK, just stand (in the motor vehicle sense of the term) then move.

CASE CLOSED

Lenore,

Let me get this straight. Your current guidelines state prior approval is required so you applied for approval. Your request was denied because the board is in the process of changing the guidelines to state NO prior approval is required. Frankly, this doesn't make sense to me. I could understand if the guidelines were going to be changed to be more restrictive. But if they're going to be less restrictive I can't understand why your request was denied. I really think you need to appeal the denial and have a meeting with the A/C committee or the board.

Lenore,

Most assn's that I know of give RV owners one day to load and unload. During that time the RV may be parked on the street, on the side of the driveway or on the driveway if that doesn't result in hanging over the sidewalk.

First, thanks for the chance to weigh in on the issue. Now to the issues at hand:

As for the request, in most cases you have the right to appeal to the committee and then the right to appeal to the Board. As a matter of note, state law in Texas requires such a process be available. So the first thing I would say is by all means avail yourself. There is a chance that they will simply ignore you. But getting in front of people raises the chance that you can explain what you want.

I would say the less time the RV will be in front of the house, the less problem you will have. And if you can get it down to a couple hours I would see no reason to bother asking for permission. If you need it there overnight it becomes a different issue. If you want it there for the summer it is yet another issue altogether.

You might also look closely at the docs. In our neighborhood you could legally park it on the street for 48 hours. Our docs don't cover parking on the street leaving that to the city which allows for 48 hours. (Interestingly this has not been an issue. We have had a couple boats show up for a day or so then leave is all.)

As for how load times I can pass on what we did when I was a child. Basically, the only things that needed to be loaded for a trip were clothes and food. Everything else was stored in the trailer. (Parents did the same with their RV when I was grown, but we used a trailer as a kid.) Normally, these items were put together the night before. Then we would simply put in the clothes and food and take off.

To be honest, it took time to get to that point and we went out quite often. As we needed more items for the trailer they would be purchased for the trailer. Mom bought cooking gear from garage sales since they would take more abuse while camping.

I hope this doesn't violate any rule here, but I consider a good place to start on RV information is my father's web site at http://adventure.1tree.net. My parents have lived full time in their RV for seven years. Before going on the road full time they spent many weekends out. The site also has some links to other RV resources where you can get RV questions answered.

The load/unload time is not the issue (up to a point).

The point is that the vehicle is NOT PARKED while it is being actively loaded/unloaded.

Even if it takes all day to load/unload it is NOT PARKED if it is being accessed on a reasonably continuous basis.

After loading/unloading -> GET THE BEHEMOUTH OFF THE DRIVEWAY !

John,

Nice try, but no cigar! Park = to leave a vehicle in a place temporarily (Webster's def.). If it isn't "parked", then what is it???

OK, Brian. So now the assn needs a new rule to define "parked"! No wonder so many people have a problem with HOAs!!!!! LOL

Actually, I think Brian's typical DMV definition is pretty good.

Seriously, regardless of what sort of "definition" one picks, if you have ridiculous owners who will do something insane like this, then it really doesn't matter.

Regardless of the attempts it will be seen as exactly what it is, an attempt to circumvent the spirit of the governing documents, if not the actual language of it.

We have people who try to push that envelope on anything and EVERYTHING.

So it would seem to me that a definition as fair as what the DMV uses should be sufficient for an HOA.

DJ, Are you getting us on Google Earth???? How did you know that I have more shoes than Imelda Marcos. Kidding aside, you are probably right. One of each, dress, hiking, sneakers and filp flops would probably do me for the whole trip.

Here is the rub. To actually change the covenant would typically take a 2/3 approval from your membership. It can be a huge burden and you may not be able to get the people to go along with it.

But the Board often has the authority to change the design guidelines. And thus they can write in what you mentioned without going through getting a 2/3 majority sign off.

As for the dealing with longer parking on a case by case basis, chances are they have the authority. Simply look for any wording granting them the power of a variance.

I don't know these people, but it could well be that they are trying to be reasonable people. They don't want a flood of people pushing to park their RV out front. But they realize that something may happen where one person really does have a reason. And they will take into consideration such matter when it happens. They don't want this to be the rule, they want it to be possible.

(Then again they could be jerks who will grant their best buddies exceptions. But you have the power to vote them out.)