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JudyM12 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Can a resident of an HOA functioning as property manager (Self-Managed HOA) also sit on the board as Treasurer?

I was president for three years and have been supporting the position of Treasurer off and on for 10 years. Our new treasurer is moving. I could do both jobs. Currently, we must have 2 signers on the checking account so we do have another set of eyes on the books. It is difficult to find a volunteer, especially one who knows QuickBooks. We have a CPA firm handle our year end reports and filings.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 12:15 PM
Can a resident of an HOA functioning as property manager (Self-Managed HOA) also sit on the board as Treasurer?
Please understand that officer positions are not the same as director positions. Officer positions typically are President, VP, Secretary and Treasurer.

Bylaws do not always require that officers be directors. Statutes certainly do not.

The statutory requirements for directors are different from officers.

So are you asking can a property manager also serve as a director? Or are you asking if a property manager can serve as a non-director treasurer?

Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 12:15 PM

I was president for three years
Were you also a director? Sometimes bylaws do not require that the president be a director.
Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 12:15 PM
and have been supporting the position of Treasurer off and on for 10 years. Our new treasurer is moving. I could do both jobs.
"Self-managed" has different meanings to different people. Please clarify:

Is the treasurer also a director?

Are you the HOA manager? If so, are you paid for your services as HOA manager?

Please respond to all questions people here ask you. Please name the person to whom you are responding.
JudyM12 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
EllN

In Florida, HOA's can be self-managed by a homeowner, and I do receive a monthly salary.

The president, vice-president, treasurer and secretary are officers.

Currently, I invoice the owners for HOA maintenance fees, keep up with collections and deposits and we close out the year paid in full because I am the friendliest bill collector in the world. I reconcile the bank accounts and write out checks for payment for the treasurer because she has very little time as a full time working single mother. I do these things to keep everything up to date. I work on the budget and provide all documentation to the CPA for the end of the year filings.

I just wonder if I can technically assume the position of treasurer and remain property manager. For 10 years, I have always had a hard time finding a volunteer to be treasurer.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Is this a condominium?

Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 12:36 PM
In Florida, HOA's can be self-managed by a homeowner, and I do receive a monthly salary.
Some people would declare that this is not what they understand "self-managed" to mean.

Just saying.
Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 12:36 PM
I just wonder if I can technically assume the position of treasurer and remain property manager. For 10 years, I have always had a hard time finding a volunteer to be treasurer.
The only restriction Florida statutes might place on the board appointing you as treasurer is the sections on conflicts of interest. If you want me to cite these sections, just ask. General thoughts:

-- Do your bylaws require the treasurer to be a director?

-- Does the treasurer have to be an owner in the HOA?

-- I do not like that the manager (if she is also the treasurer) may be signing checks on behalf of the association. I am sure you are honest. But the optics here are terrible IMO. I would have security concerns.

-- Best practices IMO would be for you to recuse yourself on any financial decision that affects your compensation as the manager.

-- If your bylaws require an audit of the books every so often, then I would expect the auditor to frown on the manager also serving as treasurer.

-- If I were on this board, I would urge the board to find someone else to serve as treasurer, because the conflicts of interest are overwhelming, IMO.

-- But as you noted, finding volunteers, and ones who are qualified, is hard.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
When you say "functioning as property manager" is that individual being paid?
JudyM12 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
I am paid for 24/7/365 HOA (not condo, they are different) management and response. In Florida, we can self-manage which is more efficient and less expensive for our HOA. Until someone steps up to volunteer to be treasurer, I will have to perform the duties...without a treasurer, the show must go on.
BillD16 (Texas)
Posts: 971
Posted:
ElleN wrote:
> I do not like that the manager (if she is also the treasurer) may be signing checks on behalf of the
> association. I am sure you are honest. But the optics here are terrible IMO. I would have security concerns.

I agree, mostly due to the "optics". If I were in the role of Manager / Treasurer, I would *want* someone
else in the loop who could independently verify that I was being honest and open. I can, sadly, attest to
how mere rumors can be as damaging as actual malfeasance.

Bill

HOA Board ex-President
Austin, Texas USA

“You can’t put too much water in a nuclear reactor”
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JudyM12 on 12/06/2023 1:03 PM
I am paid for 24/7/365 HOA (not condo, they are different)
In the media and in this forum, "HOA" often refers to condominium associations along with single family home subdivisions.

And of course in Florida, some RV parks are organized under FS 720. And some are organized under FS 718.

As well Florida Co-Ops may be organized under FS 719.

Then there's mobile home parks, which might be organized under FS 723.

Hence the request for clarification.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
The problem would be conflicts of interest and the absence of clear boundaries on roles, and some of these problems already exist.

The board inevitably is in a position of authority over homeowners - for example when dealing with violations of the CC&Rs or when deciding on pursuing collection or foreclosure actions.

The board hires the property manager and must supervise that person. The board may also need to fire them. The board may be reluctant to supervise the person properly or to fire them if the person is a neighbor. Or a neighbor may believe they're entitled to some slack, and may push back against the board's reasonable authority.

A manager is often privy to information about homeowners that is not available to the membership - as with the violations and collection actions. Managers also may be privy to discussions with the HOA attorney. If the manager is a homeowner, this confidentiality may be breached.

Similar issues exist with the treasurer even if the treasurer is only an officer. It can be worse if the treasurer is also a director, since that person would need to recuse themselves whenever one of these conflicts of interest comes into play (eg. when supervising officers). Which means they wouldn't totally be pulling their own weight. Employing a homeowner as the treasurer can also create a false sense of security - surely Good Ol' Joe wouldn't be stealing funds from the association - so the board may not keep as sharp as eye on Joe as they need to.

These issues are similar to what you find in family-owned businesses where it can be impossible to separate personal and professional roles. Both of these relationships can suffer as a result. In very small HOAs, having individuals serve in multiple roles may be unavoidable, but in larger communities I believe it's better not to.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Judy wrote:"The president, vice-president, treasurer and secretary are officers." Is each also a director who was elected by the homeowners?

Btw, what size is your HOA? How many directors are required?
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
In another thread, AnnaD2 pointed out that FS 720 has some pretty severe restrictions on compensation of directors and officers. Here's what FS 720.303 (12) says in part:

COMPENSATION PROHIBITED.— A director, officer, or committee member of the association may not directly receive any salary or compensation from the association for the performance of duties as a director, officer, or committee member and may not in any other way benefit financially from service to the association. This subsection does not preclude:
...

(d) Any fee or compensation authorized in the governing documents.


I suppose this is unlikely to apply, as the governing documents likely authorize the board to employ a manager.

"Just saying" for now.

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