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LynneV1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 211
Posted:
I am concerned that our board of directors are planning to install an 150ft. French drain system on privately owned property to drain into a community pond for our newly elected director's home.
we had an election mid October and after he won his wife stood up and said so when do we get our new French drains. at that point the president said we'll discuss that after the meeting. now February 1st they announced our next project is to put in French drains to help with puddling and that the homeowner would chip in a little and we would pay the rest. Our fund is practically broke and I and I believe it's illegal to use funds to benefit one homeowner which isn't even on community owned property. there was no discussion of this or vote at the meeting It was just stated it will be done. I know for a fact over the past two years two other directors have put in French drains in their yard going down to the pond and I believe we were billed for the expense.
I asked about it once and was told, Buy the board president that he chipped in on the bill the community only paid for the part where it hit the top of the pond hill by the pond which is common area.
We didn't get to see these bills and we did not get to see any proof of his share of the expense paid.
Isn't this misuse, embezzlement of funds or theft or something?
WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522
Posted:
Sure does sound like it. Unfortunatley in SC the dumb legislator hasn't made any rules that force HOA BOD to disclose when there meetings will be. not sure there is anyway to fight this other than sending certified letter threatening to sue and then sueing.

might be worth it to get records of HOA Before declaring war on them so they dont' know what you are up to.

vis ta vie
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
In SC the BOD must inform you of their next meeting upon your request to know.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
First your HOA is a non profit. So the budget will most always look "broke" if your spending the right amount of money. Which is as much as you collect in. Anything outside of that is called a "special assessment" which takes a vote to do.

Having had to deal with French drains in a HOA and doing it myself, it is a good project. We had several issues even with 2 homes flooding. If we did not address it the owners may have been able to sue us for the flooding damages.

I would ask at next meeting or mailing a letter, how the process works. I would quote from the HOA documents about special assessment process. Plus where is the information about the entire project? Did they start out at their house and plan the other areas? It takes time for each project. Now a days materials and labor an issue.

A proper french drain should have holes in it and covered with a "sock" material. It can be buried just 2 or 3 feet down. It is enough to guide the water out of let is absorb in ground.

Former HOA President
LynneV1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 211
Posted:
We have quarterly meetings. we had a meeting in October for the election and were given a balance sheet on the way out. the next day I questioned why we had a negative homeowner equity of -$8700 dollars with liabilities pending of over $16,000. So they called a special meeting a month later and said and said we were in good shape not to worry. We collect funds quarterly so October 1st money would come in but it seemed to be just enough to cover the $16,000 and maybe one month's worth of new debt. I explained this to the board and mgmt company and they and they agreed to discuss personally and then raised the HOA fees $5 A month by mail. they then approved a $7000 contract to put some rocks along one side of a pond in December even though broke and would not be able to pay that bill till January. we have 231 h/o and 49 were in arrears in October but we were not told the total aging arrears or accts receivables....it is secret. They actually left it off the balance sheet which is unbelievable.
So now February 1st meeting comes and they say our next project is going to be putting in 150 feet of drainage... Our next open meeting will be May 2023. This project will be done by then.
and no, the mgmt Company doesn't let me look at their books. I've asked three times since November.
My question is can I call the district attorney in my county if they spend money illegally?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Our HOA does not release collections to anyone but the BOard. They are the ones who take the actions to collect.

Are you asking the right questions to the right people? Are you asking the HOA to view the records? Plus asking the MC to see your HOA's records? They may think your asking for their MC records.

If you want copies you may have to make them yourself by picture or pay for them. Copies are not free but views are.

Suing your HOA is suing yourself and your neighbors. So reporting them for an investigation means you and your neighbors paying for any of the damages they may find...

Former HOA President
LynneV1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 211
Posted:
Thank you Melissa. My reply to you is that our homes have been here 17 years. There has been no flooding. That homeowner just purchased the home in 2022 and decided to put a gazebo in his backyard and decking which backs up to the fence. He doesn't want a puddle by his gazebo after rain. We have 6 ponds and all our properties slant towards the retention ponds. only one other homeowners on my pond had put in French drain on "their" property, at their expense. I don't think it should be a community expense to fix the problem of one person.
LynneV1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 211
Posted:
And yes I believe I'm asking the right questions. I was a board member for four years on and off.
I was told by this new management company nobody sees the records and nobody makes copies. And if you come into the office. no cameras or cell phones allowed.
Most my neighbors don't care about the HOA issues.
When I looked at the balance sheet, I asked how much of the income was prepaid fees for the October qt that came in early and I didn't see accounts receivable. And he said well we already net that with the liabilities, so you didn't need to see it. I said You can't net assets and liabilities on the balance sheet that's what the balance sheets is for. ps the liabilities was one line. It wasn't even broken down. I just feel they are scamming us.
I don't know who else to discuss this with, so I'm back on your forum after a long absence, because you guys always give good advice.
WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LynneV1 on 02/03/2023 11:29 AM

and no, the mgmt Company doesn't let me look at their books. I've asked three times since November.
My question is can I call the district attorney in my county if they spend money illegally?

denying a member access to records is probably illegal. go to thier office after 5 days after you send certified letter return receipt and demand access. show up in person or they will probably just ignore you.
district attorney is probably gonna tell you nothing they can do and tell you to sue them.

basically it boils down to the same thing regardless of state. If the BOD wont' cooperate then you have to sue.

Attending a board meeting after the work has been done wont' help much becuase the money is already pissed away.

Records Inspection
Members of an HOA have a right to inspect or copy the association’s records as stipulated in Section 33-31-1602 of the South Carolina Nonprofit Corporation Act. The member must provide the association with written notice at least five days prior. Records up for inspection include accounting records, membership lists, and more.


vis ta vie
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I am smelling now more of an MC issue than maybe the board. Remember the President and members are depending on the MC for advice and guidance. It may be they do not know where their nose is being led.

I am not defending your board as I do not know the whole story and never will. However, I would question the relationship the MC has with them. It may be the blind leading the blind?

The MC is hired by the HOA. Sometimes that line gets blurred. Maybe time to put on some glasses.

Former HOA President
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Please follow Wendy's advice, Lynne. Request the records as she advises. It's a start. that way, you'll see the contract and that it's on the owner's plat/lot not on the common areas.

(Best to ignore Melissa on this topic.)
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 02/03/2023 11:38 AM
Our HOA does not release collections to anyone but the BOard. They are the ones who take the actions to collect.

Are you asking the right questions to the right people? Are you asking the HOA to view the records? Plus asking the MC to see your HOA's records? They may think your asking for their MC records.

If you want copies you may have to make them yourself by picture or pay for them. Copies are not free but views are.

Suing your HOA is suing yourself and your neighbors. So reporting them for an investigation means you and your neighbors paying for any of the damages they may find...

While an owner may not be able to see which individual owner is delinquent in their payment of assessments, the Balance Sheet should provide any owner the ability to see what their Accounts Receivable look like. At the very least, an owner should be able to have a Balance Sheet and an Income Expense sheet on a regular basis, after all, it is their money funding this corporation.
LynneV1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 211
Posted:
Thank you for your advice. I do question Melissa's premise that any of the 230 other homeowners would be responsible for one homeowner's yard that floods. We all have residential homes on individual lots which we purchased. Our homes were built on former swampland in Myrtle Beach. The water level is 12 to 24 inches below our homes. Most of Myrtle Beach is 1 foot above sea level. But it's a beautiful town.
I was at a surveyor's office once and he got a phone call and then he looked at me and said there's always one house in every community that has flooding, and they tend to blame everyone else for it.
And I do have the GIS County maps which you can pull up online to see what the boundaries are for each home and for each lot of common property.
I will attempt to go down to MC and see the books again another day. And I'd like to see the bill that comes in when the job is done. I doubt they would show me the estimate for the work before it's done.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
As Wendy advised, Lynn, you want to send your request to review some financials in writing, return receipt requested, signed & dated. After you know they've rec'd it, then go vist them

If a contract has been approved by the board and executed, most state allow owners to review them. Wendy or JohnC know about SC.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
A HOA is ONLY funded by it's members for it's members. In our case we had 2 properties that flooded when it rained due to a failure in a water pipe from the neighborhood above us. The Corp of Engineers was to get involved due it being dumped into a natural stream etc... The natural stream was on the border of our HOA. We tried working with the county and city as well. Long story short... It ended up being on the HOA to pay for the French drain and building a berm. The land was on "Common property" but the cause was not.

So our HOA money had to be spent on 2 owners issues although we have 107 owners. Plus oddly enough we also had to get those two pieces of property put on the "Flood plain" map. That way the owners could qualify for flood insurance. The way insurance works is flood insurance is not required/option unless your on a flood plain map. The owners of those house could not get flood insurance for their homes because the HOA owned the property around it.

As for getting a copy of the records, you do need to write the HOA/Board to request to view them where they are kept. The MC should allow you to view them.


Former HOA President
TomG16 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7
Posted:
99% of HOA boards will do what benefit them personally. It's all about power over others, ego, personal gain. A carbon copy of what they do in D.C.
WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TomG16 on 02/09/2023 6:18 AM
99% of HOA boards will do what benefit them personally. It's all about power over others, ego, personal gain. A carbon copy of what they do in D.C.

based on what? your experience with one HOA? Probably closer to 33% based on studies on unethical behavior in businesses.
Although I do think type A personalities seem to be attracted to serving on HOA boards. Psychology experiments like the Milgram experiment where people were ordered to shock people to death give a glimpse into why HOA boards can sometimes go overboard. Apparently when given a set of rules many people will obey them even if it means their subject dies.

https://www.simplypsychology.org/milgram.html

vis ta vie

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