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NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
There are only three board members and one resigned and then rescinded it. The president won't accept her withdrawl of her resignation but I accept it. What can be done to bring her back on the board. Also, the president is refusing to talk to me about it, acting like a child.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
I am of the expectation that the board voted to accept or reject the withdrawl of the resignation.

Since the vote was one for and one against, the measure failed.

Realistically, there might not be anything you can do to get that individual back on the board until the next election.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
For now you'll have to appoint someone else since you two couldn't agree on the resignation of the other person. I suspect something's going on between the president and the previous board member, who may have quit in a huff, then changed her mind. If those two can't straighten out whatever happened, it may be better to bring in a third person who can keep the personalities separate from conducting board business.

It also wouldn't hurt to establish a policy regarding resignations, such as they must be in writing, have an effective date (otherwise it takes effect immediately or within 30 days from the letter date),and presented at or before the next board meeting. The board must vote to accept or reject the resignation if it's rejected, the board member should bring in someone for the board's consideration (he or she will serve out the term and then be elected or replaced by another during board elections.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
A resignation is final if it has been done properly (in writing and delivered to either the president or the secretary). The board does not have to "approve it" since board service is voluntary, you can't force someone to continue if they don't want to. Nor can it be rescinded. If the person changes their mind after officially resigning, then the board would need to appoint them to the now vacant position - this does require a vote of the board.

Pro tip for board members: do not bat off angry emails to the rest of the board or resign in a huff. Emails are often considered "in writing" and thus a valid resignation. And once you're off the board, the rest of them may decide to appoint someone else. This is normal practice.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Tennessee corporate statutes confirm that the resignation is effective immediately. I agree with others who say it cannot be rescinded. If the resignee wants back on the board, and as CathyA3 notes, the board would have to vote to appoint him or her to the vacant seat.

Nicole, if you want to see the statute section that says this, ask. Also please confirm or deny: Is this a condominium? Is this HOA/COA incorporated?

Please answer all questions that readers here ask you.
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
This is an HOA and yes I would like to see the Tennessee corporate status. I will add that she is the only one that doesn’t work so she handles a lot of board and community stuff. I’m a nurse and work 12 hour shifts and the president works and is out of the state or country for business. We don’t have the time that she does and she is crucial to the board. I did tell the president that I will have to resign, not as a threat, but to let him know that I/we don’t have the time to do what she has done. What will happen if it’s only the president on the board.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/03/2023 7:22 AM
This is an HOA and yes I would like to see the Tennessee corporate [statute section].
From the Tennessee Nonprofit Corporation statute:

Section 48-58-107 - Resignation of directors
(a) A director may resign at any time by delivering written notice to the board of directors, its chair or president, or to the corporation.
(b) A resignation is effective when the notice is effective unless the notice specifies a later effective date. If a resignation is made effective at a later date, the board may fill the pending vacancy before the effective date if the board provides that the successor does not take office until the effective date.


If you need an explanation of the meaning of "when the notice is effective," please ask. For now I will say that, if she emailed the resignation, and since you both received it, the notice is effective, and she has resigned. If she wants her position back, she now has to seek appointment, by the remaining directors, to the position.

What is the exact wording this person used when she resigned?

Lastly, please understand that directors and officers are legally two distinct roles. Often at HOAs and COAs, a director is simultaneously an officer. If non-director officers are allowed, then it is possible this person might not have resigned as an officer.
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
She said she was resigning on June 23rd due to differences with the president.
What is a director vs officer
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/03/2023 7:22 AM
What will happen if it’s only the president on the board.
Per the Tennessee Nonprofit Corporation Act, and unless the bylaws say otherwise, he has the right to appoint one new director. Once this director is appointed, the two directors now serving decide whom to appoint as a third director. The term of the appointees lasts until the next annual meeting.

See https://casetext.com/statute/tennessee-code/title-48-corporations-and-associations/nonprofit-corporations/chapter-58-directors-and-officers/part-1-board-of-directors/section-48-58-111-vacancy-on-board .

If there is anything you do not understand in the statute section, ask. Do not assume. The vocabulary in statute sections is often confusing to people new to reading statutes.

If only one director remains, and he/she does not appoint another director, then the Board (meaning the one director) is not supposed to take any board actions. This is because quorum is not met. Association business will be frozen. This can have devastating effects. If you want to know more, ask.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/03/2023 7:37 AM
She said she was resigning on June 23rd due to differences with the president.
What is a director vs officer
Nicole, exactly what did she say? It makes a difference.

The board consists solely of directors. When a vote by the board is requested, only directors vote.

Officers assist the board. Officers have input but no vote.

When a person is simultaneously both a director and an officer, and when the board votes, the person is wearing his/her "director's hat."

Do your bylaws require that all officers be directors? Please quote exactly what requirements your bylaws give for a person to be a director. This will make a difference in determining the status of the woman who "resigned."
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ElleN on 07/03/2023 7:45 AM
Please quote exactly what requirements your bylaws give for a person to be a director.
Post-o. The above should be:

Please quote exactly what requirements your bylaws give for a person to be an officer.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/03/2023 7:22 AM
This is an HOA and yes I would like to see the Tennessee corporate status. I will add that she is the only one that doesn’t work so she handles a lot of board and community stuff. I’m a nurse and work 12 hour shifts and the president works and is out of the state or country for business. We don’t have the time that she does and she is crucial to the board. I did tell the president that I will have to resign, not as a threat, but to let him know that I/we don’t have the time to do what she has done. What will happen if it’s only the president on the board.

And then who will run the association??? Do you want a bunch of newbies in the job who may have no idea what to do or who to turn to for help because you're working, the president is out of state and the former board member - well who the hell knows?

I understand you're busy, but you and the president knew your schedules before you signed on, but left most of the donkey work to the third member, which isn't fair. No wonder she quit, especially if the president behaved like a brat and frankly, you're no better if you leave the board down to one person. Do you at least plan to recruit your replacement and perhaps jot down some notes (several) to help get that person up to speed on what you three were doing and why?

I understand it's difficult to do much else when you have a demanding job, but there's more to HOA board membership than showing up to a meeting once a month and deciding how to spend money. I would think you had some days off between those 12-hour shifts - even reading a few proposals for association work and making comments would be useful.

Technically, your "board" could run with one person, but if she's smart, she'll recruit two people to serve out your term and the term of the former board member. However, it's not just about finding a homeowner who can fog a mirror, as I said earlier, so if you and your neighbors leave everything to her and no one else steps up, all of you should shut your yap if she then does something you don't like.

Or....she'll get as fed up and meet the association attorney and discuss putting the association in receivership. If granted, a judge would appoint a receiver who would run the association. That person only answers to the judge and is mostly responsible for ensuring the bills get paid, so if assessments have to go way the hell up to pay the attorney fees, court costs, the association's routine expenses, depositing money in reserves, and the receiver's fee (it's not cheap), so be it. By the way, you and your neighbors, including the president and former board member, would have no say whatsoever in how the community is run.

Cathy had a great conversation (at least two) on her association, which was down to a tiny number of board members - read them and consider your next step carefully. You could have the president and former director meet with you and see if you (them) work out their differences - I suppose this could be considered an executive session or you can have an open meeting and everyone will hear about the drama. That could be a way to recruit new people so all of you can step down, but then work with them for a smooth transition.


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Nicole, can you please send us the exact written words the director wrote to resign? If she didn't write it correctly, she still might be a director.

If she is a director AND she also is an officer, say, secretary, and meant to get away for the prez completely, she needed to write that she resigns as a director and as secretary of th xxx Association.

But, what size IS your association? Do you have a community manager?
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Nicole, can you please send us the exact written words the director wrote to resign? If she didn't write it correctly, she still might be a director.

If she is a director AND she also is an officer, say, secretary, and meant to get away for the prez completely, she needed to write that she resigns as a director and as secretary of th xxx Association.

But, what size IS your association? Do you have a community manager?
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
She was the vice president and secretary. Our community has 264 homes in it.

She wrote

Please accept this as my official resignation from $@&&::@@ board of directors effective June 23, 2023. Over the past two years we have had difference of opinion regarding the best practices and goals for $$@:$(. With that being said, I feel that my resignation is the best option.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
That sounds unambiguous - she resigned.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Based on what she wrote, she still is VP and she still is secretary. She did not write that she resigned from these offices. This means she still is in charge of the meeting minutes. As no longer a director however, she may not vote at board meetings.

Also note that she asked that her resignation be "accepted." This is not required, though most people, for unknown reasons, seem to think it is. Perhaps it is in TN, but I doubt it. Still I believe her resignation as a board member is valid.

Given all that she does for your community, I hope you can persuade the prez to vote with you to have her as a board member.

BTW, with an HOA your size, usually there would be more directors, e.g., 5. What do your Bylaws say about that? Do you have a community/property manager???

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Also: she s till is VP & sec'y OF your bylaws permit non-directors to be officers. My impression is that most do, but check yours.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
From the wording and the state statute, I agree the woman has resigned as a director.

I also agree that if the bylaws permit a non-director to serve as either VP or Secretary, then she still holds these officer positions. She cannot vote at board meetings. She can provide input at board meetings, when asked for input or when she needs clarification on her duties. Else she carries out the functions of the VP and Secretary as given in the bylaws and state law.
JackS20 (North Carolina)
Posts: 271
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ElleN on 07/04/2023 12:38 PM
From the wording and the state statute, I agree the woman has resigned as a director.

I also agree that if the bylaws permit a non-director to serve as either VP or Secretary, then she still holds these officer positions. She cannot vote at board meetings. She can provide input at board meetings, when asked for input or when she needs clarification on her duties. Else she carries out the functions of the VP and Secretary as given in the bylaws and state law.

So she resigned as director and lost all her power and now she's gonna come back with no voting power and do a lot of the work? That would be surprising!

A board member in our HOA threatened to resign, via email when I told her she should be in charge of a new project. I wrote a polite reponse back, but the truth is it would not effect how the HOA board runs as she just shows up for meetings and doesn't reduce the workload for the other board members.

The moral being if you threaten to quit the board but dont' do anywork anyways no one will really care.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JackS20 on 07/04/2023 4:58 PM
So she resigned as director and lost all her power and now she's gonna come back with no voting power and do a lot of the work? That would be surprising!
I think non-director owners volunteer all the time to serve in the Treasurer and Secretary positions. Maybe they like the board and want them to stick around as long as possible. So they pitch in to help take off some of the load.

ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JackS20 on 07/04/2023 4:58 PM
A board member in our HOA threatened to resign, via email when I told her she should be in charge of a new project.
I hope you realize that neither you nor the board can require a director to do work outside their duties as a director.
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
In our bylaws it states there must be three or more directors. We only had three because no one else wants to be on it. Also, the problem is that the president won’t even talk to me about the situation, whether we vote her back on or vote for a new person. Tennessee law requires three directors so I’m not sure what I can do. I don’t want to be held liable because of him.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I don't think you'l be "liable" for anything, but at your next board meeting, you could make a motion something like: "Our Bylaws and TN require three directors. I move that we appoint the willing and experienced xxx [the one who resigned] as a director to comply with the law." Even if the prez fails to second it, or votes against it, you personally are on record as trying to comply with state statute and your Bylaws. (I'm not in any legal field)

Speaking of being "on record": Who will write meeting minutes? do you have a property/communty manager?
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
I honestly don’t know who will write them.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/05/2023 3:57 PM
In our bylaws it states there must be three or more directors. We only had three because no one else wants to be on it. Also, the problem is that the president won’t even talk to me about the situation, whether we vote her back on or vote for a new person. Tennessee law requires three directors so I’m not sure what I can do. I don’t want to be held liable because of him.
Per the nonprofit corporation act, the owners can call a special meeting and elect a new director.

You should inform the HOA attorney of what is going on and ask her/his advice.
JackS20 (North Carolina)
Posts: 271
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ElleN on 07/04/2023 5:51 PM
Posted By JackS20 on 07/04/2023 4:58 PM
A board member in our HOA threatened to resign, via email when I told her she should be in charge of a new project.
I hope you realize that neither you nor the board can require a director to do work outside their duties as a director.

It's not really a new project. This directors is always bringing up violations and saying there is no follow up to cure them. I suggested she do the follow up is all. I thought she would say yes, because she seems passionate about the issue, turns out I was wrong, She just wanted to complain it wasn't being done.
NicoleP2 (Tennessee)
Posts: 7
Posted:
Update: I spoke with our HOA attorney and she said because she rescinded her resignation within the two weeks she gave us and that we technically didn’t vote on it even though the president said he accepted her resignation, she is still part of the board. Obviously, the president is not happy but there is nothing he can do besides complain.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NicoleP2 on 07/06/2023 6:19 PM
Update: I spoke with our HOA attorney and she said because she rescinded her resignation within the two weeks she gave us and that we technically didn’t vote on it
You should ask her to interpret the corporate statute section above and from where she got the two week rule. Otherwise, this attorney is incompetent.

God, two weeks? Pfft. Has she no idea what kind of chaos this can cause? E.g. suppose the board went ahead and appointed someone else to the board position. Then the other director rescinds the resignation.

There's a reason the statute is specific about when a resignation takes effect.

On the other hand: You got the answer you wanted. Arguably you and the president cannot, without a third director, fire the HOA attorney. Either you pull this maneuver and go forward with three directors, or things continue at a standstill.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
My blush is the resignation can be rescinded prior to it's effective date. Until it's effective date it is more "informational" versus effective.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 07/07/2023 8:34 AM
My blush is the resignation can be rescinded prior to it's effective date.
This is what the statute section (see above) says. The OP's HOA's attorney says otherwise.
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posted:
As I understand it, the board member submitted the resignation around June 9, to be effective two weeks later on June 23. Then sometime during those two weeks before June 23, she rescinded the resignation before the resignation date.

So the resignation was rescinded before it become effective, so she is still part of the board. That seems to be the interpretation of the attorney.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JeffT2 on 07/07/2023 12:09 PM
As I understand it, the board member submitted the resignation around June 9, to be effective two weeks later on June 23. Then sometime during those two weeks before June 23, she rescinded the resignation before the resignation date.
If these are the facts, then I agree the statute says she is still a director.

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