Requesting Bank Statements

I would argue that under FS 718 you are not entitled to copies of bank statements. Financial records like monthly accounts are official records but not bank statements. Your association is trying to be transparent by allowing you access to those if that’s not required. However, they are right not to include routeing and account numbers. Including those could lead to fraud. The attorney is overseeing the process so you can get the records you need without the sensitive information. Why do you have a problem with this?

It is overkill to have the attorney there (pay $400/hour to black line a few numbers?!). Furthermore, if you direct deposit or wire your assessment to the condo bank, the Association would have had to give you the routing and account numbers. So that’s not confidential information. (In fact, you can call the Association's bank and they'll tell you the routing number. And if you pay by check, look at the back of your cancelled check; the account number, and maybe also the routing number, may very well have been stamped there, making the attorney especially pointless).

Terri, do you know if we can ask for and receive copies of cancelled checks, as well as bank statements? Been asking; have not been receiving.

Natty

Sounds like a witch hunt. What specifically are you looking for?

If the bank statements alone "won't tell you much," there shouldn't be an objection to getting copies of them.
The article cited makes it seem only board members should be able to detect fraud.
When it comes to $$, members should be able to see/know everything.
For example, if it's thought a board might be conducting an unlawful collection, it would be useful to see the bank statements.

From the D-S Site, those fall under 'Enhanced association records' that homeowners are allowed access to:

(b) “Enhanced association records” means invoices, receipts and canceled checks for payments made by the association, purchase orders approved by the association, bank account statements for bank accounts in which assessments are deposited or withdrawn, credit card statements for credit cards issued in the name of the association, statements for services rendered, and reimbursement requests submitted to the association.

https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/Statutes/Civil-Code-5200#:~:text=(b)%20%E2%80%9CEnhanced%20association%20records,in%20the%20name%20of%20the

Note - when I request documents in California I specifically ask for them in 'electronic format' to be emailed to me. Originally, our HOA attorney indicated I needed to pay a per page copying fee as well as drive to the PMC's office to pay and pick them up. I pointed out the below section and so far, when they do send me the documents I have requested it has been by email and there isn't any charge (the PMC claims they are 'green' and everything has been scanned anyways) If they had to manually redact something, I would expect to pay something though.

Civil Code § 5205(h). Inspection of Records

(h) Requesting parties shall have the option of receiving specifically identified records by electronic transmission or machine-readable storage media as long as those records can be transmitted in a redacted format that does not allow the records to be altered. The cost of duplication shall be limited to the direct cost of producing the copy of a record in that electronic format. The association may deliver specifically identified records by electronic transmission or machine-readable storage media as long as those records can be transmitted in a redacted format that prevents the records from being altered

It does not matter. What you should be keeping in mind is this, from Florida statutes:

The right to inspect the records includes the right to make or obtain copies, at the reasonable expense, if any, of the member or authorized representative of such member.

The condo association will almost assuredly bill you for the COA attorney's time.

You should either hire your own attorney to figure out how to get what you want, or only ask for those records specifically mentioned in FS 718 as being "official records."

First, I believe the reality is as LoriM15 already indicated: Florida statutes do not expressly, or even vaguely IMO, require that the COA provide the bank statements. One could even argue that the HOA is being generous in even offering the bank statements.

Second, of course what this HOA is saying is required for legal and liability protection is pretty much ridiculous. That's life when a volunteer HOA Board asks for an attorney to make sure all i's are dotted and t's crossed.

Third, the OP should stick with requesting only that which Florida statutes and the bylaws say he/she can inspect.

Given the redactions required; the HOA's need to protect itself; the board's fiduciary duty; et cetera, AFAIC it's easy to argue that what the HOA states is required is reasonable.

And regardless, the OP simply does not have the legal right to look at bank statements. Arguably the OP is the one being unreasonable.

I'd like to know why they have requested bank statements. There is just so much we don't know and posters here going to "the board is trying to hide something" is just ridiculous. None of us know the circumstances.

There should be monthly general ledger reports and, as required in Florida for most COA's, a yearly audited financial report. Have they seen those?

I get that we have a couple of very vocal California residents who post a lot and have had bad experiences with their HOAs or COAs. One of them posted recently to another member here "you don't have to comment on every post". Take your own advice.

This is Florida law, not California. We have a very detailed, robust statute for our HOAs and COAs. Not all associations are trying to hide things from homeowners. Florida requires that condos with more than 150 units post, among other documents, monthly financials, yearly financials, and budgets.

If you have a group that is asking for three years of past bank statements, then there's a severe conflict. As a board member, protecting the association and myself, I would ask that our attorney review the material also. This also might be a requirement of the board's Directors and Operators insurance attorney. As I said before, none of us know enough detail about this to comment about the circumstances.

I believe it is illegal in Florida to ask why someone wants a record.
And it seems bank statements are not on the list of records that can't be ordered but all financial statements can be ordered.

http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr/lsc/documents/OfficialRecordsofourCondominiumAssociation.pdf

Can't require the purpose of the request.

Some questions make sense, but this board sometimes asks questions that, while they may satisfy a curiosity, are irrelevant.

It is irrelevant why the financial statements are desired. It is enough that they are. And responsible of the owners to want to review them.

Re: routing number, it is public information: any bank will tell you what it is.

Re: account number: it is on every check the Association writes. So it is not secret. And you can’t withdraw funds with just an account number. Otherwise, we'd all have big worries from all the utilities, vendors, etc. that we write checks to. Although, if you were grossly dishonest, you could use the number to deposit funds into the Association account (oh my).

So calling in an attorney is absurd. I'd refuse to pay.

You account number is on your check. So every person you wrote a check to has your bank account number. And every business. Which means every vendor has it. Every utility. Every relative, friend, store. The government has it. Your dog walker has it. And so on.

Too late, the cat (or dog) is out of the bag.

And I do not put my faith in the collective wisdom of Google. Quantity is not quality. I’ll take the word of my bank manager over the nameless, faceless, ravening horde any day.

Your HOA pays for Halloween costume parties?

No they don't. No one does. This was an EXAMPLE of how you don't know HOW that expense you see is applied and in what context. Seeing an amount written does not give you context on why an HOA spent the money they did.

We wrote a check for repairs for a window that was leaking. The receipt would say "Window repairs". It was written to an individual that was a HOA member. You would see the check and go? Look the HOA doesn't own any windows! Why are they paying for window repairs? Why are they paying this member's window repairs??? Why the HOA must be paying kick backs to a HOA member etc... Reality? The windows at the clubhouse were leaking. The member is a handyman. He was paid to fix the leaking windows. Would you know that if you saw a check written to a HOA member in the bank statements? No. Thus witch hunting to find a reason to complain without context.

Board can't ask for reason to inspect/copy records.
718 is really hard to read the correct section but it ends in 11c1

"The association may adopt reasonable rules regarding the frequency, time, location, notice, and manner of record inspection and copying BUT MAY NOT REQUIRE A MEMBER TO DEMONSTRATE ANY PURPOSE OR STATE ANY REASON FOR THE INSPECTION."

I stand corrected. Thank you for providing a citation from FS 718. Since FS 718 is apposite, it trumps what FS 617 says.

I think having an attorney (or the PM or a board member) may be a holdover from the days of paper records, when it was important to preserve the originals.

Or if a particular homeowner has threatened legal action against the association, it's absolutely appropriate to have the attorney present. (Not saying that this is the case here.)

Redacting account numbers or personally identifiable information is just basic security. Data is a corporate asset, and the board is obligated to protect it.