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AlisonC (Massachusetts)
Posts: 4
Posted:
We had a sump pump back flow that damaged 3 units in the each onwers basement
Some units had fully finished basements , some had partial finished basements
The maters policy paid the max amount of $25K payable to the Asso.
Should this money be divided equally between the 3 owners or per the insurance settlement report that provided breaks down amounts per unit based on the FINISH square footage

The owners cannot agree on how to distribute the funds

One owner wants to divide equally , another wants to use the settle document amounts from the insurance co.

Of course some units where allocated more money per the ins report ....

Help
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
What makes you think the HOA is not responsible for paying for all the damage, using the max amount the insurance will pay plus imposing a special assessment on all owners to make up the difference?
AlisonC (Massachusetts)
Posts: 4
Posted:
The damage was in the inside of the units , not common area . The master policy has a clause that it will pay a max of $25K per occurrence per a sump pump overflow . This amount was received payable to the association and to be allocated to the owners who have water damage

The HOA will not share the expenses to rebuild finished basements of 3 units as not common area and personal ins should kick in if they have it

IN regard to the check and allocation . The ins company's settlement documents broke down the payment for each unit , some get more than others based on the FINISHED square footage , some get less because they did not have as much FINISHED square footage

One owner wants to divide the $25K equally , another wants to go by the report and documents from the ins company . Each owner was allocated a different amount by the ins co

Should I divide equally or go by the insurance payout documents ?
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AlisonC on 02/28/2024 8:19 AM

The HOA will not share the expenses to rebuild finished basements of 3 units as not common area and personal ins should kick in if they have it
A COA can be liable for repairs to non-common area. But if your board does not want to pay for a legal opinion on this, and the three owners (or their insurers) are not claiming the HOA must pay for all the repairs, then allocating per the HOA insurer's report seems rational enough. Subsequently the question is whether the owners (or their insurers) will threaten legal action. Whence I expect the HOA's attorney bills may start to exceed the cost of just paying for a unit's repairs.

In short, divide the insurance settlement in a way the board deems fair, then let the chips fall where they may.

DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
As a unit owner, I pay an assessment for the proper maintenance of the building and for sufficient insurance. . That includes proper maintenance of the sump pumps and drains. My position would be the HOA’s sump waste entered my unit and the HOA needs to 100% fund the damage to the interior of my unit. The amount of the insurance may not sufficient to cover all 3 units, but that’s not my problem. The board approved the insurance and accepted the risk of insufficient coverage for the HOA.

The HOA’s offer to pay part of the damage may constitute an admission the HOA is responsible for the damage. However you decide the funds, you need the owners to sign off they have accepted money as full payment of their damages from the HOA.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I'm assort not to know this, Alison, w but what distinguishes a "finished" basements vs. an unfinished one. Does a "finished" basement have wallboard and hard or soft surface flooring?

Our condo buildings' CC&Rs have a whole article on Insurance and probably yours do too. It sounds like your CC&Rs call for coverage in Units for just replacing wallboard and repairing/leveling floor surface if damaged. Our insurance is that way too. Owners must (required by our CC&Rs) buy the own HO6 insurance to cover other damage or issues even if caused by a common area problem.* This kind of policy, very common in condos, is called a "bare walls policy."

So it sounds like your policy covers the "finished" surfaces whether in the basement or other parts of the Unit. For that reason and because the insurance company--as experts in this matter--provides a breakdown, it seems fair to follow the guidance in the settlement.

* Only negligence by the HOA would see them paying, i.e., "bing liable for" for all damage, loss of use, etc.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
In attached homes, it's not unusual for insurance payouts to restore the unit to the included features prior to any upgrades. For example, a kitchen's granite countertops were damaged - if laminate countertops were the included feature and the owner paid extra for an upgrade, then the insurance will cover up to the value of laminate countertops. In this case, if unfinished basements were the included feature, then the finished basement would be the owner's responsibility.

But the master policy should spell this out, and that's what the board has to abide by. If the association was not paying to insure upgrades, then why should anyone expect to cover them?

Given how touchy insurers are these days and how willing they are to jack up premiums or dump insured clients altogether, I would not recommend playing fast and loose with this. At most I'd suggest letting the HOA's insurer fight it out with the unit owners' insurers. When homeowners buy policies, their agents ask to see copies of the governing documents to make sure there are no gaps in coverage. So the insurers ought to be able to reach an agreement, which will be the proper course of action.
AlisonC (Massachusetts)
Posts: 4
Posted:
All the damage was from a power outage , therefore the sump pumps backed up into the 3 units basements
The master policy caps payout at $25k for the incident
The basements - one unit has a completely finished basement , with a living room , bedroom's, and office . The other 2 units had a partially finished basement with a living room only
The insurance adjuster prepared the report with pictures and dimensions for all 3 units .
One unit was allocated more money because they had more FINISHED square footage with wall to wall carpeting , The other 2 units that were partially finished where allocated lesser amounts amounts per the settlement

Only one owner is disputing how the $25k shoull be split . One owner wants to divide the check equally , when the settlement report allocated less to them

Should I disperse based on the insurance documents by unit or divide equally ?
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Our master insurance policy doesn't cover any damage to the interior (I live in a townhouse community). From the drywall in, is the homeowner's responsibility, regardless of what caused the damage, and that includes utility lines. This is one reason why we published an article in the newsletter a few years ago suggesting that homeowners talk to their insurance companies about getting sewer/water damage coverage, which usually isn't part of a standard homeowner's insurance policy.

As for this, I'd divide it according to the insurance documents - if the homeowners want to protest, they can do that on their own. You could always include the photos and the report taken by the adjuster and give that to everyone if they're still wondering why they should get more.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Ooooooooh. "Finished" incudes carpeting? If your CC&Rs say HOA insurance must cover things like carpeting, cabinets, baseboards, counters, plumbing fixtures, etc., your policy would be a "walls in policy." And it MIGHT cover the upgrade of carpeting added to a basement floor.

You really need to know what your CC&Rs say, though your agent should have adhered to the CC&Rs when they sold you a policy.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 02/28/2024 12:05 PM
Ooooooooh. "Finished" incudes carpeting? If your CC&Rs say HOA insurance must cover things like carpeting, cabinets, baseboards, counters, plumbing fixtures, etc., your policy would be a "walls in policy." And it MIGHT cover the upgrade of carpeting added to a basement floor.

You really need to know what your CC&Rs say, though your agent should have adhered to the CC&Rs when they sold you a policy.

Emphasis on "MIGHT". We have all included insurance, but it does not cover upgrades.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AlisonC on 02/28/2024 11:08 AM
All the damage was from a power outage , therefore the sump pumps backed up into the 3 units basements
The master policy caps payout at $25k for the incident
The basements - one unit has a completely finished basement , with a living room , bedroom's, and office . The other 2 units had a partially finished basement with a living room only
The insurance adjuster prepared the report with pictures and dimensions for all 3 units .
One unit was allocated more money because they had more FINISHED square footage with wall to wall carpeting , The other 2 units that were partially finished where allocated lesser amounts amounts per the settlement

Only one owner is disputing how the $25k shoull be split . One owner wants to divide the check equally , when the settlement report allocated less to them

Should I disperse based on the insurance documents by unit or divide equally ?

They do sell sump pumps with battery back ups.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Agree with Cathy. Ins. MIGHT cover replacing the carpeting. but since it was not an original "Improvement," it depends on what th CC&Rs, and therefore, what the policy says.

"Improvement" might be defined in your CC&Rs. Perhaps under a definition called Unit.

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