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AmandaG4 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1
Posted:
My board thinks they can send letters to some residents about violations and just visit others without sending any official warning. When I asked my board president about their process this was his response;

"it is at the discretion of the board as to handle complaints. We will not discuss why we use one approach over another. We do take into consideration the violation, the time the resident has been living here and whether they are hostile to the board"

Can anyone PM friends or attorneys tell me if this would be an example of Selective Enforcement?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
As long as the board is enforcing the same rule on everyone it is not selective enforcement.

Unless there is a written procedure on how enforcement is to take place, then the board is free to determine how to enforce.

Also, keep in mind that Selective Enforcement is a defense one can use in court. It may or may not sway the court (as you were still in violation).

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
My Association has a policy of:

Informal Notice - written or verbal
Formal Notice - written sent via 1st class mail
Notice of Hearing before the board - sent via first class and certified mail
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
They are not selectively enforcing a violation over others. They are just taking a different approach of enforcing. It is within their discretion to do so.

Some people may live elsewhere. They would get a letter. A person who lives there may get a personal visit. It may be a past history of violence. They may decide a letter is appropriate.

The question is why does this bother you so much? Are you telling people in violation? It is not an easy nor safe job

Former HOA President
LoriM15 (Florida)
Posts: 1,009
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmandaG4 on 02/26/2024 10:51 AM
My board thinks they can send letters to some residents about violations and just visit others without sending any official warning. When I asked my board president about their process this was his response;

"it is at the discretion of the board as to handle complaints. We will not discuss why we use one approach over another. We do take into consideration the violation, the time the resident has been living here and whether they are hostile to the board"


Other than the last sentence about how long they are in the community and their hostility, I don't see anything wrong with what the board member said.

Every situation is different. If the person who gets a visit cooperates and fixes the issue without a written warning, the problem is solved. It costs money to send out those letters. If it's done by a management company, it not only costs PM time, but there may be a charge for the letter.

As long as the problems get fixed in a timely manner, a friendly reminder is always the best choice. How do you know that the people getting violation notices have not already received a friendly reminder?
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LoriM15 on 02/26/2024 11:31 AM
Posted By AmandaG4 on 02/26/2024 10:51 AM
My board thinks they can send letters to some residents about violations and just visit others without sending any official warning. When I asked my board president about their process this was his response;

"it is at the discretion of the board as to handle complaints. We will not discuss why we use one approach over another. We do take into consideration the violation, the time the resident has been living here and whether they are hostile to the board"



Other than the last sentence about how long they are in the community and their hostility, I don't see anything wrong with what the board member said.

Every situation is different. If the person who gets a visit cooperates and fixes the issue without a written warning, the problem is solved. It costs money to send out those letters. If it's done by a management company, it not only costs PM time, but there may be a charge for the letter.

As long as the problems get fixed in a timely manner, a friendly reminder is always the best choice. How do you know that the people getting violation notices have not already received a friendly reminder?

I do understand about the hostility and time in the community. For the first, it would be nice to simply knock on the door with a friendly reminder, but these days, you don't know when or why people will fly off the handle. It might also be a minor issue like a reminder to bring trash carts back to the side of the house after trash pickup. If the thing was in the middle of the street, it should be enough to knock on the door to let the homeowner know so he or she can go get it.

The length of time one's been in the community can also be a factor. If the owner is brand new, you don't necessarily want their first contact with the association to be a violation notice. It can be a good thing to give newbies time to settle in and read their documents so they'll know what the rules are). Conversely, if you've been in the community for several years, you should already know what they are - you don't get nastygrams if you clean up after your pet and keep the lawn mowed.

Considering it takes time and sometimes paper and postage to send out violation notices, it's best to save that for more serious violations, because you'll need a paper trail if things escalate.

You didn't say if you got a violation notice by paper or a knock on the door - maybe you got the former because this isn't the first time you were caught. Or you have a reputation as being hostile to the board for whatever reason. Or someone didn't realize this was a first-time offense and you should have gotten the friendly reminder. However you were notified, if it WAS a violation, fix it and don't do it again (and then you don't have to worry about this stuff at all).


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Sheila do not forget to add those who like to play the system by not having anything in writing. They will claim need to tell them in person. No I also need a record even if on a calendar that contact was made. This is used for proof in court.

Think most everyone has come across that type ...

Former HOA President
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmandaG4 on 02/26/2024 10:51 AM
My board thinks they can send letters to some residents about violations and just visit others without sending any official warning. When I asked my board president about their process this was his response;

"it is at the discretion of the board as to handle complaints. We will not discuss why we use one approach over another. We do take into consideration the violation, the time the resident has been living here and whether they are hostile to the board"

Can anyone PM friends or attorneys tell me if this would be an example of Selective Enforcement?

What you describe is not selective enforcement.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 02/26/2024 11:30 AM
They are not selectively enforcing a violation over others. They are just taking a different approach of enforcing. It is within their discretion to do so.

Some people may live elsewhere. They would get a letter. A person who lives there may get a personal visit. It may be a past history of violence. They may decide a letter is appropriate.

The question is why does this bother you so much? Are you telling people in violation? It is not an easy nor safe job

AmandA

A good question. What is bothering you
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmandaG4 on 02/26/2024 10:51 AM
My board thinks they can send letters to some residents about violations and just visit others without sending any official warning. When I asked my board president about their process this was his response;

"it is at the discretion of the board as to handle complaints. We will not discuss why we use one approach over another. We do take into consideration the violation, the time the resident has been living here and whether they are hostile to the board"
If owner Jones and owner Smith both violate Rule X and they are treated differently because of either how long they live there or because one is "hostile" to the board, this may very well be selective enforcement.

The higher the stakes are, then the more important it becomes for providing the exact same due process to Jones and Smith.

More details are needed. For now, if you do not like how the board conducts itself, then most likely the quickest, least laborious route to correct this is to run for and get elected to the board with people who feel as you do. And believe me, this route, while the least demanding, will be labor intensive.
MarkM19 (Texas)
Posts: 1,459
Posted:
Amanda,
Why are other owners' violations even mentioned to non-board members? From your post it appears that you are not on the board unless you are in the minority on this topic with the rest of the board.

I agree with all the other posts. In our case our PMC does the violations, and the board rarely gets involved unless we see a violation and bring it to the PMs attention.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Your governing documents should say HOW, they method by which, rules are enforced, Amanda. What do yours say? You might find the method in your Rules & Regs, or possibly in your CC&Rs? In many states, rules enforcement must comply with state statutes, i.e., there are certain requirements boards must follow.

In many states, the alleged violator must be informed in writing; the alleged violator may plead their case at a hearing, etc.

Although our PM sends the courtesy letters requesting compliance, and I agree every owner should receive a warning or immediate call to hearing in writing, I can see instances where a first attempt might be made when it's known, for instance, a resident has been very ill long term so hasn't brought in her trash. Let's just say in instances where a polite in-person visit would be a kindness. They still must get the formal courtesy letter a few days later.

This is not "Selective Enforcement." "Enforcement" is the actual action by the board. Enforcement is the fine, or withholding of amenities, or charging for damage to the common areas.

I'm seeing a violation the past few days. A new owner's balcony is in the tower across from mine. In the past few days, I've seen their little pooch sitting outside at their balcony door wanting to be let in. So far, it hasn't barked. We have a rule that cats & dogs must alway have access to the Unit from balconies. Since it seems OK 'til let in; there's' no noise nuisance, I won't report to the PM, but I will if barking starts. As a new resident, I think it'd be welcoming to receive a friendly voice mail or PM visit with reminder to keep the door ajar and to read our Community Handbook.
CoreyC1 (California)
Posts: 1
Posted:
HOA board members must treat all home owners equally, otherwise the board member is violating fiduciary duty. A fiduciary duty is the legal responsibility to act solely in the best interest of another party. “Fiduciary” means trust, and a person with a fiduciary duty has a legal obligation to maintain that trust. For example, HOA board members have a fiduciary duty to act in the best interest of each and every home owner.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
They are being treated the same. Just different approach. They all in violation.

Former HOA President

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