💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

EliG (Arizona)
Posts: 11
Posted:
We have liability insurance for our tennis courts. Our tennis pro also has liability and we are a named insured on her policy. If a person taking a lesson severely cuts himself on the surrounding fence while returning a ball, whose insurance covers the injury claim? Our HOA or the pros’s?
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Never in a million years would the responsibility for figuring out liability and the payment of claims fall on the (often wholly unskilled) volunteers who serve on a HOA board.

Turn this over to the insurer immediately. The longer the board delays, the greater the chances that the insurer will find an excuse not to cover any part of any claim, meaning the HOA might have to special assess owners to pay any claim and to pay for any ensuing litigation.
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
It would be between the insurance companies to figure out. If a pro is running a business on your tennis courts, you should talk to your insurer and make sure your policy even allows that.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
EliG (Arizona)
Posts: 11
Posted:
This is just a hypothetical. I’m asking because if the pro adds the HOA as an insured, does her insurance become the one that has to pay? Put another way, what benefit does our HoA get by having us a named insured on the pro’s policy?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I would never add them to the HOA insurance. They have to licensed and insured themselves. Unless somehow your HOA is employing them. Even then would have them as a 1099 contractor responsible for their own insurance.

Former HOA President
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Just an FYI: If your HOA is doing something similar to this, then participants should be required to sign a hold-harmless agreement as a condition of participation. These agreements are not a substitute for liability insurance, but they provide added protection to the HOA. Participants can't claim that they didn't understand the risks.

Any activity I've ever participated in where there was any chance of injury, no matter how remote, required signed agreements. Some of them were pretty eye-opening - the phrase "up to and including death" gets one's attention.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EliG on 03/18/2024 12:28 PM
This is just a hypothetical. I’m asking because if the pro adds the HOA as an insured, does her insurance become the one that has to pay? Put another way, what benefit does our HoA get by having us a named insured on the pro’s policy?

You should direct this question to your insurance agent. Most of us aren't insurance experts, insurance is complicated, and the companies structure their policies to maximize profit and minimize risks. There will be exclusions and other "gotchas" that a pro can explain to you.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I am part of a group that does tours for historical locations. We have people sign a release form before they get their tickets. The location is not ours. The release form is just for our group. The historic locale has its own form to sign. They are for the location.

Unless we wrap everything in bubble wrap, you always take a risk doing anything.

Former HOA President
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posted:
The HOA's insurance package hopefully has something called health (or similar name meaning the same thing) that pays for accidents on a no fault basis (up to your coverage limit for this, which may be $5,000 or $10,000). This is in addition to your liability coverage (which probably has a much higher limit). Check your insurance policy to see if health is included. I think it is generally included in HOA policies since it is good and may prevent lawsuits and larger claims for the insurance company.

Liability is determined on a case by case basis. As others have said, make a claim on your insurance and let your insurance company defend you.

The costs of the accident you described may be payed by the numskull (tennis player) who knew the fence was dangerous and failed to do "proper lookout" or "duty of lookout." The HOA and the instructor are not always liable to pay for every accident on HOA property. The HOA and/or the instructor have to be negligent or breach a duty of care in order to be liable. On the other hand, the HOA and the instructor may both be liable to varying degrees, so both insurances may pay.

I think the benefit of naming the HOA as an insured, is that if the HOA is sued and the instructor is at fault, then the HOA will be covered by the instructor's policy, and maybe other coverage.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Generally for a liability waiver to be enforceable, the person signing the waiver must get something of value in return. In your situation, the customer is receiving tour services and the venue is providing a site for the customers use. These waivers may or may not be enforceable depending on state law and the court’s review of the document.

Alternatively, United Airlines can’t expect to convince a court to enforce liability waivers they obtained in against a plane falling on your house unless you received something of value for the waiver.

In an HOA, the owner, by operation of the declaration, is allowed to use the common elements and no waiver is required. A court may take object to the HOA’s attempt to limit its liability in this situation.

Another issue with liability waivers is the never protect against gross negligence.
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EliG on 03/18/2024 12:11 PM
We have liability insurance for our tennis courts. Our tennis pro also has liability and we are a named insured on her policy. If a person taking a lesson severely cuts himself on the surrounding fence while returning a ball, whose insurance covers the injury claim? Our HOA or the pros’s?

If HOA has reason to know - with certainty - that the fence surrounding a tennis court is compromised in a way that could cause serious physical harm, and it doesn't address the health/safety concern and doesn't warn tennis players, then the HOA could be negligent. The same goes for a player that blows a knee on your court. I wouldn't think that a warning sign saying "Fence causes cuts" is reasonable nor would be expected.

If it's an accident and the fence is otherwise functioning as intended, the HOA would not be negligent. That doesn't mean the person can't ask for medical compensation or actually sue the HOA. You still want good insurance.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ElleN on 03/18/2024 12:17 PM
Never in a million years would the responsibility for figuring out liability and the payment of claims fall on the (often wholly unskilled) volunteers who serve on a HOA board.

Turn this over to the insurer immediately. The longer the board delays, the greater the chances that the insurer will find an excuse not to cover any part of any claim, meaning the HOA might have to special assess owners to pay any claim and to pay for any ensuing litigation.

Sound advice.

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

  • ✓ Ask follow-up questions
  • ✓ Share your experience
  • ✓ Get expert advice
  • ✓ Access 350,000 discussions
Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here