What evidence does the board have to provide when fining a member for a violation?

Started by ShirleyC14 • 11 replies • 210 views

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ShirleyC14 (California)
Posts: 3

Posted:

What evidence does the board have to provide when fining for a violation?

ArtB1 (Florida)
Posts: 98

Posted:

A photo is best evidence

TimB4 (Virginia)
Posts: 21,005

Posted:

As others have said, I prefer photos. Perhaps marked up showing the area that is bad.

That said, realistically, the Board doesn't have to show any evidence (they should, but are not required to).

Photos lets everyone see what the complainant saw.

If challenged, proof would have to be provided to the court, so I think it's silly not to provide proof when telling the member that something is in violation.

We had an issue once where a fascia board along a roof line was not painted when the house was painted.

The Board told the owner, the owner told the painter, the painter said it had been painted.

This went around and around a couple of times until I took the time to walk to the home and take a picture.

Now the owner saw what we saw and had proof for the painter (who apparently never looked).

So, photos are the best proof.

BillD16 (Texas)
Posts: 980

Posted:

It’s not really evidence, but the violation should include a reference to whatever rule or covenant was broken.

HOA Board ex-President
Austin, Texas USA

“You can’t put too much water in a nuclear reactor”

ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 1,413

Posted:

It depends.

If push came to shove and a dispute over an alleged violation went to court, the courts want to see a certain amount of "due process."

When the governing documents are not clear about what to do, and there is room for discretion, be reasonable and fair in exercising this discretion.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,968

Posted:

Depends on the violation and everyone's already given you a decent blueprint. Use photos (time and date stamped), a citation of what community rule and/or CCR was violated, and proof of previous violation notices.

You might also include things like design standards (e.g. approved height, color and materials for a fence) - and those should have been approved via a board resolution during an open board meeting, and then distributed to the homeowners with an effective date. A reminder of where requests should be directed (simply telling any random board member you want to build a fence isn't enough) will also do.

Take a look at your processes. If they aren't clear, you'll need to work on that. Pay attention to timelines - are they reasonable? You might need to look at that as well. When developing a rule enforcement policy, boards should approach it with the goal of preventing drama before it starts - but if it ensues anyway, you need something that will stand up in court.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

TerriS6 (California)
Posts: 3,270

Posted:

If SB1007 passes this year, in addition to changing assessment cap without member vote from 20% to 8%, this will be required: "This bill would require the association to make any physical evidence used to determine a violation of the governing documents has occurred available to the member at least 5 business days before the hearing or deadline for the member’s response, if the association seeks to impose a monetary penalty against a member for violation of the governing documents, as provided."

DeanJ (Ohio)
Posts: 1,789

Posted:

What is the nature of the violation? Photos work well for most violations, but if this is a personal conduct violation more than one witness from more than one property who is willing to provide a written statement works.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,968

Posted:

Dean has a good point. It's one thing to have time and date stamped photos if someone parked in the wrong spot or put up an unapproved fence, but if it's a dispute between neighbors, that can get tricky. Even the time and date stamp of the photo(s) can be manipulated (on most cell phones, there's an edit feature that allows you to change it and then you'd probably have to grab the phone itself and have an expert check the metadata).

Witnesses are very helpful, but they can also be manipulated or accidentally (or accidentally on purpose) switch around facts of the story. Written statements can be a good place to start, provided everyone knows they must sign and date the document and the information they provide might be used in a legal proceeding (that may get them to think twice about lies and damned lies)

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

EliK1 (Texas)
Posts: 10

Posted:

Shirley, I'd separate two questions: what evidence supports the allegation, and what material the owner gets to see before responding. A file can look complete to the board while still leaving the owner guessing.

For a practical hearing packet, pair each allegation with the exact restriction and the evidence supporting it. Distinguish firsthand observations from somebody repeating a complaint. Let the owner point out factual errors and submit their own material, then record the finding on each allegation and the reason for it. A decision letter should explain the outcome, not simply say "fine upheld." If you're the owner, ask in writing for the specific rule and the evidence being relied on.

That's good practice, not a statement of the legal minimum. The exact notice and hearing rules depend on California's statute and your CC&Rs. The bill Terri mentioned would require physical evidence to be made available before the hearing; check whether it was actually enacted, and when it takes effect, before relying on it.

— Eli

MarkM19 (California)
Posts: 1,455

Posted:

So, this is a very timely topic for our HOA board. We implemented a fireworks policy in our community in 2025 after a couple of major incidents. While we were debating it at 2 separate meetings one owner was very vocal about opposition to the new rule. Many owners were very supportive of this new rule, and the amendment was approved and reviewed by our attorney and filed with the county.

On July 4 of this year that same owner who objected was confronted by a neighbor that lives on the next street over from him. This person had video of the confrontation and pictures of the 10 aerial fireworks canisters still in the street when she tried to drive past. This person also had a large group of people on his driveway with a party going on. The board reviewed the footage and decided on a fine less than the maximum fine as a warning. He was invited to an executive session after disputing the fine. Once again, the board keeps the fine in place on a 3 to 2 vote. He is now saying we do not have irrefutable evidence that he shot fireworks. Our rule states that the accuser most likely will need to provide irrefutable evidence, so he is using our words against us.

Wondering what other board members would do in this situation?

ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 1,413

Posted:

"Irrefutable" sounds like the standard of "beyond a reasonable doubt."

Maybe a nit: I do not see that he is using the board's words against the board. He just has a different opinion on whether the evidence is "irrefutable."

Do your HOA's covenants have verbiage about unsafe activities on either common areas (the streets?) or on lots? Assuming yes, then it seems to me the fireworks are a big safety and liability issue.

I say: Continue with the fine. If the guy wants to sue, then see what your attorney (and insurer?) suggest. Because of the risks here, I think it is possible this is a battle that is worth the money.

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