Arguments against a security patrol

Trayvon Martin.

If they don’t care that someone died as a result of overzealous community patrolling, tell them Martins family received a multi million dollar wrongful death settlement from the HOA.

I did not know that. Good information!

Just to be clear - the proposal is to hire a professional security company to patrol. The "neighborhood watch" program was already tried a couple of years ago to disastrous results. I suspect the HOA's liability is lowered when hiring license company.

David,
We have explored this in my current HOA. My case against it was we have 55 Streets in our community and to have one guard drive around would be like catching fish without a Pole or Net. The second reason is most guards are lucky to be paid more than minimum wage and it is doubtful that they are going to be willing to risk Life or Limb to get involved in an incident. They will find areas to hide till their shift is done and report no issues. If they do get involved, you run into the issues Barbara mentions.

Most of the time they will need Post orders telling them exactly how to handle issues. It is very common to have them call the local PD if they see anything. Depending on PDs response time the offenders will scatter, and it will be a waste of time for all involved.

Contact your local sheriff or police department and see if they have a program where you can hire off-duty police to come and patrol your neighborhood. We hire through our county sheriff. They have one car that patrols our main parkway and does patrol the streets. The officer can and does stop people for traffic violations and provides some security - really it's just one car in the neighborhood so they can't be everywhere. However, it does make the residents feel better. And the officer who usually patrols knows the property manager really well and will help out if we need it.

Seems to me the cheapest solution is: park in your garage and lock it, lock your car, and don't leave anything inside the car that would tempt someone to break in.

Bad actors go after the easy targets first. Don't be an easy target.

I'd have a different opinion about patrols if the trouble makers were trolling the community looking for people to beat up or worse.

I think it's on this "small vocal group" to show evidence that such an expenditure is warranted. For each owner to spend an extra $15/mo in assessments so that a small group will "feel better" is not responsible, reasonable governing.

With some others, it's impossible for one person driving around to somehow catch a crime--in this case checking car doors?-- while it's happening.

$100 per hour for security patrol? what kind of crack is someone smoking on that one? Security patrol is about $24-$29 per hour to the company, add about $125 per week if you want if with their company car.
IF you are able to get guards that are POST certified, then you're looking about $40 DPH to the company. POST certified guards would be the way to go if you have a real crime problem in your community. POST guards
can affect arrest etc.

I like MichaelT's idea to do a quick survey of owners.

An Owner in our high rise condo building wrote a charter and the board approved an ad hoc committee to better educate, prevent and detect "water events" (leaks, floods)-- a big issue in high rises. A couple of months later, the committee presented their findings to the Board. They recommended requiring all Units to have leak detection devices in their condos where water might leak or gush. The HOA would pay for this & the servicing, etc. It would have been expensive. They were convinced that Owners would want this since water intrusion is such an unpleasant event. The Board asked them to compose a quick survey to assess owner interest. The Committee did, the board approved it, and it was distributed to all Owners.

The return rate was quite low 21%, I think. And among them only about half, or about 11% of our entire population wanted to pay for this "service." That was the end of this "vocal group," though some of their less intrusive and expensive ideas were implemented.

David's assn. could permit this vocal group to form an ad hoc committee to study, etc. the topic. They could compose the survey, with the Board's approval. Let them do the work.

Too often it seems to me that owners demand this or want that based on no evidence of need. They insist that "something must be done." Instead of the board using its valuable volunteer time to quiet a tiny minority, bring them in and let them "study" the so-called need.

1. ~10 years ago my neighborhood partnered with a nearby community and hired a private security patrol for 6 months. They monitored crime reports, concluded it was a waste of money, and discontinued.

2. Can you get some idea of the actual cost of crime in your community? (I’m assuming it’s primarily property crime and not violence). You probably don’t want to pay $40K/year in an attempt to eliminate $20K/year of losses.

BillD

Here's the thing, BillD. There HAS BEEN no "crime" in David's community. Apparently a small group of their teens sometimes wander around randomly and allegedly have been seen trying car doors as if they want to steal items. Sometimes, they get loud and argue.

Ooops, sorry David, I must have missed the actual crimes. But, so few and some so preventable just don't justify the expenditure.

That is my thought. Security patrols aren't going to keep grandma from letting who ne'er-do-well grandson from living with her, and I don't know how they would stop kids from walking down the street looking for unlocked cars.

Spending $80k a year to prevent $5 worth of crime seems like a poor investment - while exposing ourselves to unlimited liability.

How often are these groups observed in your community, David? I'd think that if they are soooo semi-pro and to be efficient, that they'd leave your 'hood alone IF a few sweeps produce NO unlocked cares. Education!

David,

My suggestion would be to ask an officer from the local station to the next membership meeting to discuss this issue and ways residents can address it.
The officers are typically happy to do this.

This helped educate the community.
We would try to have them at the meeting every three years or so.

Gosh, I missed the 2x year, too. So a patrol every night that MIGHT stop a 2x/ann. activity? Imo, if a board approved this, it would be misfeasance. (Seeing ol' JohnB/PitA/Manic reminded me of that word.)

I thought about this for a minute. Crimes are NOT committed towards a HOA. They are directed towards individuals that live in a HOA. So why should ALL the neighbors be responsible for your security? Plus the most important part of any crime? Reporting it, and pressing the charges. Who is going to go to court? It's not going to be your HOA board. It's going to be the victim or victims of the crime. So why budget this in a HOA budget? Just create an environment for less crime. Like installing good lighting or having security cameras. Otherwise, it's up to the individual to do their own crime prevention or intervention...

Have to tell a story in my HOA. Someone posted in our HOA page that their car had been broken into. It was parked in their driveway UNLOCKED. Apparently they left a gun in the car. It was taken. Now at first blush reaction would be "OMG car break in and crime!". Second blush... You left a car UNLOCKED in your driveway with a gun inside. An area of which many KIDS play. They posted we should "watch out". I am thinking I need to watch out we have a IDIOT who leaves a loaded gun in an unlocked car in their driveway.

This is most common scenerio for crime in our area. What would a security officer done in this situation? What is the HOA's role in this? Why would the HOA need to pay to prevent stupidity?