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LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
I own a condo in a community, they sent a letter saying they will put a lien on my property in 10 days if I don't pay the $350 due.
For various odd reasons, I don't feel I should have to pay the $350 (or put it in an escrow account). Is it true they can't put a lien on the property until the fees reach $1200? They can't put a lien on my property for $350, right?
I'm in Arizona.
THANKS
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
LisaW2 - I doubt you are going to find any sympathizers here for your not paying the $350.00 due. Even if you provide details that evidence the amount is being levied unfairly. Let me ask you this, are you willing to risk your credit and perhaps your home, or perhaps jeopardize the future sale of your home for a measly $350.00??

Be that as it may, please explain what exactly the $350.00 dues are for, this may assist us in providing you some direction.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Lisa,
RIGHT!! Your home can be liened for non payment of dues.

So why aren't you paying them? It is not up to you whether you feel that you should or should not. It is what is required of you for living within an association. Who do you think pays for all of the outside care and maintenances around your condo? I could go on with this list for some time but I won't. It is your responsibility to pay. If you have a gripe with the HOA, then you take care of it thru the proper channels but you still keep up to date with your assessments. Sorry!
PaulM (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 1,347
Posted:
LisaW2: Since you have not posted what your 'various odd reasons' are, let me ask is the $350 the amount of your assessment fee due, or is it a fine? It would help greatly if you would approach the Board to learn of a payment plan and/or if there can be discussion or hearing in this situation, if warranted.

LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
I didn't want to explain it all, but I guess I will have to-

A couple purchased an apartment complex (borrowing $2.5 million dollars to do so) and renovated it and sold off the units individually. We purchased one of those condos. We were given clear title, and have been paying our mortgage on time, every month. Free HOA dues for one year were included. The one year just ended in Jan.

The problem is, besides the original sellers being jerks to our tenants and everyone else's tenants, there are 2 reasons we do not want to pay the HOA dues:
1. They do not use the HOA money for what they are supposed to. They don't pay the trash service, so dumpsters don't get collected. They don't pay their gas bill, so no one in the entire complex has hot water for 2 weeks straight. They don't pay any landscaping service, so the grass goes weeks without getting cut, becoming severely overgrown and ugly. Ants overtake the sidewalks and pool area. Trash bins around the complex are overflowing. And the pool, in the middle of the complex, was condemned by the city because they didn't maintain it- it became green and smelly and was growing things.

2. The people we bought the condo from didn't pay back their original investors (2 separate groups). We were given clear title, put apparently there was some sort of forgery or photocopying of documents, and now both sets of original investors are trying to foreclose on US as well as every other homeowner in the complex. There are about 30 of us. We all have been paying our mortgages on time, and now none of us can sell or refi or anything. The Title Company is fighting the foreclosures in court, they don't want to pay. It's a huge mess.

This place has been a NIGHTMARE. The HOA president is the 21 year old daughter of the couple we purchased the condo from. They don't use the HOA money for what it's for, they're shady crooks and I don't want to give them a CENT.
LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
Also, I want to put the money in an escrow account instead, I don't know how to go about doing that. The $350 is 2 months worth of dues. I am willing to put the money in the escrow account every month, but I don't want to give it directly to these people who are the reason why we are in this mess with the foreclosure of the complex. Why would I give them any more money??!
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
LisaW2 - Reasons for your not paying are not compelling enough to warrant your holding back your fare share. If you don't pay than there's no chance the services will be ever be accomplished. Regardless as to your belief they are "shady crooks", and that you "don't want to give them a CENT". My suggestion is for you to pay the $350.00, and continue to pay what you owe. Consider working on getting new Board members (including yourself) to turn things around for the positive. Now, you can always take up the more important matter which is holding the existing Board in breach of it's fiduciary duty, and requirement to maintain the elements. For that you are going to need proof, and may even need an attorney. You should consider, as a first step before suit, to send a certified letter return receipt requested seeking an alternative dispute resolution meeting to privately discuss your grievances of the Board's activities.
LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
There is no board, it's only the 21 year old girl, that's it. I just want to know if she can really put a lien on for $350. I thought it had to be at least $1200. I'm trying to find this info in writing but I am having no luck.
If the condo is about to be foreclosed on or a settlement with the titlement company is reached to turn the condo back over to the original investors and our mortgage paid, I sure as hell aren't going to give them $350 right now.
JohnO6 (Georgia)
Posts: 424
Posted:
Lisa

As painful and boring as this might be, you need to sit down and read the declaration and bylaws of your condo association as the very first step.

You need to understand who has what obligation(s) to do what.
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Lisa,
I think that you and the other 29 unit owners should get together and get some legal counsul because the way that you are trying to fight all of these wrongs will not get you resolution. This sounds like it is a whole lot bigger than we here can fix for you. Good luck.
HaroldS (Arizona)
Posts: 906
Posted:
Lisa - If it is indeed valid dues or assessment, there is already an automatic lien on your unit until paid under Arizona statutes. Here's what it says about foreclosure - "(delinquent)...for a period of one year or in the amount of one thousand two hundred dollars or more, whichever occurs first." So yes, after being delinquent for one year they can foreclose on the $350. Look up Arizona Revised Statutes 33-1807 for the complete details. Harold
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
LisaW2 - Again, pay the back amount due. You owe it and won't have a leg to stand on when complaining about the services not provided when you are denying your contribution. I can't find anything about a minimum, don't know if one exists. I understand you have difficulty with your situation and feel for you but the basic concept of condo living is that all pay to fund their investments. Failure to pay jeopardizes everyone. Other than that, you need your own attorney or one to represent the group of 30 owners.
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
HaroldS - According to Lisa she had the first year waived, I wonder if that is in writing. If that is the case she can't get a lien until the amount due equals $1,200. If that's the case could you imagine what would occur if everyone in Lisa's condo didn't pay the $175.00 per month until the $1,200 past due amount is reached? Maybe that's what has occurred, maybe the owners were lied to being told they don't have to pay the first year, maybe that explains why the services aren't being fulfilled. Or maybe not. : )
HaroldS (Arizona)
Posts: 906
Posted:
Gerald - you aren't paying attention: In Arizona any HOA assessment is an automatic lien on the property until paid. No need to file a lien because it is already there. Foreclosure on that lien is another animal. An Hoa can foreclose on unpaid assessments but not until the total reaches $1,200 OR a lower amount owed is over one year delinquent. So there is no having to wait until the amount reaches $1,200. The waiting for this $350 is one year and then they can foreclose on the $350. They could foreclose after one year on a $25 delinquent assessment. Consequently, if your dues were $600 a month, and went unpaid for two months, foreclosure could begin immediately (after due process.) No waiting a year.
LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
The first year was waived for us, we have received two assessments, Jan 08 and Feb 08, so they're deliquent 1-2 months at most.
We do all have legal counsel, it is a very crazy situation! I found in the AZ laws where it says it has to reach $1200 first.
LisaW2 (Arizona)
Posts: 6
Posted:
OK I reread it and see that they can put a lien at any time, but cannot foreclose until the delinquent assessments reach $1200 or 1 year, whichever is first.
We are hoping the Title Company will make good on the Title Insurance policy soon, and return the property to the original investors, and pay us the $140K so we can just pay off the mortgage and be done with these people.
Almost all of the other homeowners do pay their monthly assessments, we all are in constant communication due to the saga of the criminals who sold us our condos.
GeraldT4
Posts: 1,022
Posted:
HaroldS - My "paying attention" yes, my "Not understanding" yes. Now I understand, thank you for your clarification, a more friendly way to phrase it and offer information.
GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829
Posted:
Even though any governing documents may read "an automatic lien" it is not duly recorded or holds any water until filed and recorded in the Clerk's office Register of Deeds.

If the HOA doesn't record the lien who would know when a Title search is done if it doesn't come up within the Counties records.

Even here in NC and when I operating my MC in NJ, the governing documents state it is an automatic lien; but it still has to be recorded.

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