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JoeH5 (Kentucky)
Posts: 1
Posted:
We live in a small rural development with about 50 homes on 1 acre sites. The developer did not and will not provide or organize a HOA prior to selling lots. Our restrictions are basic and acceptable to all. The problem we are facing is future maintenance issues and of course, a few that do not follow guidelines. We are starting a HOA to assist in payment for farm fence painting, entrance maintenance, common area mowing, and enforcement issues. We have a significant majority of the property owners who are interested and willing to participate. Our initial discussions are to develop an agreement to make the HOA binding and mandatory, after the Owner executes a contract and files with the County Clerk.

I am looking for a good example of a contract for property owners to execute and also comments from those concerning mandatory HOA or voluntary HOA. Not all will participate, but, over several years with a mandatory HOA, we believe most properties will ultimately agree to participate and lock in all for the future.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
I'm confused - has the developer turnover officially happened?
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Joe,

It definitely would be so much easier if the developer was willing to form the mandatory HOA. That way anyone buying a lot would know the HOA was in place and there would be no questions. One problem with a voluntary HOA is that not everyone will want to join so the expense of all of the maint. is left up to those who are willing to join. I would suggest contacting an attorney to find out if a 100% approval of homeowners would be required to form a mandatory HOA. I believe there was a ruling in VA stating this; however, different states have different laws. I know there have been several cases here in AZ where a voluntary assn was turned into a mandatory assn w/o a 100% vote of the members. I think at least one of these cases was being contested but I don't know what the outcome was.

Once you have the approval of the required number of homeowners you need to form a committee to draft the gov. docs. Check with the State Corporation Commission (or whatever agency handles incorporation) to find out what the requirements are. Generally speaking you will have to draft Articles of Incorporation to incorporate as a nonprofit corp and also draft a set of bylaws. You may need to amend the declaration to include provisions on assessments and architectural control, to name a few. Actually, you may want to consult with an attorney just to make certain nothing is left out.
RobertR1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 5,164
Posted:
Joe,
In addition to the answer received, I suppose Kentucky is not much different than any state and you will have to form some kind of a not for profit company and get licensed by the state. You have to fololow the requirements to do that, in addition, you will need a set of HOA documents that follow the state statute if Kentucky has one.

It it were me, I would go to another similar community like you all, and ask them for their requirements. If you could go to a couple, you could save some time and effort and maybe pick up some idea about lawyers, etc, for surely you are going to need a legal way of establishing the Corporation.
MaryN (Virginia)
Posts: 125
Posted:
Please contact an attorney who specializes in HOA law. We are involved in a law suit because our BOD tried to convert our subdivision into a mandatory POA with a majority vote changing the CCR's. The judge in the lower court told the BOD that they couldn't convert without a 100% vote of the property owners. We are headed to the circuit court later this month..because they appealed. The NC Supreme Court has ruled it takes a 100% vote. The VA Supreme Court has ruled that certain documents must be filed in the land use office for an association to be a mandatory association. Those docs are the deeds which would mention the the HOA/POA and giving them the expressed responsibility to collect dues and maintain common property. Also, a doc where the developer specifically turns over the responsibility to the HOA/POA. I'm not a lawyer. If an attorney who specialized in HOA/POA law was consulted consulted 2 years ago..a great deal of money, and time would have been put to much better use.
Mary N
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
I have news for most of the previous posters, once the land is sold the developer can not make a unilateral change to require the HOA. Their powers of unilateral change are quite limited and even at that it might be challenged in court since it goes against every grain of our economy.

The horse has left this barn. While that may not be what you want to hear, it is probably too late to make a mandatory HOA. I would suggest you consider snubbing those who refuse to help maintain the neighborhood instead.
DJ1 (Ontario)
Posts: 798
Posted:
Kirk is 100% right and that is exactly what happened to us. The developer never registered CCR's on the first ~34 homes he sold but did on the remainder ~80. That is why we and many others now live in a subdivision surrounded by HOA homes but we aren't bound by the same rules. Makes for interesting living.

Back to the OP though, perhaps you can clarify what appear to be conflicting statements,

"Our restrictions are basic and acceptable to all."

"The problem we are facing is future maintenance issues and of course, a few that do not follow guidelines."

If rules are acceptable to me I would be following them so how is it that they are acceptable to ALL, yet a few do not follow them?
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DJ1 on 09/11/2008 4:27 PM
Kirk is 100% right and that is exactly what happened to us. The developer never registered CCR's on the first ~34 homes he sold but did on the remainder ~80. That is why we and many others now live in a subdivision surrounded by HOA homes but we aren't bound by the same rules. Makes for interesting living.

Back to the OP though, perhaps you can clarify what appear to be conflicting statements,

"Our restrictions are basic and acceptable to all."

"The problem we are facing is future maintenance issues and of course, a few that do not follow guidelines."

If rules are acceptable to me I would be following them so how is it that they are acceptable to ALL, yet a few do not follow them?

DJ,

Some properties have CCRs but no HOA. These CCRs are enforced by the property owners, usually through small claims court. I think that is the case here -- there are CCRs in place, but no HOA. Some members want to form a mandatory HOA to maintain the common areas and enforce the CCRs.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
Mary,

I agree with what you are saying. But a mandatory HOA is by its very nature an additional burden to the land. And they are seeking to add this burden after the sale of the land. That goes against the very grain of a contact for sale. And while some states have allowed for this type of action to take place, I suspect many others would not allow this to take place and hold that to increase the burden would require the acceptance of said burden by every land owner. The removal of a burden is a much easier bar (though a high one all the same).

While I understand the concept of fairness in that everyone who benefits should pay for maintenance, you also need to look at why some people chose to buy there. There are people who are looking for new homes that do not have a mandatory HOA. And then to push this on them after the sale is underhanded.

Even if I would otherwise join an HOA, I would contribute to a fund to prevent the formation of a mandatory HOA covering any lot I own without one currently.

Please note that nothing would keep the voluntary HOA from enforcing covenants. If it took a single owner to court and prevailed then it would become well known that they mean business.

Part of the issue is that many HOAs (as with many other organizations) is feature creep. Today they simply want to maintain a fence and enforce obvious violations of the covenants. Tomorrow they want to approve projects before they start. And down the road they want to create rules that were not anywhere close to covered in the original covenants.
GeorgerwilliamsW (Indiana)
Posts: 975
Posted:
Mary,

I know of no state in which small claims courts have jurisdiction regarding deed restrictions.

As part of my research, I have studied small claims court jurisdictions in many states, particularly the Midwest. Small claims courts are courts of equity.

Would you cite your source that supports your statement, "These CCRs are enforced by the property owners, usually through small claims court." I would like to check it out.

DJ1 (Ontario)
Posts: 798
Posted:
GeorgeW, the ccr's here have a clause that says the CCR's can be enforced by the HOA OR any homeowner...but I'm not sure how that would actually work.

Mary, The contradiction or potential conflict I see in the OP was IF the rules are acceptable to ALL then you'd think they would be followed by ALL. IF some aren't following the "guidelines" that makes me think they are NOT acceptable to ALL.

If everyone was happy with a situation it would be easier to get agreement for a mandatory HOA.
GeorgerwilliamsW (Indiana)
Posts: 975
Posted:
We have the same language in our declaration of covenants.
    "Violation or threatened violation of these covenants and restrictions shall be grounds for an action by the Declarant and Association, any person or entity having any right, title or interest in the Real Estate (or any part thereof), or any person or entity having any right, title or interest in a Lot which is now or hereafter made subject to the Declaration, and all persons or entities claiming under them, against the person or entity violating or threatening to violate any such covenants or restrictions."


In Hoosierland any homeowner may file a lawsuit for injunctive relief or damages to enforce the covenants. It would have to be in a county superior court, not a small claims court.

This comes back to the notion that often when a issue affects only two(or a limited number) homeowners, the association may find it advisable to allow the homeowners to duke it out among themselves. I don't think it is wise for an association board to take on the role of covenant police unless there is a significant issue for the entire community.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
George,

Perhaps the venue is superior court rather than small claims court. However, the point I was making is that when there are CCRs governing the property, but no HOA to enforce them, each individual property owner has the right to enforce them by bringing a court action against the violator. In fact, that is the only way to enforce the CCRs when there is no HOA.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KirkW1 on 09/12/2008 7:24 AM
Mary,

I agree with what you are saying. But a mandatory HOA is by its very nature an additional burden to the land. And they are seeking to add this burden after the sale of the land. That goes against the very grain of a contact for sale. And while some states have allowed for this type of action to take place, I suspect many others would not allow this to take place and hold that to increase the burden would require the acceptance of said burden by every land owner. The removal of a burden is a much easier bar (though a high one all the same).


Kirk,

I agree with you, too! IMO, it should take a 100% vote to turn a voluntary HOA into a mandatory one. As I said I believe there is a court case here in AZ that has yet to be decided. Another poster from VA stated that State's court of appeals ruled that a 100% vote of the members is required. IMO, this is much different than amending the CCRs which normally does not require a 100% vote of the members.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
As a note, there is nothing to prevent a voluntary HOA from taking enforcement action against violations of the covenants.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KirkW1 on 09/12/2008 4:39 PM
As a note, there is nothing to prevent a voluntary HOA from taking enforcement action against violations of the covenants.

Kirk,

Actually this happened here in AZ. The voluntary HOA brought suit against a non-member of the HOA for having a clothesline in his back yard. The HOA won the case!

In many instances there are CCRs binding the property but no HOA; not voluntary or mandatory. I've lived in three such neighborhoods and owned property in a fourth.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
When I was a teen my parents owned property with CC&Rs and no HOA. But shortly after I an HOA was formed because of an attempt to violate the covenants. In this case all the lots were 10 acres lots. One wanted to put in a pig processing plant. This would have violated a no pigs clause and a no industry clause (being in a rural area it specifically name animal processing). As it was, things were stopped at zoning. The zoning board said they had nothing to do with covenants. But my dad pointed out that the vast majority of owners were there not wanting the zoning change as well.

After that, they formed a group to be ready for the next challenge. I don't know if it ever moved beyond a loose coalition. But it was in the formative stages when my dad sold to move.

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