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RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Our Docs state nothing can be exhibited/view from outside within the common area. The current BOD refuses to enforce and as a result, we are seeing more items in windows clearly visible from the outside. Previous managers inspected the common areas both front and back weekly and followed our outlined procedure for violations. Current manager does not inspect and Board refuses to abide by their fiduciary duty. Legal action was taken and yet the situation remains the same. What will the state do if reported to the DPBR? Because it is not directly related to financial, will they bother. Anything that is applicable within the new legislation? There is a high tenancy rate in this portion of the community, so aesthetics do matter as far as property values are concerned. Thank you.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Typically if inside the unit, there is little the HOA can do. Also includes signs in ones window.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Please state the exact wording in your "docs" and which docs you're citing.
RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
To maintain harmony of the exterior appearance of the Bldg., no one shall make any changes, place anything upon, affix anything to or exhibit anything from any part of the Condominium Property visible from the "Exterior" of the Building or from the Common Elements.

The Amendment has been in place since the original by-laws were entered into Collier County possibly in 2015. I have a copy only.
RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
The rule has been enforced from day one. This is the first time (and the first BOD) we have encountered issues.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
But do your CC&R give the assoc. the authority to make "rules" about your the interior of your separate interest (private) condo windows?

And this does look like a rule and not a Bylaw..

And so for all these years, residents could not have Chrsitmas trees in their windows? Or a baby in a swing looking out at the world? Or tall house plants? Or? Or?

Or realtor signs? Our old CC&Rs banned them, but our City laws says we must permit them (we can limit size, etc.)

What the heck kind of "legal action" was taken?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RoleneP on 10/29/2024 12:12 PM

Legal action was taken and yet the situation remains the same.

What was the legal action for?

What was the outcome of the legal action (withdrawn, settled, waiting for court date, ruling)?

Was legal action against the board or against the owners who have things visible from outside the units?

RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
The Board of Directors was asked by legal counsel to perform their fiduciary duty by enforcing, which is considered selective enforcement if not uniformly done. The rule has been enforced for over seven years. New BOD. New way of managing the community, which is not up to them.
RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
The rule speaks for itself. Nothing has been modified or changed since the original. For seven years, previous Boards and managers have enforced the rule. To answer your question, nothing visible from the exterior of the condo which includes trees, plants, signage, or a baby in a swing.
We are allowed a wreath and holiday decor with a calendar directing when it can go up and when it must be removed. Some owners did put candles in the windows which was allowed during that holiday period. As mentioned in earlier posts, we have never had an issue with enforcement until now.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Perhaps the definitions in the front of your C&Rs will tell you the difference between Bylaws and Rules. I'm suggesting that the original is possibly invalid and does not adhere to your very own CC&Rs. It doesn't matter how long it's been "enforced."

There also have been some recent changes in FL that your can find in friary recent previous posts. Better yet, the very knowledgeable Lori will explain them in reply to your post.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Again, we have a lot of variation between state laws and declarations. My HOA declaration provides an option for the board to adopt regulations and fines, but for a violation of a declaration section the board shall find the owner in default and proceed to foreclosure.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Have you seen the written request for HOA counsel to enforce?

Oh, I menat to write that Lori MIGHT explain these changes to you.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I mean memo or whatever FROM counsel?

This doesn't seem to to at all about the. declaration, Dean.

Looking at the condo floor to ceiling windows in our twin tower about 50 feet from my high rise, I kinda enjoy the one wth a cat tree at a window with two frisky cats that're fun to watch.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I mean memo or whatever FROM counsel?

This doesn't seem to to at all about the. declaration, Dean.

Looking at the condo floor to ceiling windows in our twin tower about 50 feet from my high rise, I kinda enjoy the one wth a cat tree at a window with two frisky cats that're fun to watch.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 10/29/2024 12:23 PM
Typically if inside the unit, there is little the HOA can do. Also includes signs in ones window.

Maybe in SC. In Ohio a HOA can require all the window treatments be white as viewed from the exterior and prohibit all signs in windows, including realtor signs.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DeanJ on 10/29/2024 9:50 PM
Posted By JohnC46 on 10/29/2024 12:23 PM
Typically if inside the unit, there is little the HOA can do. Also includes signs in ones window.


Maybe in SC. In Ohio a HOA can require all the window treatments be white as viewed from the exterior and prohibit all signs in windows, including realtor signs.

Restrictions (inn the CC&Rs) such as these are very typical in condo communities in my state. My condos require white blinds, and we're not allowed to place any signage or other visible items in the windows. If we go by the letter of the law, even those window coatings that prevent people from looking inside your unit but which are not at all visible from outside are not allowed. (This last one makes no sense since the windows are part of the unit, and if the window film causes problems of some sort, the owner is the one on the hook.)
RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
To Dean's point, the same exists here in Florida. All of this was vetted by an experienced HOA attorney. The simple truth is the BOD has refused to enforce. The only recourse now is to file a report with the DBPR and hope that they are held accountable with this new legislation that was put into effect July 1, 2024. Florida law prohibits HOAs from selectively enforcing rules against some residents but not others. Due to the records that show consistent enforcement prior to this board being seated, this is considered selective enforcement.

Thank you to everyone who responded.
MarshallT (New York)
Posts: 414
Posted:
I'm afraid that if no one cares enough to enforce this rule, there's little that can done. While I understand your concern, it's a minor issue compared to failure to maintain the property.
RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Sadly, that is happening as well. Failure to enforce or adhere to RR/Docs in general is a problem. What starts out small or what may seem insignificant eventually turns into something larger. It's called mindset. What matters to one person or seems irrelevant should not matter. BODs have a fiduciary responsibility irrespective of their personal beliefs or agenda. Our Docs are the only thing that we should be concerned with. Boards come and go.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DeanJ on 10/29/2024 9:50 PM
Posted By JohnC46 on 10/29/2024 12:23 PM
Typically if inside the unit, there is little the HOA can do. Also includes signs in ones window.


Maybe in SC. In Ohio a HOA can require all the window treatments be white as viewed from the exterior and prohibit all signs in windows, including realtor signs.

Our Covenants state any window seen from the street must have white window treatments. There is no reference to signs in a window.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Our CC&Rs also say ll window coverings visible for the exterior must be white or off-white.

Our City says we must permit realtor signs in windows and our Rules limit them to 4' x. 4'

Our state says we must permit noncommercial signs in windows. our rules limit them to 15 sf.

I'm still confused, though, about Jolene saying the ban on anything in the windows is in the Bylaws. Not the rules? And I sitlldon't know of her CC&rs give the Board authority over what's in windows, i.e,owners private property.

RoleneP (Florida)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Kerry,

The issue I am referring to is in what we call the Garden Homes Declarations 18.13. As you know, HOAs vary from state to state. Florida has recent legislation that speaks to selective enforcement, which is in this case is lack thereof. As one of the other posters mentioned, this is very similar to their rules. The BODs chose to ignore the request from the attorney to adhere. No explanation, no defense. At that point, the only recourse is arbitration and that is costly, which is what they were banking on. This was also pre-approval of the new laws governing HOAs passed effective July 1, 2024. Now a formal complaint can be filed and in due time, the BOD will be held accountable if found they are not upholding their fiduciary duty. There is proof to show past enforcement and proof they continue to refuse to enforce. I hope that clarifies things. As mentioned earlier, we all live in different areas with different Docs/RR.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Thank, Jolene, I was hoping for wording from your docs n this topic and from what doc..

Yes HOAs, states, cities, etc vary on statutes, etc. vary, which is why I wanted to see what FL (re:, say, signs) & your own say.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
You still haven't said what sort of stuff people can see from the street or sidewalk when looking at someone's home. Like Kerry, I'd like to know what's so objectionable- a naked man? A Christmas tree, kids playing in the living room?

I didn't really hear anything about selective enforcement either - did you get a notice because of something in your window, compared to a neighbor who had the same thing or similar? Perhaps this rule isn't being enforced because it's not specific enough. A real estate sign may be one issue, but not a birdcage.

All of that said, I agree with Marshall that if you're having an issue with people not maintaining their homes appropriately (e.g. grass isn't being cut), that's a bigger problem that may warrant more attention.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

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