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MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
My CCR states: TENTH:Trucks, trailers, boats, motorcycles and commercial and recreational vehicles shall be kept garaged overnight when on or about the Lot or Street.

The Board of Directors is deciding to fine someone for having a recreational vehicle but is overlooking trucks.

It doesn't feel right to follow the CCR and fine for one thing but not the other.

-Mark

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
There are pickup trucks and there are the ones with the huge trailers, and concrete tricjs - I suspect the CCRs refer to the ones like the Ford F150 and the like. Note the bigger the vehicle, the harder it will be on the concrete because it's heavier- like a RV. RVs and big ass vehicles like that can also create blind spots (aka traffic hazards) because you might not be able to see around them and they can take up space making it difficult for fire trucks to drive on the street.

If you're the one being fined, you know all of this already and should have kept that in mind when you bought your RV. That being said, it's OK to file an appeal and note the number of trucks still on the street. Take time and date stamped photos. You might also ask what time is being considered when this is enforced, e.g. 11 pm, as opposed to, say 8 pm

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 200
Posted:
Mark,

For better or worse, HOA Board of Directors are permitted latitude in how they enforce the rules. While it is obviously best to enforce all equally, it is generally not required that all rules are enforced in the same manner. Attorneys would advise that any homeowner can enforce the CC&Rs through a private lawsuit. While I wouldn't necessarily doing that, you certainly could ask your Board if it would be preferable for you to file a private lawsuit as they can't seem to do the job that they are supposed to do. That will definitely ruffle feathers but also may encourage them to do their job.
MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
I'm the one on the Board fining someone for having a commercial vehicle but I feel bad about it because our CCR says no trucks and no fines have gonna out to the truck owners.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 200
Posted:
I am not sure how your documents (probably rules and regulations) define commerical vehicles. In my HOA, commerical vehicles are only those that meet any one of the criteria below:

1) GVW above 10,000 pounds
2) Things that stick out beyond the permiter of the vehicle, like cranes
3) Dual rear tires or dual rear axles

Thus, it's pretty black and white for us to enforce. Either they meet the policy or do not.

We once had a homeowner complain about a commercial vehicle with a GVW of exactly 10,000 pounds. I had the property manager inform the complaining party that the policy only applies to vehicles above 10,000 pounds and thus the subject vehicle was allowed.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Michael makes a great point. It may be a good idea to clarify what a truck is and explain why the RV has to go inside a garage. With dso many people able to bring home work vehicles nowadays, perhaps this portion of the CCRs should be updated. Read your documents to see how that's done.

I know you may feel bad about the rule enforcement, but that's one of the duties of the board. Its not always easy, but board members have a duty to apply rules consistently and equally. They can also be amended, so bring that suggestion to the board and see what happens. In the meantime, don't forget this owner is just as responsible for knowing the rules as everyone else. If he or she chose to ignore it, he/she has to pay the consequences.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
In your governing documents how is the word Truck defined? There should be a glossary of terms.
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
You're going to have unqualified, volunteer individuals who don't make a dime for their "work" making those kinds of decisions?
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelT21 on 03/22/2023 5:14 PM
I am not sure how your documents (probably rules and regulations) define commerical vehicles. In my HOA, commerical vehicles are only those that meet any one of the criteria below:

1) GVW above 10,000 pounds
2) Things that stick out beyond the permiter of the vehicle, like cranes
3) Dual rear tires or dual rear axles

Thus, it's pretty black and white for us to enforce. Either they meet the policy or do not.

We once had a homeowner complain about a commercial vehicle with a GVW of exactly 10,000 pounds. I had the property manager inform the complaining party that the policy only applies to vehicles above 10,000 pounds and thus the subject vehicle was allowed.

Seriously, that's your criteria for a commercial vehicle. Didn't see anything about signage.
MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
Just says Trucks.
MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LetA on 03/22/2023 7:12 PM
In your governing documents how is the word Truck defined? There should be a glossary of terms.

Just says trucks.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MarkB28 on 03/22/2023 3:45 PM

The Board of Directors is deciding to fine someone for having a recreational vehicle but is overlooking trucks.

It doesn't feel right to follow the CCR and fine for one thing but not the other.

As someone said, a board can do what a board can do.
Be it right, wrong or indifferent.
That is until someone challenges the board.

The problem a board faces when enforcing a covenant on one vs. all is that they give the member a defense of selective enforcement.
Of course, that defense would have to be through the courts, which can be expensive.

LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MarkB28 on 03/23/2023 1:43 AM
Posted By LetA on 03/22/2023 7:12 PM
In your governing documents how is the word Truck defined? There should be a glossary of terms.


Just says trucks.

Trucks is a beyond ambiguous word, unless defined I would interpret that as a vehicle over 10,000# GVW
and requiring a Class A or B license to operate.
MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LetA on 03/23/2023 1:51 PM
Posted By MarkB28 on 03/23/2023 1:43 AM
Posted By LetA on 03/22/2023 7:12 PM
In your governing documents how is the word Truck defined? There should be a glossary of terms.


Just says trucks.


Trucks is a beyond ambiguous word, unless defined I would interpret that as a vehicle over 10,000# GVW
and requiring a Class A or B license to operate.

Ah, okay. You mean like a Mack truck?
GuyM1 (Ohio)
Posts: 318
Posted:
As I have been through the court system for this exact thing of parking a truck in my driveway in Ohio. I won the case by showing others and even board members of parking SUVs, trucks, and things that are in the CC&Rs. I proved by Federal ratings that SUVs were listed under trucks and several owners had them including the board. If others have any of the ones listed they are violating the same. If Board picks and chooses that is selective enforcement which is a no-no.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Regarding parking restrictions, our lawyers said that these restrictions have to be "reasonable". They also noted that many people nowadays drive pickup trucks as their primary vehicles, rather than cars. So many parking restrictions may be out of date and may no longer be considered reasonable by a court.

Also, there are trucks and then there are trucks. Our CC&Rs mention things like size and weight rating to determine if the restriction applies to that particular vehicle. Looking at a single sentence in your parking restriction may be misleading if there are other qualifying statements in the restriction.

(We're condos, so any parking outside of garages will be on common elements. The association has an interest in preventing damage to and promoting safety in these areas. An HOA of single family homes will have different concerns, although private streets in HOAs will have many of the same issues as those in condo communities.)

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
As Cathy said defining a "truck/commercial vehicle" is near impossible. In my last HOA (each home at at least least a two car and at least a 4 car driveway) commercial vehicles could not be parked in the driveway overnight. We defined commercial vehicles as having signage (no matter the size of the vehicle) and/or construction equipment in the bed.

Also commercial plates do not define a commercial vehicle. In SC one can have commercial plates on their average style car as it allows one hour parking in a Commercial Loading/Unloading zones. Reason is one may have to move things from their car to their business.

We had one incident where one complained about a truck with 4 rear tires (called a dually). As it had no signage nor equipment on it, we ruled it was not a commercial vehicle regardless of its size. Another incident. Two identical mini-vans. One had a sign on the door saying Airport Shuttle and a phone number. We ruled the one with a sign to be commercial. Someone reported a Highway Patrol cruiser as commercial due to signage. We ruled safety vehicle were not commercial regardless of signage.

I believe SUV's fall under the designation of a truck for manufacturing/safety reasons. Trying to define a "truck" can get tricky.
MarkB28 (New York)
Posts: 40
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GuyM1 on 03/30/2023 8:32 AM
As I have been through the court system for this exact thing of parking a truck in my driveway in Ohio. I won the case by showing others and even board members of parking SUVs, trucks, and things that are in the CC&Rs. I proved by Federal ratings that SUVs were listed under trucks and several owners had them including the board. If others have any of the ones listed they are violating the same. If Board picks and chooses that is selective enforcement which is a no-no.

Ah, thanks! That is perfect.

Also, I tried searching for Federal Ratings for trucks and came up empty. Could you provide a link for information regarding Federal Ratings for trucks? Thank you very much.

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