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NathanG7 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Hi,

Did some forum searching but can't seem to find and answer based on the keywords I was using to search.

We have a townhouse community of ~100 units. We have a small Gym with a few bikes, treadmills and machines.

As a new board member, I wanted to repair our broken gym equipment and get a contract in place for annual upkeep of our treadmills.

The companies I have contacted have said they will not service most of our equipment as we are using cheap residential grade equipment in a commercial setting. I also was warned that this may be a lability to our community as our insurance carrier may not cover this.

I read our insurance documents and talked with our insurance agent and they were no help.

Does anyone have any insight on this? It seems plausible to be if someone gets injured on the treadmill and we are knowingly voiding the manufacturers warranty, our insurance company could deny coverage. I am assuming the same applies if you bought a playground from a big box store and installed it in a HOA park. Even if you had liability insurance for a playground if you used some cheap big box store one vs one made and rated for commercial use the insurance company could deny coverage.

Thanks in advance!
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
If you are wanting it professionally maintained, you'll need to use equipment that the professional is willing to maintain, which is commercial.

If you don't have a lot of money to spend, you might be able to buy quality used commercial equipment off Craigslist and then pay to have that maintained. Gyms go out of business all of the time.

I agree with commercial grade versus residential grade. Your application is commercial so you should have the right equipment.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
I don't think insurance could deny coverage. That's a common expression but rare in practice. Rather, the insurance would drop you if a claim was filed and then you'd have to find a new insurance carrier.
NathanG7 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Michael,

Thanks for the response.

I definitely agree that we need commercial equipment in this space. Although I have done upkeep on my personal treadmill I won't touch anything the HOA owns. Since we can't get anyone to service it, the equipment will most likely break much sooner than if the past board had just gotten the correct equipment to begin with.

I plan to pursue pre-owned commercial equipment or a lease plan depending on the feedback I get from the community.

We are a very litigious state (Florida) and I have homeowners verbally threaten lawsuits or situations that someone "could get into" all the time which is why this point specifically has me stressed out.

I am hoping that we can just use this residential equipment until it breaks but when it breaks if it causes bodily injury I am sure I will have wished I just threw it all away and went with commercial grade equipment.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
I'd definitely run that past your insurer. When I read that your gym equipment isn't commercial grade, it gave me the heebie-jeebies.

I suspect you should forget about repairs and use the money for upgrades.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Here is an article about a large settlement that resulted from an injury on playground equipment:

https://www.floridahoalawyerblog.com/20-million-verdict-against-hoa-for-playground-injury-serves-as-industry-wake-up-call/

(The settlement was as large as it was because the board refused to settle when it was "only" around $1 million or so.)
NathanG7 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By CathyA3 on 08/02/2022 11:19 AM
I'd definitely run that past your insurer. When I read that your gym equipment isn't commercial grade, it gave me the heebie-jeebies.

I suspect you should forget about repairs and use the money for upgrades.

When I ran it by my insurer through a phone call they couldn't seem to give me an answer. I plan to get a Yes/No answer from the in writing which should give me the best direction to go.

Its definitely an interesting situation.

We wouldn't be able to purchase items such as the pool, bathrooms, HVAC and etc. in a residential form as companies would not supply them. As I understand it, the past board went out on their own to source this residential equipment from big box stores.

I know that most gym equipment doesn't need service but items such as the treadmills need cleaning, tension and lubrication. If we can't service the item and in not servicing the item it becomes a dangerous item that causes bodily injury I will sure feel stupid. I hate to condemn perfectly working gym equipment but if it avoids an accident we need to make sure that equipment gets removed as fast as possible.
NathanG7 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By CathyA3 on 08/02/2022 11:24 AM
Here is an article about a large settlement that resulted from an injury on playground equipment:

https://www.floridahoalawyerblog.com/20-million-verdict-against-hoa-for-playground-injury-serves-as-industry-wake-up-call/

(The settlement was as large as it was because the board refused to settle when it was "only" around $1 million or so.)

Cathy,

Thanks for the find!

This is just the thing I need to be able to bring to a board meeting to discuss.

So in my case I want to service the items, any company who could service the item will not because their insurance policy doesn't allow them to perform service on residential equipment used in a commercial setting thus I cannot have any residential equipment in a commercial setting meaning all that equipment has to go.

If we knowingly keep this equipment and do not service the equipment it puts our community at risk if someone were to hurt themselves on the equipment and be able to subpoena evidence showing that we refused to service it similar to the board in that article where they refused to service it due to age.

Thanks!
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
I dont't blame the OP for their concern. After the Lamplight Village lawsuit HOA's have a duty to make sure the equipment they provide as an amenity is safe to use.
The company they contacted to inspect the equipment has a valid objection. Personally I would put a motion to the board to either rent commercial grade equipment
or see if the gym equipment is part of your reserve study and just replace it with commercial grade equipment and have regular safety inspections conducted on the equipment.
NathanG7 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LetA on 08/02/2022 1:23 PM
I dont't blame the OP for their concern. After the Lamplight Village lawsuit HOA's have a duty to make sure the equipment they provide as an amenity is safe to use.
The company they contacted to inspect the equipment has a valid objection. Personally I would put a motion to the board to either rent commercial grade equipment
or see if the gym equipment is part of your reserve study and just replace it with commercial grade equipment and have regular safety inspections conducted on the equipment.

Yes, since they will be the last people who touched it they need to weigh their risk and what their insurance allows.

Shame on the past board for putting us in this situation but this is what happens when people buy stuff without looking into manufacturer recommended service. I have been having to research servicing for the Gym, AC, Pool, Pond, Gate and many more items where the past board spent thousands but has left items unserviced for years and now items are starting to break due to neglect.

You would think we would have a reserve study for the community but it is unfindable. I am sure we had one at one time... you would also think we would have a reserve account for the Gym building or gym equipment but we don't...
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Your reserve account is just that a savings set aside for reserves, your reserve study says where the money is allocated and about when.
My suggestion is to inform your neighbors, show them this lawsuit and organize your owners to force the board to get appropriate equipment
and conduct a reserve study.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By CathyA3 on 08/02/2022 11:24 AM
Here is an article about a large settlement that resulted from an injury on playground equipment:

https://www.floridahoalawyerblog.com/20-million-verdict-against-hoa-for-playground-injury-serves-as-industry-wake-up-call/

(The settlement was as large as it was because the board refused to settle when it was "only" around $1 million or so.)

This issue was discussed previously. See:
Subject: 20 Million Dollar Verdict HoaTalk Feb 2018

The main reason for the verdict amount, in my opinion, was the fact that the HOA had the cross bar fall before this incident and failed to have it replaced along with the extent of the injuries suffered.

I applaud the OP for looking into a maintenance contract for their Gym equipment.
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 08/02/2022 6:48 PM
Posted By CathyA3 on 08/02/2022 11:24 AM
Here is an article about a large settlement that resulted from an injury on playground equipment:

https://www.floridahoalawyerblog.com/20-million-verdict-against-hoa-for-playground-injury-serves-as-industry-wake-up-call/

(The settlement was as large as it was because the board refused to settle when it was "only" around $1 million or so.)


This issue was discussed previously. See:
Subject: 20 Million Dollar Verdict HoaTalk Feb 2018

The main reason for the verdict amount, in my opinion, was the fact that the HOA had the cross bar fall before this incident and failed to have it replaced along with the extent of the injuries suffered.

I applaud the OP for looking into a maintenance contract for their Gym equipment.

Our HOA took great heed after this. We have a company come out and annually inspect the playground equipment. We have just a splash pad with a rubbery
base and a play structure with a child slide and the base is a rubbery structure. We do not want the same grief that the BOD of that HOA brought on
their owners.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 08/02/2022 6:48 PM
Posted By CathyA3 on 08/02/2022 11:24 AM
Here is an article about a large settlement that resulted from an injury on playground equipment:

https://www.floridahoalawyerblog.com/20-million-verdict-against-hoa-for-playground-injury-serves-as-industry-wake-up-call/

(The settlement was as large as it was because the board refused to settle when it was "only" around $1 million or so.)


This issue was discussed previously. See:
Subject: 20 Million Dollar Verdict HoaTalk Feb 2018

The main reason for the verdict amount, in my opinion, was the fact that the HOA had the cross bar fall before this incident and failed to have it replaced along with the extent of the injuries suffered.

I applaud the OP for looking into a maintenance contract for their Gym equipment.

When I read some articles about this lawsuit, I saw that the Board had an amateur do repairs (rewelding) of the supports or crossbar or something, and the amateur repair job failed, which increased the Board's responsibility and liability.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Another good reason the Board should not "hire" residents do fix-it jobs for the HOA (unless insured, etc., etc.).
MarshallT (New York)
Posts: 414
Posted:
I agree with the suggestion to look for gently used commercial grade equipment. At the very least, you will be able to have this equipment maintained by a professional. Accidents are less likely to occur if the items get the care they need.

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