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JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
We're a new association-- 2 downtown buildings with a central courtyard. One street level unit is going to be a Mexican restaurant. They have submitted plans for their exhaust system and we think a different exhaust location might be better. Has anyone dealt with restaurant exhaust, odors, etc creating problems for residents? How much of an issue has this been and what's your experience and advice? Thanks.
JC3
Posts: 290
Posted:
Restuarant exhaust could cause serious respiratory problems for your residents.
I don't have time now to do the research, but I will tell you for my own self, that within a week or so after I quit frying food that it was easier for me to breathe. I don't know if I kept that info or not. It has to do with the oils and chemicals that get into the air that we breathe.
I suggest that you do the research, get the information, and going through the proper channels, request a safer method of exhaust, even if it means they have to somehow capture the residue (internally or externally)
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Ever driven by a Burger King?

Insist that you be in the loop as far as their building plan is concerned. This could be a huge issue, not only for health reasons, but for aesthetic. Your property values will drop if the building has that "deep friied" smell.

P.S. Why are they mixing commercial/food property with residential, anyway?
JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
In the downtown condo buildings, all or nearly all of them-- even the superelite ones- have restaurants and all kinds of other commercial units at street level. Easy access is part of why people live downtown here. (The commercial units here are part of the Association along with individual unit owners.) Hotels also have food preparation within their buildings, of course. Since lots of buildings combine living units with food preparation, there are obviously ways to deal with this. We have lots of information and plans from the restaurant based on what they plan to do. The exhaust scrubber system is an investment of about 200K for them and they are being very cooperative in providing the info we've asked for. And sure, we know it could be a big quality of life/health issue. There is a possible problem of the exhaust opening into an area where maybe 10% of the time it might blow into the courtyard. Usually there is good wind movement, but during Santa Anas and some other weather conditions, the wind is quiet.

So that's why I was asking if anyone has had experience in planning or evaluating exhaust systems or tried to deal with bad situations after they exist? We'd be glad to prevent rather than fix problems!

Joan
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
Forget the 'scrubber' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The exhaust duct needs to be run at least 7' above the roof line ... externally !!!!!!!

This may even be a code requirement ..... if not, what do you think will happen when the 'scrubber' is not perfectly maintained?

The lawyers will have a field day with this issue unless the duct actually discharges above the roof line!
JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Actually, discharge above the roofline isn't a requirement here and isn't done in any buildings that we can find. And as I said, nearly all the downtown buildings are mixed use. I guess I shouldn't have said scrubber-- the system has multiple different pollution control components internal and external to address smoke, grease, odor and other particulates and meets all local and California code requirements. From all we can determine, the restaurant has gone over and above and there's nothing more that can be required technologically. The company is Gaylord Industries and the proposed system includes about all their components.

Our concern is whether to try to evaluate how big a problem the exhaust is likely to be and whether to try to insist that the vent be moved from one side of the unit to the other. On the more sheltered side, whatever odor or heat are emitted may be stuck a few days of the year and possibly bother more people above the courtyard. If the vent is on the more open street side, the vent will be closer to some balconies all the time. There are no perfect solutions and everyone knew that there would be commercial units in the building. There are restrictions on what can go into the retail spaces (no tattoo parlors, for example) but restaurants are allowed. At this point, we don't know whether this will be, on a scale of 1 to 10, a level 8 problem or a 2 or what!

Has anyone actually been in a building with current state of the art smoke/odor/grease/vent control technology who knows how effective all this really is?

Joan
PaulM (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 1,347
Posted:
JoanF: Is your Board working with the local officials to oversee this problem? You did state the restaurant people are meeting all codes and requirements. I would think you would want to hear from the officials re your concerns and only a professional could allay your fears or confirm them.

It would seem when purchasing into this arrangement of commercial/residential units, these concerns should be made clear to the folks living above the commercial units. Perhaps you could ask someone from the overseeing development officials to come out and speak at one of your community meetings to explain all to you.
JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Actually, we have all the technical and regulatory information we need, the developer comes to all the HOA meetings and has cooperated fully and we've had input from all the professionals involved. We're in the San Diego East Village Ballpark district directly across the street from Petco Park and everyone here has always known the building is "mixed use"-- every building in the neighborhood is. Most of us came here to be in the middle of SD's great downtown and have all this cool stuff in easy walking distance. So all I was looking for is some on-the-ground experience with what is actually emitted from state-of-the-art restaurant exhaust systems. There's no perfect solution and while it would be nice to have only boutiques and offices in the retail space, I don't think we ever expected that. I guess we'll just have to use our best judgment as to whether to push for a vent relocation. :-)

Joan
JohnB7 (South Carolina)
Posts: 176
Posted:
CODE is the absolute MINIMUM requirement and not necessarily even close to good or best practice.

Would you like to live in a dwelling which "meets the MINIMUM requirments for human occupation"?

You had best hope this proposed exhaust goes far far beyond minimum code requirement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JoanF (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
I'd think that the description of all the research and discussion and investigation I've been describing that we have done would indicate that we're not just HOPING anything!! We have worked with the designers all along and are satisfied with their responses and that the installation is in fact state-of-the-art. The building was designed to be mixed use, because of our location it's always been very likely that a restaurant would be in this space, and as an association we are not fighting that or angry or anything else negative. We have members on the board who are quite knowledgeable about many of the issues involved. The remaining question is about how such systems may work in real life in relation to the exhaust placement possibilities. I was hoping someone might have current experience with this. Maybe it's just too particular an issue and I'd need to talk specifically to people in mixed-use buildings like ours with newly installed restaurant exhaust systems-- not a very big group!

I am a little puzzled why some of the responses to my question have seemed to look for negative stuff where it doesn't exist. Is it the way I presented the situation, or common on this board, or ?????

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Joan:

I have zero experience with this, except for ventless systems over a grill and fryer. My suggestion would be to visit other buildings and their management and grill them on what they like and don't like.

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