Code of Ethics

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Hello – I am the new President to the HOA of a property that is in financial ruin where the past board violated several civil codes over 10 years and I am now trying to clean up their mess. To add to that, our new management company is a nightmare. They have taken over every aspect of our HOA business, will not take our direction from us, will not do what we ask, have not given us a bank account access, and so much more. We have a meeting tomorrow and they just sent the agenda. BTW, they do no ask the board what we want to discuss, but rather add the topics they want and charge us $95 to run each meeting and $95 to take minutes. My question, however, is they have added a Code of Ethics to our board packet. We did not ask for this, nor do I wish to sign it. Our bylaws do not indicate anything about code of conduct or ethics and therefore, I am not required to sign this, correct? Can I be removed from the board if I refuse?

Thank you!!

CherylW5 (Georgia)
Posts: 1

Posted:

Hi - first, sounds like a mess to me. Can you copy/paste the code of ethics here? I'm curious as to why you would not want to sign it.
Regards.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Susan

Can you be removed form the BOD for not signing it. NO. Your BOD needs to wrestle control of your association back from the MC. Are your under owner control?

MichaelS56 (Minnesota)
Posts: 858

Posted:

Susan, you have a contract with the Management company that works FOR the BOARD. The Board needs to gain control or begin the process of terminating the contract.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

I don't trust them and therefore do not want to sign anything they drafted up. It's in Adobe and I am unable to copy and paste.

Unfortunately we cannot terminate them until after their one year period which ends 9/1/23. It's a nightmare. I understand they work for us and not the other way around, but they are impossible to work with and will just not listen. For example I asked that they email the home owners when an open session takes place along with the agenda. The agenda gets posted by law, but the H.O.'s have always been emailed as well. They said HOAs are getting away from "hand holding" the owners. I said, do it anyway and they refuse.

Is it illegal for them not to give us account access?

thanks!

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 11/30/2022 1:43 PM
Susan

Can you be removed form the BOD for not signing it. NO. Your BOD needs to wrestle control of your association back from the MC. Are your under owner control?

Sorry I am new to all of this - it's my first home, purchased 15 months ago. I have been President for 4 months. What do you mean under owner control?

thanks!

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

The MC sounds bad, Susan. But, on the other hand, individual directors may not usually direct the MC. Only the board does with its votes at meetings and/or the president has that authority. In the case you mention, have the board take vote to eblast owners 4 days ahead of board meetings.

I'm concerned though that you do not seem to know whether you can be kicked off the board for refusing to sign the Code of Ethics. Your bylaws will tell you the reasons for being removed from the board. Read them.

I'd guess that they do not state you're required to sign a Code of Ethics.

Btw, what size is your HOA? How many directors? Is there a property manager onsite? Or?

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 11/30/2022 2:22 PM

Posted By JohnC46 on 11/30/2022 1:43 PM
Susan

Can you be removed form the BOD for not signing it. NO. Your BOD needs to wrestle control of your association back from the MC. Are your under owner control?

Sorry I am new to all of this - it's my first home, purchased 15 months ago. I have been President for 4 months. What do you mean under owner control?

thanks!

it means the developer has finished building and all the homes have been sold to individual owners.

vis ta vie

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

the first thing you need to do is get a hold of the contract between the property mangt. company and your HOA. Read it through a few times.
Our states we had to pay a one month fee to transition the records to them. and we have to pay a 3 month fee when we terminate the contract, so right off the bat they want 4 months of profit.

also Big warning, if you want to terminate them, many contracts state you have to notify them 3 months or more in advance or the contract auto renews. so be on your toes cause if you miss that date another year of working with them follows.

vis ta vie

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Thanks Wendy - I read through it with a friend who is on their HOA. They want 90 days notice and can be terminated by either party with or without cause, but only after that one year expires. I think we are screwed, unless I can get them terminated for breech of contract such as not giving us account access to our money?

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 11/30/2022 2:44 PM
Thanks Wendy - I read through it with a friend who is on their HOA. They want 90 days notice and can be terminated by either party with or without cause, but only after that one year expires. I think we are screwed, unless I can get them terminated for breech of contract such as not giving us account access to our money?

you might want to copy and paste the exact language here for review or ask a prepaid lawyer they are only $40/month. Our agreement says the same thing but doens't mention anything about waiting a year to do so.

also many mgt co. have terms where they control the money. it's only a problem when they dont' do what you say.

vis ta vie

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 11/30/2022 2:21 PM
I don't trust them and therefore do not want to sign anything they drafted up. It's in Adobe and I am unable to copy and paste.

Unfortunately we cannot terminate them until after their one year period which ends 9/1/23. It's a nightmare. I understand they work for us and not the other way around, but they are impossible to work with and will just not listen. For example I asked that they email the home owners when an open session takes place along with the agenda. The agenda gets posted by law, but the H.O.'s have always been emailed as well. They said HOAs are getting away from "hand holding" the owners. I said, do it anyway and they refuse.

Is it illegal for them not to give us account access?

thanks!

many mgt company contracts state they are responsible for making a roster of home owners.
just read your agreement and send them a letter or email saying per the agreement, please email us a list of all home owners name, phone number, email and any other info.

then take 2 minutes and email the home owners yourself.if they fail to abide by terms of their contract then tell them they are breaching contract.

vis ta vie

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Thanks Wendy - I spoke with a lawyer yesterday and they are in breach of the contract for multiple reasons, but we would need to send a letter drafted by a lawyer and go through mediation, etc. We don’t have the money and these people will not go quietly, so looks like we're stuck for 9 more months. I have asked them to send a list to our property manager and they have not. They won't do would we tell them and it's so frustrating. I don't know how else to proceed. The other 2 board members are essentially useless so I'm on my own here.

Appreciate your help!

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Hi Kerry - I am new to this and have re-read the bylaws - they're a bit long to memorize and it has nothing regarding code of ethics, etc. I was wondering if there was a civil code, but it seems not. Our property has 168 and were originally apartments. We have 60% renters on site. We have an onsite manager employed by the HOA and two maintenance workers. Our board as 4 seats, but only 3 people ran so we have 3 directors at the moment. I am the only one who lives onsite. We have not had a reserve study done in 5 years, they had not had an election in over 3 years, we have zero reserves, we are $128K in debt, and the list of issues goes on...

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 10:55 AM
Thanks Wendy - I spoke with a lawyer yesterday and they are in breach of the contract for multiple reasons, but we would need to send a letter drafted by a lawyer and go through mediation, etc. We don’t have the money and these people will not go quietly, so looks like we're stuck for 9 more months. I have asked them to send a list to our property manager and they have not. They won't do would we tell them and it's so frustrating. I don't know how else to proceed. The other 2 board members are essentially useless so I'm on my own here.

Appreciate your help!

if they have a local office, just email and call them and tell them you are on the way to pick up the docs you need. nothing like a little face to face to get them motivated. it s so easy to ignore emails and voice mails, not so easy to ignore someone at your front door. if they still ignore you, pose as a new HOA board shopping for a new management company to get appointment for sure.

vis ta vie

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Thanks for further info. I'm confused about t something, though. You say you have a contract with a mgmt. company (MC). But you also write that your HOA has a property (community? ) manager as an employee. What does this PM do for your HOA? How are that person's duties different than the MC's?

I'm also curious about your Bylaws as all I've heard of over the years require an odd number of directors. But you say yours require an even number, four? Wait, are you sure your bylaws require 4 directors? Or do they require 4 officers, e.g., prez, VP, Sec'y, treasurer? A major difference is directors are voted on by Owners. Then, the new board of directors meets and chooses officers usually form among themselves.

Things look pretty unhealthy at your HOA. Offhand, I'd say you board must vote to raise assessments a lot so that you can pay off debts, conduct a reserve study and start contributing to reserves. When does you fiscal year begin?

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

SusanC

As the owner of a management company in California, I will give you an opinion based on experience.

1) A code of ethics would not be required UNLESS it were in your Election Rules, generally backed up by your Bylaws. No management company, in California, can make you sigh such a document.

2) Attending a meeting and possibly taking notes should be already be included in a management's contract, not as an extra. The board should have signed a signature card with the back in which your operating funds are held. Someone from your board should have read only access to that account.

3) If the meeting notice was not posted 4 days prior, cancel the meeting, as it would not be a properly noticed meeting and any action taken could be challenged in a court.

4) You need to do a special assessment to help right the ship. With 60% rentals, it would never pass the normal way, so you would need to do an emergency special assessment. It is done all the time and is legal. Being a condo conversion, you will have higher and more unexpected expenses than a normal condo.
https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/E/Emergency-Special-Assessments.

5) You need a new management company and may need to bite the bullet, sooner rather than later.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 11/30/2022 2:22 PM

Posted By JohnC46 on 11/30/2022 1:43 PM
Susan

Can you be removed form the BOD for not signing it. NO. Your BOD needs to wrestle control of your association back from the MC. Are your under owner control?

Sorry I am new to all of this - it's my first home, purchased 15 months ago. I have been President for 4 months. What do you mean under owner control?

thanks!

Owner control is when the developer/declarant has turned control of the association over to the owners as in the owners elect all BOD Members. The developer/declarant can no longer appoint people to the BOD. If this is the case, then stop having the MC control meetings/agendas. MC should attend BOD meetings only when invited by the BOD. Seize the day.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 11:56 AM
Thanks for further info. I'm confused about t something, though. You say you have a contract with a mgmt. company (MC). But you also write that your HOA has a property (community? ) manager as an employee. What does this PM do for your HOA? How are that person's duties different than the MC's?

I'm also curious about your Bylaws as all I've heard of over the years require an odd number of directors. But you say yours require an even number, four? Wait, are you sure your bylaws require 4 directors? Or do they require 4 officers, e.g., prez, VP, Sec'y, treasurer? A major difference is directors are voted on by Owners. Then, the new board of directors meets and chooses officers usually form among themselves.

Things look pretty unhealthy at your HOA. Offhand, I'd say you board must vote to raise assessments a lot so that you can pay off debts, conduct a reserve study and start contributing to reserves. When does you fiscal year begin?

Hi - I made a typo, we should have 5 members but only 3 ran for election.

In California, you cannot request an assessment for more than 5% of the budget without a quorum from the homeowners. They are so not engaged with this place that will NEVER happen. We received 19 ballots out of 160 owners.

We approved the budget for 2023 and we raised monthly dues by 3%.

A reserve study is $3,500 and we have no money to pay for it.

Our property manager has been here 12 years - she collects bids, schedules vendors, deals with after hour emergencies and manages the maintenance team for repairs among other duties.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MaxB4 on 12/01/2022 12:40 PM
SusanC

As the owner of a management company in California, I will give you an opinion based on experience.

1) A code of ethics would not be required UNLESS it were in your Election Rules, generally backed up by your Bylaws. No management company, in California, can make you sigh such a document.

2) Attending a meeting and possibly taking notes should be already be included in a management's contract, not as an extra. The board should have signed a signature card with the back in which your operating funds are held. Someone from your board should have read only access to that account.

3) If the meeting notice was not posted 4 days prior, cancel the meeting, as it would not be a properly noticed meeting and any action taken could be challenged in a court.

4) You need to do a special assessment to help right the ship. With 60% rentals, it would never pass the normal way, so you would need to do an emergency special assessment. It is done all the time and is legal. Being a condo conversion, you will have higher and more unexpected expenses than a normal condo.
https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/E/Emergency-Special-Assessments.

5) You need a new management company and may need to bite the bullet, sooner rather than later.

Thanks John - I wish we could fire them, but cannot afford the cost of an attorney, etc.

We can only do a special assessment that high for court ordered repairs, safety concern, or unforeseeable repairs. This has all been left in a mess for years, so it's not exactly unforeseeable. Our roofs need replaced - we had NINE leaks during the last heavy rain so I am trying to push that through as a safety concerns so they could collapse at some point. I drafted this letter and the MC said they cannot use it and we need to pay a lawyer to write one and the protocol will take months. I disagree with them. This letter seems perfectly legal to me.

12/07/2022

Dear Homeowners,

This is to inform you that the XXX HOA Board of Directors has decided to levy a special assessment against all homeowners for multiple roof repairs and replacement due to safety concerns. Details of the special assessment can be found below:

Date Approved: xx/xx/2022
Reason for the Assessment: Multiple roof repairs/replacement
Cost of Assessment Per Homeowner: $XXXX Per Unit
Due Date: 01/15/2023

This emergency assessment meets the requirement pursuant to Civil Code 5610, (b) An extraordinary expense necessary to repair or maintain the common interest development or any part of it for which the association is responsible where a threat to personal safety on the property is discovered.

Homeowners must settle this assessment in one payment. Those undergoing financial hardship can request payment in three installments due Jan. 15th, Feb.15th, and March 15th. Please make your payment(s) via check mailed to XXX Property Management or utilize the online payment system.

We understand that not everyone welcomes this news. However, this special assessment will help improve the property as well as your quality of life in the community and is necessary for the safety of the home owners. Please know that the Board has considered other options for funding but has determined that a special assessment is the best recourse.

Sincerely,

HOA Board of Directors

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

Susan, I don't understand what your fear is of taking control of this situation. Why can't you draw a line in the sand and put a stop to this? For example, simply tell them that starting next month they are no longer needed at your monthly meetings and/or they are no longer in charge of creating the agenda. Specifically, why are you guys allowing this to happen? What is it you fear will happen?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

You need to do both. I can't imagine any HOAs raising assessments only 3% for '23. Anyway, Your letter looks very good, but Max's advice also looks good and the letter he'll provide should help a lot!

WendyM5 (North Carolina)
Posts: 1,522

Posted:

I signed a code of ethics, didn't really see it as a big deal. I'd just sign it , but I would also tell them that we can run thigns from here on out.

vis ta vie

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

Some states require a condo of ethics for board members, most don't. If your state is one of them, then yes you'll have to sign it if you want to remain on the board. Otherwise, if there is no language in your state law or your bylaws requiring it, then such a code is unenforceable.

IMHO, codes of ethics are window dressing that can give a false sense of security. Ethical board members will already be behaving properly - they don't need a piece of paper to tell them what to do. Determined bad actors aren't going to pay attention to a piece of paper - if state law and potential legal liability doesn't stop them, why would you expect a code of ethics to be effective?

Some lawyers have also opined that signing a code of conduct may make board members ineligible for the business judgment defense, since they've agreed ahead of time to act in a certain way regardless of the circumstances they're dealing with.

Finally, a signed code doesn't really give a community any new tools for dealing with bad board members. Homeowners still have to pay attention to what's going on and do the hard work of removing/replacing board members when necessary. If they can't be bothered, a ream of signed codes won't change a thing.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CathyA3 on 12/02/2022 4:46 AM
Some states require a code of ethics for board members, most don't. If your state is one of them, then yes you'll have to sign it if you want to remain on the board. Otherwise, if there is no language in your state law or your bylaws requiring it, then such a code is unenforceable.

snip ...

Argh - my kingdom for an edit feature.

DavidG45 (Delaware)
Posts: 994

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

The board simply needs to instruct the MC to do whatever the board tells them to do. If they refuse to follow the board's orders - such as sitting silently during board meetings - they are in breach of contract and can immediately be fired.

This isn't complicated. You simply need to tell them who is in charge. And it ain't them.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidG45 on 12/02/2022 6:39 AM

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

The board simply needs to instruct the MC to do whatever the board tells them to do. If they refuse to follow the board's orders - such as sitting silently during board meetings - they are in breach of contract and can immediately be fired.

This isn't complicated. You simply need to tell them who is in charge. And it ain't them.

Amen.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidG45 on 12/02/2022 6:39 AM

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

The board simply needs to instruct the MC to do whatever the board tells them to do. If they refuse to follow the board's orders - such as sitting silently during board meetings - they are in breach of contract and can immediately be fired.

This isn't complicated. You simply need to tell them who is in charge. And it ain't them.

I agree.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Has anyone brought the MC contract to the table to be discussed? Also keeping mind that previous boards let this go on. They probably thought it best to leave it to the experts. So this is how these situations happen. If you want to change it be prepared to do the work. Which everyone will say why is? Can we not hire experts? Yep you can and this is what happens...

Set up a 3 bid system for every contractor. Never do more than a year contracts. This way you can have 2 other options than the incumbent and get rid when necessary.

Former HOA President

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidG45 on 12/02/2022 6:39 AM

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

The board simply needs to instruct the MC to do whatever the board tells them to do. If they refuse to follow the board's orders - such as sitting silently during board meetings - they are in breach of contract and can immediately be fired.

This isn't complicated. You simply need to tell them who is in charge. And it ain't them.

Hi David - we have told them multiple times that we run the show, not them. They keep doing things behind out back, such as the code of ethics. Rather than email us and say we should have one and they can draft it up, they created one without our input and added it to the agenda to get signed. This is just one example. If we try to fire them for breach will will incur attorney fees and they will drag this out - they are vindictive and awful. And we don't have the money to take them to court.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MelissaP1 on 12/02/2022 11:36 AM
Has anyone brought the MC contract to the table to be discussed? Also keeping mind that previous boards let this go on. They probably thought it best to leave it to the experts. So this is how these situations happen. If you want to change it be prepared to do the work. Which everyone will say why is? Can we not hire experts? Yep you can and this is what happens...

Set up a 3 bid system for every contractor. Never do more than a year contracts. This way you can have 2 other options than the incumbent and get rid when necessary.

I had a lawyer review. They are in breach but they would take us to court and we don't have the money to fight them. The previous board had a different MC who only did accounting and a bad job at that and we have a large complex. We need to be in compliance and the last board just ran wild. They could be sued 10 times over, but that's shooting ourselves in the foot.

I have been putting more time and effort into this than my real job so I have been doing the work. I'm just between a rock and a hard place.

SusanC20 (California)
Posts: 65

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnT38 on 12/01/2022 5:11 PM

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

Susan, I don't understand what your fear is of taking control of this situation. Why can't you draw a line in the sand and put a stop to this? For example, simply tell them that starting next month they are no longer needed at your monthly meetings and/or they are no longer in charge of creating the agenda. Specifically, why are you guys allowing this to happen? What is it you fear will happen?

Hi - it's not a fear. I have 2 other members who do nothing and do not help out at all. I have told the MC we can run the meetings and then they list all the reasons we can get sued and how they need to do it and one of the board members caves because his greatest fear is being sued.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/02/2022 3:12 PM

Posted By JohnT38 on 12/01/2022 5:11 PM

Posted By SusanC20 on 12/01/2022 4:54 PM

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/01/2022 4:38 PM
So...what the heck does the MC do? bills owners only?

I'd have to look it up at Davis-stirling,.com for details, but quite a few years, our CA HOA has raised dues more than 5% without Owner votes. Max'll know, since I can't remember. One year, some of our owners who get special benefits saw their assessments go up 19% due to old calculation errors

You should strongly consider revising your budget in a few months to rise the assessments more. You cannot possibly improve you situation without more assessments coming in.

Hi Kerri - we can raise dues up to 20% in CA without a vote. But, we need a large chunk of money at once or we will never get ahead. The MC does the accounting, runs the meetings (at an added cost), creates the agenda without asking what the board wants to discuss, and has been taking over every facet of our property. The stopped paying two of our trusted venros to bring in their own because the get a commission. It's infuriating.

Susan, I don't understand what your fear is of taking control of this situation. Why can't you draw a line in the sand and put a stop to this? For example, simply tell them that starting next month they are no longer needed at your monthly meetings and/or they are no longer in charge of creating the agenda. Specifically, why are you guys allowing this to happen? What is it you fear will happen?

Hi - it's not a fear. I have 2 other members who do nothing and do not help out at all. I have told the MC we can run the meetings and then they list all the reasons we can get sued and how they need to do it and one of the board members caves because his greatest fear is being sued.

I hear you but this is only going to get worse and you cannot do your job as president while this nonsense continues. It's a losing battle. Normally the president serves as the liaison with the management company. I would start by standing your ground on a couple of these issues and tell the Board that if they don't like it they can work within the framework of the bylaws to remove you as president. If I was in your shoes I'd also be having a coming to Jesus talk with who ever your contact is. In addition, I would start researching alternative companies in case things go south and have your ducks in a row before you find yourself in a world of hurt.

Hang in there. It's obvious you are really trying to make a positive contribution and I sincerely wish you the best.