BettyO1 (California)
Posts: 104
Posts: 104
Posted:
If HOA is cited by the city for doing work without a required permit, can members get a copy of the citation? Is there a civil code that addresses this question?
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Started by BettyO1 • 14 replies • 261 views
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DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Yes. The citation is public record.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Like I think DeanJ indicated, I suspect going to the city and asking for a copy of the citation is the way to go. It is common for cities have information about requesting records on the city web site, on account of "Sunshine Laws."
As for using the Ca Civil Code to make a records request to the HOA, I do not think a citation from the city is among the records owners can inspect. See https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/H/HOA-Records-Subject-to-Inspection
The Ca Corp Code is more general when it comes to records and their inspection, but I think the HOA might say that the Ca Civ Code is apposite here and so controls.
As for using the Ca Civil Code to make a records request to the HOA, I do not think a citation from the city is among the records owners can inspect. See https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/H/HOA-Records-Subject-to-Inspection
The Ca Corp Code is more general when it comes to records and their inspection, but I think the HOA might say that the Ca Civ Code is apposite here and so controls.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Find out what agency issued the citation and then contact it to get a copy. Then go to the board and ask why it didn't do its due diligence in checking to see if the work required a permit - and what it will do to prevent this from happening again.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Find out what agency issued the citation and then contact it to get a copy. Then go to the board and ask why it didn't do its due diligence in checking to see if the work required a permit - and what it will do to prevent this from happening again.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Yes. The citation or fine should be available to ALL members. That is something ALL members are going to be responsible for paying. It's not like just the board members will be facing the fine/citation. It's coming out of the ENTIRE HOA budget. If the fine is large enough, the HOA may have to have a special assessment to pay it. That will have to make it HOA member knowledge why paying it out.
Had experience with this once. Our ex-scum sucking President did odd jobs in the hood. He was also friends with lawncare person. (His drug dealer). There was a strip of land between our HOA and the next neighborhood. It's basically just a tree lined area not used. However, it appears one of the neighbors in the hood next door complained to the city for "illegal dumping". You guessed it. It was our scumbag ex-President doing it. Plus he told OTHERS like our lawncare it was okay to do it. The pile of lawncare debris was HUGE. I did not know this was happening.
The city told us 30 days to clean up or face a $10 K fine. Plus every 2 weeks it was not addressed was another few thousand more added. Our HOA ONLY collected $5K a month with little to no savings at all. The rent for a Dumpster was $500 plus dumping fees. I had to find VOLUNTEERS to help clean up. Which I got maybe 5 - 7 including myself. The first day was miserable. Plus you guessed it the guilty parties never showed up to help. The second day was a disaster. People were mad the others did not show up. I got to the site early and was jumping on tree branches to crunch them down. That way it looked like we made progress.
Luckily after 3 days of clearing the city did not fine us. Still people were mad about the situation. Even though we escaped barely out of $10K + fine, people were still angry we paid $500 to rent a dumpster. Not to mention how the guilty parties didn't get involved. I don't expect much difference to happen in your HOA when dealing with a fine like this. They will complain but yet not address the fine. Only a few will help fix the issue. I'd recommend being open as possible about the situation. It sucks but being open about it gets things done. Whether we like it or not.
Had experience with this once. Our ex-scum sucking President did odd jobs in the hood. He was also friends with lawncare person. (His drug dealer). There was a strip of land between our HOA and the next neighborhood. It's basically just a tree lined area not used. However, it appears one of the neighbors in the hood next door complained to the city for "illegal dumping". You guessed it. It was our scumbag ex-President doing it. Plus he told OTHERS like our lawncare it was okay to do it. The pile of lawncare debris was HUGE. I did not know this was happening.
The city told us 30 days to clean up or face a $10 K fine. Plus every 2 weeks it was not addressed was another few thousand more added. Our HOA ONLY collected $5K a month with little to no savings at all. The rent for a Dumpster was $500 plus dumping fees. I had to find VOLUNTEERS to help clean up. Which I got maybe 5 - 7 including myself. The first day was miserable. Plus you guessed it the guilty parties never showed up to help. The second day was a disaster. People were mad the others did not show up. I got to the site early and was jumping on tree branches to crunch them down. That way it looked like we made progress.
Luckily after 3 days of clearing the city did not fine us. Still people were mad about the situation. Even though we escaped barely out of $10K + fine, people were still angry we paid $500 to rent a dumpster. Not to mention how the guilty parties didn't get involved. I don't expect much difference to happen in your HOA when dealing with a fine like this. They will complain but yet not address the fine. Only a few will help fix the issue. I'd recommend being open as possible about the situation. It sucks but being open about it gets things done. Whether we like it or not.
Former HOA President
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
To make sure I understand this, Betty: Did your Board or property mgr. fail to get a permit to do work in the common areas?
OR, did the City cite the HOA because an owner failed to get a permit for work done to their separate interest dwelling?
Was this "work" to build something new? Or to repair something that already existed?
What does the city want the HOA to do now?
OR, did the City cite the HOA because an owner failed to get a permit for work done to their separate interest dwelling?
Was this "work" to build something new? Or to repair something that already existed?
What does the city want the HOA to do now?
BettyO1 (California)
Posts: 104
Posts: 104
Posted:
The HOA failed to get a permit required for the work. Work has been completed..
It was cited by the city that mandates a permit be obtained now.
It was cited by the city that mandates a permit be obtained now.
MichaelS56 (Minnesota)
Posts: 858
Posts: 858
Posted:
Who pays for this citation? What does the contract indicate as to the permit?
BettyO1 (California)
Posts: 104
Posts: 104
Posted:
Members will have to pay for the citation and any penalties!!!
BettyO1 (California)
Posts: 104
Posts: 104
Posted:
Members will have to pay for the citation and any penalties!!!
BettyO1 (California)
Posts: 104
Posts: 104
Posted:
Members will have to pay for the citation and any penalties!!!
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Owners elected directors who, without pay, messed up!
BettyO1, I will be urging all owners to vote for you at the next annual election of directors!
BettyO1, I will be urging all owners to vote for you at the next annual election of directors!
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Betty
What is your issue with hw this was done? I think it is more then no permit was pulled.
What is your issue with hw this was done? I think it is more then no permit was pulled.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I'm kinda feeling the same way, JohnC. She won't answer my questions, but perhaps doesn't know the answers? Too many mysteries, Betty. Can you provide more details?
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