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AlbertC (New Jersey)
Posts: 15
Posted:
I am a new Board member. I was under the impression before running and after reading CAI expert articles that once elected I would be privy to any and all documents of the corporation, financial, personell contracts, vendor contracts, community maintainance work logs, committee minutes and any other documents of the community in order to perform in due dillagence to the position of board member. Again I was under the impression that I was now one of the top echelon and it is my duty to understand everything possible about the organization. My question is, can the board by majority, pass a resolution to impede your duty by having every request for these documents to review, or copy for farther reference, to be brought before the Board for approval. Put another way, can a motion be passed that you have to go before the rest of the board to request to see a document.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Why would you want to see Committee minutes? Committees report to the Board, anyway.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 7,043
Posted:
Albert,

If you have been elected to the board by the members and are a voting member of the board, then you should be privy to all records of the assn. IMO, you should not have to have your request for certain docs (unless they are confidential) approved by the board. Does the board give a reason for this procedure? All members of the board should receive a copy of the board minutes and financil statements. All contracts and insurance policys should be reviewed by the board as a whole. What other records do you want to see or have copies of?
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Albert,
Read your By-laws and your state's Nonprofit Act. One or both will probably allow any member to have reasonable access to the Corporation's records for viewing and copying of most items. Be aware there can be a cost involved so be selective and ask for only necessary items. If the Board passess a resolution which is in conflict with these documents then that resolution is not enforecable.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
The Board can only limit the access of another Board member if the by-laws allow such a move. The first place to look is your by-laws. Typically a Board member has unfettered access to all information in the corporation. There are exceptions and those typically involve having a Board of Trustees and Board of Directors. In those cases the Trustees have a little more power and responsibility. But the difference is very narrow.

having said all of that, your whole question raises more questions in my mind. Like what are you looking for? And did you bring an ax to grind? Quite honestly, the only confidential documents I can imagine you needing regular access to would be account histories as you have a vote concerning an owner. And at that time, the entire history should be before you at any rate.
PatrickH (California)
Posts: 204
Posted:
Hi Albert,

Sounds totally bizzare to me. All the HOAs documents and records should be available to the Board members. I couldn't imagine the Treasurer needing the Board's approval every month to see the bank statements and financial documents.

Stuff like the financials, work logs, repair reports, committee information, should all be openly discussed at every Board meeting.

Things like contracts would normally be discussed at meetings when they come up for review, but someone should have copies of the current contracts and Board mebers should have access to them.
AlbertC (New Jersey)
Posts: 15
Posted:
I would like to reestablish my question. There seems to be some confusion. First, I am a newly elected director, one of seven. I am one of the top ā€œHeadsā€. There is none higher except the membership. With all respect, to ask me what do I want with any documents has no relevance on my question. If they are confidential, are they confidential from the head’s of the organization? Who is higher to deny them? As far as why do I want to review committee minutes, remember I am new and I want to see what their work is all about for many reasons, financial, need of volunteers, or just to familiarize myself with community organizations. Contract’s and other work logs are not discussed at every meeting, many of them are already in force and would not even be discussed but as a new board member it is my responsibility to know what is in force and the provisions of the contract’s. When a comment is made that I will have to pay for copying, it leads me to wonder if my message was clear. As a member of the board, on company business, there is no charge. I’m not speaking as a member but as a director with an elected duty. Please don’t take this offensively, I am only trying to present my issue. I thought that it was a question that would have a very direct answer.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
When you came unto the Board, there were already contracts in force, committees meeting, making decisions and requesting Board approval, a long history of financial doings, and many other actions of the corporation were going on (you didn't mention if you had a MC.) Catching up on Board business can be a lot like trying to jump a ride on a speeding truck.

As a Member, you should have had the Annual Financial Report, and a copy of the minutes of the Annual meetings.

As a new Board member, you should have gotten a packet of info - all the paperwork that is routinely discussed at the meetings - plus copies of the bylaws, CCRS, Rules and Regulations, etc. The secretary would have the minutes of the meetings for you to review if you did not attend meetings. The last financial report is the one that you can use to begin your influence on the Board.

Most Board members select a certain field of interest to concentrate on, or are asked by the president to be on a committee because that Board member has some kind of expertise in that area. For example, if you have a business background, perhaps the Financial Committee would be a good fit. If you are in construction, perhaps the CCRs would be of interest. Each Board member brings something to the Board in order to help the other members in making decisions. I'd suggest that you pick an area where you'd like to work towards having some influence.

While it's necessary for you to know there ARE contracts, I don't think it's necessary for you to have each and every one in hand. The previous board members OK'ed them, and when they are up for review, THEN your input would be needed. Or if there is a problem with the service, then the contract could be discussed with the entire board, and probably referred to a committee for further study.

JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
There are always two sides to any story.

We have heard what Albert would like us to hear.

I would love to hear the side of the remaining Board members and WHY they would take the steps Albert has claimed they have to prevent his getting ALL the Board's records.

In 21+ years serving on our Board now as President for 5 I have never had any new Board member take the sort of action Albert seems to be asking for.

Why as a new Board member would you demand copies of all the documents mentioned?

I would think learning your role as a Board member would be more then enough.

Something just doesn't sound right to me.

Perhaps, it is the remaining Board members that now have a problem.....
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
SusanW1 - You wrote to AlbertC, "While it's necessary for you to know there ARE contracts, I don't think it's necessary for you to have each and every one in hand. The previous board members OK'ed them, and when they are up for review, THEN your input would be needed. Or if there is a problem with the service, then the contract could be discussed with the entire board, and probably referred to a committee for further study.".

As a Board member with a fiduciary duty it is incumbent upon a Board member to have access to as much information as possible so that his/her vote will be as informed as possible. The truth is that ALL association members should have access to as much information as their little hearts desire, so long as it's not a personal/sensitive/or pending legal matter. The Board should welcome a Board member that cares enough to review the materials. Review in advance will allow for perspective BEFORE there is a problem. Or maybe even some input for fine tuning a contract mid-stream before a problem occurs.

Waiting with baited breath to see how you or anyone else can argue otherwise.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Gerald - you said: "Or maybe even some input for fine tuning a contract mid-stream before a problem occurs."

Sorry - I call that micro-managing.

As a board member, I would need to kmow that there IS a contract in force. If there is a problem, it can be a board issue to bring it out and re-evaluate. At budget time, it might be discussed and reevaluated.

If it is a committee decision, then THEY will do the vetting and the board makes the final decision.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

At budget time, see if it's broke.
AlbertC (New Jersey)
Posts: 15
Posted:
When I read some of these responses to my question I become very perplexed. So many try to change the question to meet their personal circumstances, 29 years as a trustee, why do you want them, they should be brought up at board meetings, which are a few of the responses, but one of my favorites is about micro-managing, which I’ve been accused of. Let me define micro-managing and managing which I was elected to contribute to. Micro-manage:
(Manage with excessively detailed control of every part of a project), Manage: (Watch and direct). Micro managing is wrong; we have a MC to do this. To manage is right because we are elected to do this. Remember, no single one of us can act alone; we must act as a whole. Please forget all the rhetoric about my reasons; it has no relevance to the question. Either I am allowed to review any documents of the organization by right of duty as a director or I am not, by any other laws that you might direct me too. My bylaws do not address this. Now, just to bolster my position, in several responses that were made it seems to imply that what was done before, is to leave alone and flow with the board and don’t be disruptive. I don’t agree with that. Everything I have ever read says that if you are not happy with what is going on with your community, you should run for the board and try to bring things to your favor. (When I refer to my and I) I am talking for the people that elected me. My platform for running was based on what they want. I am trying to carry out their wishes.
Please read again what Gerald say's.
KirkW1 (Texas)
Posts: 1,665
Posted:
Albert,

First, I will agree with others that you (and all BOD members) should receive a book with most of the information you are requesting in a book. The book should have as a minimum:
  • copy of all governing documents including all amendments

  • copy of the current budget

  • copy of current contracts

  • contacts for other board members and management

  • membership list

I would think also you should get a monthly copy of the financial reports. This is perhaps the most sensitive part of your job since it entails (or should include) a list of every account receivable.

It probably would be best to have a copy of each meeting's minutes included in the book for the last year. And committee reports should also be in there as well. And no you should not have to pay for copied of any records you need to do your duty. And no, you should not have to justify every request for information.

Now having said that, i will go back and say that it would appear at first blush (and this is only an appearance) that you might have come onto the Board with an ax to grind. You may not have and may indeed only be trying to get a very firm grasp of where your organization is coming from and going towards.

If you are indeed only trying to get to the root of all that is your organization great. If you have some ax to grind, I would respectfully ask that for the good of your association you set it aside at least for the first six months and then decide if it truely needs to be ground.

You may not have an ax to grind. And you may have one to grind that needs some grinding. We don't know. But often what is not said speaks louder then what is said. And right or wrong, you may have given other BOD members an impression of what you are about. Remember that you have one vote of seven. And to be effective you will need to be able to influence (and be influenced) by three others on a regular basis. You don't always have to agree. And I think it is best if a board doesn't always agree. But you do need to work with the other six people regardless of difference in opinion.
JeannieraeO (California)
Posts: 27
Posted:
I'm the President of my Board and I'm happy to give all of my Board Members any and all documents regarding the management of the Association. Of course you want to see the current contracts. I would be impressed with your diligence. All of my board members have a board book with all of the relevant papers. I applaud your industry.

I only question your description of yourself as in the top echelon of the structure. The Board is there to serve the association. This is not about rank. It's about getting the work done. That may be the issue in your board. If people are getting some sense of importance by serving on the board, there can be some gate-keeping in order to hold on to power. That can be bad news. In that situation, I would have a private conversation with the board members who are holding on to information and see what their resoning is. Often you can get more cooperation by being a nice, unthreatening type who is truly concerned with issues rather than pushing your way in.

Good luck.
JosephW (Michigan)
Posts: 882
Posted:
Go back to Roger's answer - your state's non-profit corporations act should allow you to see whatever you want to see. The ONLY things that would be excluded is if you were in litigation with the board, a board member or the association, and then only the documents and discussions pertaining to that, or if you have a conflict-of-interest, (i.e. a relative is bidding on a contract with the association - you shouldn't see the bids nor vote on the contract). You have a right to see anything and everything you ask for. You don't need to give a reason - your fiduciary responsibilty covers all questions. There should be no charge for copies, as it is for the business of the association. You were elected to govern, and whatever you need, in terms of background information or papers, to do that effectively, should be provided.

Before any vote to limit your ability to get the information, put a motion out to get a written opinion from counsel, as to it's legality. IMO anything less than full access could require you to breach your fiduciary responsibilty by having you vote on issues you may not have all the information you need to make a full and informed decision.

Even if someone's motives MAY be to cause problems or possibly be disruptive, if an elected board member requests to see documents - they should be provided! Motives are not an issue -

Joe

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