Unruly neighbor

I am an HOA president. We have a neighbor who has been charged with stalking 2 against my daughter and I. He's been harassing me for 11 years. He did the same to the last president. He has no fines on his account only unpaid dues. Last night at our annual meeting he went upside down because our property mgmt guy would not let him record him before the meeting began. He called 911 and asked to have police come. He was raging so we called police because he's scary. The NCO against him expired in Jan this year. He's beyond scary. How can I get help from someone to get this to stop? It's constant! Any ideas would be much appreciated.

How do I do that? The police do not take any of this serious

It seems you now have 2 serious problems??? Neighbor/PD; I've always had best results talking IN PERSON to whoever. I'd try going to the Police Dept., show your documentation, and follow their advice. If they blow you off, go up the chain of command. Ellen's advice is always excellent but you might get lucky with talking face-to-face first?

I would have a pow wow with the HOA’s legal council and make a plan to combat this owner’s behavior. That would include reviewing the Idaho statutes for disorderly conduct, disrupting lawful meetings, and stalking and how the HOA should be working with law enforcement to have the law enforced on this owner.

The meeting would also include a review of the HOA’s authority to adopt regulations that would specifically address this owner’s conduct and applying monetary penalties.

Dean, our posts passed each other. Your 5:43 one gave me a chuckle. I've never seen an out-of-control person be intimidated with threats of fines. Oh my...how easy life could become...IF?????? This is an interesting topic.

Tim, I agree...it "shouldn't be an HOA issue"...but SAFETY is an HOA issue. One respondent felt she got no direction or support from her police.
This post has opened up a great topic about, unfortunately, an ALL TOO COMMON situation most communities eventually face. My heartburn churns to think our first resource
should be legal...unless it's for a cease/desist letter. I hope we hear more about local Police responses? Dean mentioned there needs to be a suicide issue...which is understandable. This probably varies with each city????

In Idaho, unpaid HOA fines can lead to a homeowner's property being placed under a lien, which, if not resolved, can ultimately result in foreclosure.

I located the Idaho state law that may help you. Codes: Section 18-7902 and Section 18-6710

Sure, this is a slow process. Fines are levied to correct behavior, not foreclose on property. But, if the behavior continues, the punishment eventually meets the crime. When you moved into an HOA, you agreed to have your behavior regulated to some extent.

As an owner in an HOA, you depend on owners who are willing to volunteer their time to make your community function. Owners purposely harass board member disrupt the function of the board and its officers.

Why do you want to allow an owner in your HOA to make life a living hell for the people who are giving you free services and at the same time is not remaining current on assessments? Do you let this continue until your HOA is in receivership because no one will put up with this BS and serve on the board?

The police are going to tell you their job is enforcing the law and that’s all. If someone wants to be a pain in your saddlebags, there is a lot of behavior they can engage in that does not break the law, but can make your life miserable as a board member.

Thats why speaking to the HOA attorney and adopting rules that establish boundary for bad behavior needs to be adopted. The attorney will aid the board in balancing reasonable and unreasonable behavior and enforceable rules.

Yes, safety is an issue - but it depends on your definition of "safety".

The HOA can and should properly maintain common elements so that people can use them safely.

It should get rid of man-made hazards.

The HOA can alert owners to possible issues.

And it can and should enforce the terms of the CC&Rs.

But the HOA has to be careful not to promise something it can't deliver or it risks liability.

The HOA can't protect people from crime. It can't prosecute anyone for criminal behavior - that's a job for the police and the courts. The HOA can lawyer up and go after someone who committed a crime against the HOA (eg. embezzlement or torching the clubhouse). But again law enforcement and the courts will be the ones to do the actual prosecuting. If an owner feels that they're not being heard by the police, that still doesn't make it an HOA problem. The HOA doesn't have the tools or authority to solve this.

Sadly, I believe that laws and societal norms are weapons in the hands of those who won't comply with them. The bad actors will do whatever they want, while those who have to deal with the bad actors are constrained in what they can do. It's a human problem, not an HOA problem. And I have no ideas on how to make humans better than they actually are.

My first question is "Is the behavior threatening?" I would err on the side of caution and assume yes, so I would call the police.

Once you deal with the immediate threat, you get into the details.

First detail: "Is this person a resident?" If no, then he is trespassing, and we'd have a different and easier solution.

If the person is a resident, then you need more information. I'd call the attorney at this point to alert them and to get some general guidance on how to navigate this.

My next questions would be "What do we know about the person?" and "Who decided this person is crazy?" Do you have contact information for a family member? How are the local mental health services: plentiful or non-existent?

There is a wide spectrum of behavior that many people would view as "crazy" - and it's definitely not true that you know it when you see it. Medications - or lack of if you need them - can cause behavior that does look "crazy".

Mental illness in an HOA is a challenge and a pain in the butt. Boards have to balance the rights of owners not to be harassed or threatened when they're in the community along with the rights of an owner who may be suffering from an illness. Owners don't lose their rights if they're behaving badly (except for routine stuff like losing access to the pool if they keep bringing alcohol with them). The HOA could end up being sued by both parties if the situation isn't handled correctly. This is above the board's paygrade - but it's their job nonetheless. (They wonder why we burn out...)

The real answer is that the answer is dependent on the facts of an individual situation, which means generalizing may be unhelpful. I think erring on the side of caution is always smart: so in the case of someone harassing kids, call the police and call the attorney. I would do this even if the harasser isn't obviously unhinged - because who harasses kids? Approaching someone who is being aggressive is dumb - you don't know who is carrying a gun, and you could easily escalate the situation. The police are trained to de-escalate, so let them do the job they're trained for.

Cathy, per usual...you share excellent advice. IMHO, we've gone full circle with our thoughts/experiences on this initial. Poster described 11 years of harrassment and still alive to share with us. I suggested contact Police for Mental Health. Most agreed not a Police issue. But also not an HOA issue-lol! I'm in total agreement that most definitions cloud the issue: crazy, threatening behavior, resident vs renter, vs visitor, vs homeless? If a child is being harrassed, the issue seems to be more alarming(IMHO)?
Short of having a mobile MRI + law degree, I'm still in awe such a common event doesn't have a simple remedy. Who to notify...and select your words carefully seem to be in the clouds, floating above??? And to add to this SNAFU expect hidden weapons, security cameras...and "it's not my problem." I appreciate the beauty and community of my HOA.
Do non-Hoa/Coa get Police support?

So....does this person--who sounds like a lving nightmare for you, Cyndi, also attend Board meetings? Or are board meeting closed to owners in ID?

Read my first post.