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LaraV (Indiana)
Posts: 3
Posted:
I am wondering if our management company can take someone's monthly dues and instead of putting it 100% toward the communities budget, take apart of it FIRST for a late fee on the account. Not stated in our bylaws. I am new on this site and hope someone may have an answer.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
We had a written policy that all payments would be applied in the following order:

1) Legal fees
2) Late charges
3) Assessments owed

This is typical of most companies.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
LaraV, are you new as well to the fact that state statutes often have something to say about situations like this? If so, please respond to the following:

Is this a condominium?

What year was your association established?
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
It's more likely that Ff there's anything about your question in your governing documents, Lara, it's in your CC&RS (AKA: covenants, declaration) vs. your Bylaws..
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Check your documents first to see what they say. The management company works at tg5e direction of tge board so if you don't see anything there, ask the board. Also look through tge documents you received at closing - is the HOA'S collection policy buried in the other paperwork? Depending on how long you've lived in the community, there may have been updates.

In my community, we apply delinquent payments to the oldest account first. That is, if you've had two years of delinquencies, your payments will go to year 1 assessments, then costs incurred by the association in collecting the debt.

In my community, we found it easier to total everything owed and then your payments are applied to that, although you receive a breakdown of what made up that total- late fees, collection costs from the management company in monitoring the account, attorney's fees, costs of court filing, liens etc.

We also accelerate delinquent accounts - if you haven't paid within 60 days, it goes to the attorney.
Since we pay every month, acceleration means all assessments for the rest of the year becume due immediately Homeowners must also pay current assessments at the same time do they don't fall further behind.

If you're delinquent, you need to find out RIGHT NOW how payments are applied. Get a copy of your account ledgerto see what was paid and check against your records to ensure you weren't assessed Kate fees by mistake. If you dont want to fall further behind, take a hard look at your budget and ask if you can negotiate a payment plan.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
This sounds more like a case where some HOA's will apply dues to fines. That way they can file a lien for unpaid dues. Fines are typically NOT allowed to be the basis of a lien or foreclosure. Some HOA's or PM's make it so whatever dues are collected are applied to existing fines on the account. (or other charges). This is NOT necessarily illegal. This method may depend on what state you live in, the HOA, or the PM practice.

I personally do not agree with this method of collections. However, it is a method used in some HOA's for their own purposes. It's not what I would do.

Former HOA President
LorraineH (Florida)
Posts: 3
Posted:
In FL condo law requires that payments on delinquent accounts are applied to late fees and interest before applying to the delinquent assessment. That is good for the association since interest can accrue on late assessments but not fees and interest.

I am confused about why you say the payments don't go toward operations. Doesn't the payment get deposited into the operating checking account? Sure it wouldn't show as assessment revenue on an income statement but it doesn't seem likely that those funds would be restricted as they would be if they were if they were reserve assessments. It may be different for us because by law, we do accrual accounting.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Applying payments to late fees and interest first is very common, and not just in community associations. It's how people with credit card debt can dig themselves into a financial hole that they can't get out of - the amount they're paying never touches the principal, and finance charges continue to accrue.

My CC&Rs state that payments will be applied in that order. I vaguely remember a story from someone who tried to get cute and wrote something on their checks like "for assessment only" - and their HOA stopped depositing their checks, and the financial hole got bigger and bigger. Such an endorsement wouldn't even work in my community since *everything* is considered an assessment, including late fees and interest and collection costs.

Unless a community's CC&Rs or state law say that payments will be applied to assessments first, I strongly recommend against trying to play games with this.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Exactly why I hate this method of applying assessments. On the surface it does give the HOA more power and grit. However it just just a bad way to do business. Leaving everyone with bad taste in their mouths. I get the purpose. It just that a HOA use of fines is so misunderstood and applied in many HOAs. Our HOA never fined. There were stronger ways to enforce than fines. Which when you can correct a violation and send the owner the bill works much better. (More details apply).

Former HOA President
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
But, Melissa, there are lotsa violations in lotsa HOAs that don't involve spending money to correct. Yet the violators may be fined. Just a few examples are noise violations, pet violations, parking violations, pool behavior violations, etc., etc. Fines can deter such misconduct in the future, especially if the HOA's Fine Schedule states that fines can be doubled for repeat offenses.
BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821
Posted:
Order of application of payments should be stated in your declaration or collections policy.

Many boards don’t even realize what it is or that it exists; attend the next board meeting and bring it up.
LoriM15 (Florida)
Posts: 1,009
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LorraineH on 11/30/2023 6:52 PM
In FL condo law requires that payments on delinquent accounts are applied to late fees and interest before applying to the delinquent assessment. That is good for the association since interest can accrue on late assessments but not fees and interest.

I am confused about why you say the payments don't go toward operations. Doesn't the payment get deposited into the operating checking account? Sure it wouldn't show as assessment revenue on an income statement but it doesn't seem likely that those funds would be restricted as they would be if they were if they were reserve assessments. It may be different for us because by law, we do accrual accounting.

This is not true for Florida FS 720 HOAs. We can charge interest on the total overdue amount, including late fees. I looked in FS 718 to see where the rule is different and I couldn't find that specific language. Can you point it out? FS 718 does give the order in which payments are applied to the account: Any payment received by an association must be applied first to any interest accrued by the association, then to any administrative late fee, then to any costs and reasonable attorney fees incurred in collection, and then to the delinquent assessment.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 11/30/2023 12:46 PM
We had a written policy that all payments would be applied in the following order:

1) Legal fees
2) Late charges
3) Assessments owed

This is typical of most companies.

I agree with this method. What I have seen, and it is totally wrong, applying to "fines" first when fine can be wrong and/or capricious.
LorraineH (Florida)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LoriM15 on 12/02/2023 2:20 PM
Posted By LorraineH on 11/30/2023 6:52 PM
In FL condo law requires that payments on delinquent accounts are applied to late fees and interest before applying to the delinquent assessment. That is good for the association since interest can accrue on late assessments but not fees and interest.

I am confused about why you say the payments don't go toward operations. Doesn't the payment get deposited into the operating checking account? Sure it wouldn't show as assessment revenue on an income statement but it doesn't seem likely that those funds would be restricted as they would be if they were if they were reserve assessments. It may be different for us because by law, we do accrual accounting.


This is not true for Florida FS 720 HOAs. We can charge interest on the total overdue amount, including late fees. I looked in FS 718 to see where the rule is different and I couldn't find that specific language. Can you point it out? FS 718 does give the order in which payments are applied to the account: Any payment received by an association must be applied first to any interest accrued by the association, then to any administrative late fee, then to any costs and reasonable attorney fees incurred in collection, and then to the delinquent assessment.


F.S.718.116 (3) gives the statute on interest and you are correct on the order of application. However, the last sentence says late fees are not subject to chapter 687. That statute is the code on interest. I am not a lawyer, but my reading, backed up by the way our mgmt Co does our calculations (as finance comm chair, i see these reports) makes me believe late fees are not subject to interest. The language is similar in 720.
DeanJ
Posts: 1,786
Posted:
Most declarations are silent on this. Your association’s board should have adopted a late payment policy. In some associations legal has access to the homeowner records and legal action is automatically initiated at a value established by the board.

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