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SusanH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 21
Posted:
Background: My HOA is relatively new - it was turned over to the owners in 2021, during the pandemic. Due to Covid and having owners who don't live full time in the community, all our meetings have taken place on Zoom. We also send out all dues statements and newsletters via email, and we recently did the same for budget information prior to a vote. (For big issues like that, we also post signs and follow up to make sure everyone received the email.) Last year we did mail paper to everyone prior to the annual meeting and elections.

Question: One homeowner has decided they want paper notices instead of electronic communication. They are refusing to accept emails from the HOA. Do you see any problem with charging a fee to this owner who wants paper sent by US Mail? Banks seem to charge $3 to $5 to customers who want paper statements instead of getting them online. Does a $3 fee sound reasonable? We would put an official policy in place and apply it equally to anyone else who wanted paper.

Has your HOA gone totally electronic - email, text, and website - and if so, is that working out?

Thanks!
Susan
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
In CA, certain materials must be sent to owners USPS, e.g., ballots. Owners have the right per statute to request that other items be sent to them USPS.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 200
Posted:
It depends on your by-laws and/or state law. Without knowing both of those, I cannot advise what is legal.

Honestly, for $3, I would probably accomodate the one owner who wants paper and do it for free. It's not like 1000 owners are requesting paper.
SusanH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 21
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelT21 on 01/05/2023 4:54 PM
It depends on your by-laws and/or state law. Without knowing both of those, I cannot advise what is legal.

Honestly, for $3, I would probably accomodate the one owner who wants paper and do it for free. It's not like 1000 owners are requesting paper.

We are working with an attorney to add virtual meetings to our CCRs (as already supported by NC law). I'll ask about adopting an electronic-by-default position formally.

The point of the $3 is to establish a policy that we would apply consistently to everyone and not make the rest of the neighborhood pay for one person's choice. This individual comes from a family of Vocational Dissidents. They are capable of receiving email, but this person has decided they do not want to receive email from me personally. It's pointless, because I will be the person who sends the paper mailing too. Having forced the board to consider this question was probably the actual point - to inconvenience us.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Did this homeowner explain why she only wants paper? I know some people prefer it because they like to hold something in their hands and there are still a lot of people who don't have internet access. You can determine if the lady's just being petty by asking if there were other concerns, such as the emails always wind up in her spam folder (if that's the case, she should add the HOA to a safe senders list in her email account and that should take care of it). Did she click on a link thinking it was the HOA and got a virus on her computer? That's the sort of thing that can be easy to address.

Although I agree with you that it's unfair to make accommodations like this for one person, it's probably easier to go ahead and send her the stuff via US Mail. I'd point out the added cost to the association because of it. Ask her to come to a meeting to discuss during resident forum. You might still end up sending the mailing, but it would be interesting if she's willing to explain herself in front of everyone - especially after you bring up the cost and convenience.

PS - if you have a website, you could post the newsletter information online - and then she can access it that way and even print it out if she wants. As for the assessment statements, you didn't say if this is annual, quarterly or monthly, but this would be a great time to encourage people to set up some sort of bill pay through their bank or the HOA property manager, if you have one. If it's through the resident's bank, they can do the automatic deduction or go online and send it every month. This way, they know the money's there and have proof of delivery instead of dealing with getting to the post office late, mail possibly getting lost or damaged, etc.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SusanH34 on 01/06/2023 6:26 AM
We are working with an attorney to add virtual meetings to our CCRs (as already supported by NC law). I'll ask about adopting an electronic-by-default position formally.
As others noted, if you quote here the section of the bylaws that addresses how notices are to be sent out, you could save the HOA some money. I see what the state statute says, but what the bylaws say is relevant too.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
One exception to be aware of: if a homeowner has a disability that would make online access difficult to use and the homeowner requests paper communications as a reasonable accommodation, then Fair Housing laws require the HOA to grant *an* accommodation (although not necessarily the disabled person's preferred accommodation). So the reasons behind the request are important. I assume you'd be able to charge a fee for paper communications since these sorts of accommodations are nearly always at the homeowner's expense - but I am not a lawyer and I'd want my HOA's attorney to say yay or nay on that part.

The above may be a reason that could prevent an HOA from making electronic communications an across-the-board requirement. You should assume there will always be a need for exceptions. I also agree that some state laws require paper/USPS notifications for some things.
SusanH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 21
Posted:
There is a long history with this person. I'll call them B. A few months ago B got mad at the HOA (again) and declared that they wanted to receive no communication from the HOA. At that point I suspect B blocked the HOA address or put it on their junk/spam list. This week, after the monthly dues amounts changed, B texted another board member and said they "do not accept notifications from the hoa email" and wanted paper.

We do have a website, but it was set up by the former President, whom B also hates. B seemed unable to figure out the website, so a lack of technical skill may have made B feel uncomfortable. Plenty of offers were made to assist B in learning to navigate it; all were refused. The HOA President resigned in the spring, and no one has been willing to take the job.

B does pay their dues monthly via their bank, and B needed to know the new amount to send. Instead of simply asking me, the treasurer, B chose to contact another board member. It's like the trope in sitcoms when people stop talking to each other but still need to communicate, so they make someone else relay their messages. "Tell him that I said..." "Well you can tell her to..." etc. You get the picture.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Susan

Typically there are some things that must be sent USPS such as Annual Meeting Notice, Dues increase notifications, etc so she will get paper copies. As far as the rest of it goes, I would say we communicate vie Email and our web site and let it go at that. Stop letting her upset you.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Yep, this borders on petty - and I don't know why your Board colleagues haven't decided to squash this. Their apparent unwillingness to stand up and stand behind their decisions may be why the president quit. If that's the case, y'all need an executive session to hash out your relationships and grow up, so someone can be elected president and know he/she will have the backing of his/her colleagues.

Now that I think of it, I dont know if it was you or someone else, but there was another conversation on this website about a homeowner who also requested paper correspondence only (may have been Michael). I remember said the resident doesn't have to read the information if he/she doesn't want to, but is still required to comply with whatever it says, like due dates for assessments. Not sending an assessment because you didn't know the due date (because you refused to read the HOA correspondence) is an excuse, and not a good one. Sometimes you have to call people on their BS.

In the meantime, there could be an issue with the web design (some work better than others), but the lady also refused any help, so that's her problem. Ditto for paying through her bank - she knows they're due every month and what the amount it (she could get that information from any board member or even her neighbor if she doesn't like you), so it makes no sense to ask for a monthly bill. All you do is go online, put in the new amount and the bank does the rest. That's how my bank operates and I can even schedule payments for several months at a time.

I agree with John - stop letting this lady upset you. She doesn't have to use the website if she doesn't want to, but pertinent information can be posted on the main page so no one has to spend a lot of time if they don't want - here's the due date, here's where you send your assessment, click on this if you want to pay online, or go to your bank to set up automatic deductions or bill pay. And here's the date of the next board meeting - thank you for reading, and now you can go back to whatever website floats your boat.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Just curious, Susan. would virtual meetings be more at home in your Bylaws since that's where meetings of all kinds are described?
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
In general, when you're dealing with a homeowner who is trying to create drama, the board's job is to remove the drama from their interactions. Over time, if the person isn't getting the emotional payoff of causing conflict, they'll start finding their entertainment elsewhere. But you have to be consistent - drop your guard and you'll be back to square one.

When I had to deal with our drama llamas, I kept my interactions with them brief, bland, and boring. Just the facts, ma'am, and no back and forth discussion:

"We are required by law to provide homeowners with this information. You can choose to ignore it, but you will still be responsible for knowing what has been communicated." End of discussion. I'm a big believer in the value of natural consequences in helping people to make smarter choices.

FWIW, this year we have started charging homeowners a $10 fee to cover printing and mailing costs if they wanted paper coupon books for paying their assessments. The encouragement to use electronic payment options was presented to the membership as reducing costs to keep assessments low - very few people would object to that.
MichaelH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 179
Posted:
KerryL1 & JohnC46

Our bylaws were written pre-covid and specify that notices:

"Unless otherwise provided in these Bylaws, all notices, demands, bills, statements, or other communications under these Bylaws shall be in writing and shall be deemed to have been duly given if delivered personally or if sent by United States mail, first class postage prepaid"

Since they were written, NC has come out with additional permissions for non-profits allowing electronic meetings and communications as official methods.

NC H320v6 Section 2 https://www.ncleg.gov/EnactedLegislation/SessionLaws/PDF/2021-2022/SL2021-162.pdf

as well as:

https://www.ncleg.gov/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/PDF/BySection/Chapter_66/GS_66-325.pdf
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Michael, would you please quote the statute section that says that NC nonprofits no longer have to send notices by U. S. mail? I do not see it at the sites you linked.
MichaelH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Ellen, actually I did. :-)

Section 2 primarily but if you search the pdf for "electronic" you'll find all the relevant sections.

One consideration is that if your bylaws explicitly prohibit electronic communication you may need to consult your attorney to see which document takes precedence and if your bylaws should be amended.
ElleN (Idaho)
Posts: 4,420
Posted:
Michael, if a NC HOA member does not wish to receive notices electronically, the statute sections you cited indicate the HOA is stuck with sending out notice in another lawful way. See 55A-1-41 and 55A-1-70 at https://www.ncleg.net/enactedlegislation/statutes/pdf/bychapter/chapter_55a.pdf.
MichaelH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 179
Posted:
I agree. I wasn't trying to say that an HOA no longer has to use US Mail just that electronic means are explicitly allowed in additional to mail.
SusanH34 (North Carolina)
Posts: 21
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 01/06/2023 10:22 AM
Just curious, Susan. would virtual meetings be more at home in your Bylaws since that's where meetings of all kinds are described?

Sure. I used CCRs as a shorthand for all our governing documents. I'm working with our attorney to add language that makes it easier for us to conduct business electronically and virtually, at his suggestion.

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