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RichardM29 (Virginia)
Posts: 43
Posted:
We've established standards for quorums in our Bylaws, and are preparing to reduce the required physical/proxy attendees due to difficulties in the past in securing a quorum at the annual meeting and some special meetings.

In looking at various forms of proxy votes on the internet, I cam across one that (more or less) states: "If you do not attend in person, or transmit your proxy vote, your vote will be cast by the Board of Directors."

Does this not remove any need for a quorum? Is it legal?
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 1,334
Posted:
For one thing, I think the wording limits the right of owners to abstain.

In general I think the wording invites litigation.

Lack of quorum is not a big deal. It just means that many owners are fine with the status quo, and the directors currently in office continue in office. If any director does not wish to continue, he/she just resigns. The incumbent board appoints someone to fill the vacant seat.

The board sure as heck better not try this trick with a vote on an amendment to the Declaration. This is because Declarations have other wording with which to contend on the subject of how amendments happen.

If the HOA is trying to get enough votes for an amendment, they should not do it merely via an owners' meeting anyway.
RichardM29 (Virginia)
Posts: 43
Posted:
Actually, lack of a Quorum is a big deal. If at your annual meeting you are to approve a budget, elect new officers, or offer an amendment to the bylaws, a lack of a quorum means none of that gets done. Of course, there are usually fall back positions which subsequently lower the number comprising the quorum, but at least in our association, this reduced number isn't effective until a new meeting is called two weeks later. That rescheduling requires another first class mailing, etc.

If the wording I provided is ripe for litigation, I wonder what damages plaintiffs would claim.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
At the advice of our HOA's attorneys, our HOA members voted to eliminate any quorum requirement in our Bylaws except for recall elections. The respected CA HOA Law firm that publishes Davis-stirling.com also advises that HOAs eliminate quorum requirements.

You might check that website to see their approach to the topic.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 1,334
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardM29 on 02/27/2025 5:26 PM
Actually, lack of a Quorum is a big deal. If at your annual meeting you are to approve a budget, elect new officers, or offer an amendment to the bylaws, a lack of a quorum means none of that gets done.
I disagree.
Quote:
Posted By RichardM29 on 02/27/2025 5:26 PM
If the wording I provided is ripe for litigation, I wonder what damages plaintiffs would claim.
First, I said the wording invites litigation.

Second, injunctive relief is far more likely than an award of damages (money).
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
No, you still need a quorum. In our community, we also use proxies and they state you can either appoint someone to show up and vote for you, or the board president will cast the vote on your behalf. You still need a combination of proxies and homeowners who actually show up to make up the number required by your documents to hold the annual meeting. For example, ours require at least 10%, or 16 homeowners to hold an annual meeting. It's one vote per unit and we have five board members, so if they all show up, we'd need at least 11 homeowner to all show up, send proxies or a combination.

This year, I think I was the only homeowner who showed up. we still made quorum because a bunch of proxies were turned in. Some people own several units and they always fill them out and return them because they're investors who live out of town.

I have seen conversations on this website where some communities dropped quorums altogether and it seems to work for them. That may not be a big deal in a large community, but in a small one, that could be a recipe for disaster if the wrong people get in and stay in, committing all sorts of mayhem. that said, I think a 10 - 15% quorum for most communities works well for most meetings. If people want to attend, they will make the time to come.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/M/Member-Quorum

Shelia might be right for very small HOAs. Our annual meeting are much smoother with the elimination of all recommended below from our Bylaws. We also eliminated nominations form the floor.

"Eliminating Quorum"


“…No Benefit to Quorum. As most associations already know, requiring a quorum only causes aggravation and expense. Many owners will either sign blank proxies or send blank ballots to help meet quorum. That does not make for better elections. Forcing owners to vote may decrease the quality of elections if people don't care and simply vote for the first name on the ballot. People who care about the election should decide the outcome."

 "By eliminating quorum requirements for the election of directors, board elections become like all other elections at the municipal...levels. In other words, elections are determined by those who are interested enough to vote. This eliminates wasted time and money holding multiple meetings trying to achieve a quorum. The Davis-Stirling Act [Calif only] anticipates the removal of quorum requirements: 'A quorum shall be required only if so stated in the governing documents of the association or other provisions of law.' (Civ. Code § 5115(d).)"

Recommendation: In addition to eliminating quorum requirements for the election of directors, associations should consider eliminating cumulative voting and proxies.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardM29 on 02/27/2025 1:18 PM
We've established standards for quorums in our Bylaws, and are preparing to reduce the required physical/proxy attendees due to difficulties in the past in securing a quorum at the annual meeting and some special meetings.

In looking at various forms of proxy votes on the internet, I cam across one that (more or less) states: "If you do not attend in person, or transmit your proxy vote, your vote will be cast by the Board of Directors."

Does this not remove any need for a quorum? Is it legal?

So if the board call a special meeting at 9 pm on Christmas Eve and no one attends the board can vote all the shares?
RichardM29 (Virginia)
Posts: 43
Posted:
The Board can call for a meeting any time it wants, and lot owners are free to either attend or submit PROXY ballots.

In our case, we do not entertain votes on any issue that is not previously submitted to the BOD so it can be included on the published Agenda (or not). The "or not" means an issue was submitted, but it did not meet criteria, i.e. it was not legal. A recent example was a move by one lot owner to prohibit political signage. While a majority of residents might want to vote yes, our state law says it is allowable. So that was not included on the agenda. Everyone submitting a proxy ballot knows exactly what the ballot will be used for per the prepublished agenda.

I did find the 10 - 15% rule for quorums interesting. In our case, a small association of 16 homes, that would be 2 people. A quorum would be present if only two of our three directors showed up!

Summarizing what I read here, the elimination of quorums appears more widespread and acceptable than I would have guessed. And for those who fear the hostile takeover of their association by bad people, just show up and vote or submit a proxy ballot to someone who is actually willing to show up and vote for you.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardM29 on 02/28/2025 2:05 AM
The Board can call for a meeting any time it wants, and lot owners are free to either attend or submit PROXY ballots.

In our case, we do not entertain votes on any issue that is not previously submitted to the BOD so it can be included on the published Agenda (or not). The "or not" means an issue was submitted, but it did not meet criteria, i.e. it was not legal. A recent example was a move by one lot owner to prohibit political signage. While a majority of residents might want to vote yes, our state law says it is allowable. So that was not included on the agenda. Everyone submitting a proxy ballot knows exactly what the ballot will be used for per the prepublished agenda.

I did find the 10 - 15% rule for quorums interesting. In our case, a small association of 16 homes, that would be 2 people. A quorum would be present if only two of our three directors showed up!

Summarizing what I read here, the elimination of quorums appears more widespread and acceptable than I would have guessed. And for those who fear the hostile takeover of their association by bad people, just show up and vote or submit a proxy ballot to someone who is actually willing to show up and vote for you.

Submit the proxies to who? I suppose Ebenezer would attend.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Anyone reading this who thinks they may want to elemenate quorum, needs to learn if it's permitted by their state, before revising their bylaws.

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