Disgusting Living Conditions

Started by TonyN2 • 14 replies • 395 views

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TonyN2 (Illinois)
Posts: 62

Posted:

We have found multiple unit owners who keep their units in an absolute dump.
I'm talking, nasty old garbage everywhere, like a terrible nightmare horders episode.

Is there anyway I can tell a unit owner to clean up their mess?
I'm honestly worried there may even be a new virus or infestation problem that comes out of this.

Our building has 44 units and I found 2-3 that live this way on seperate floors.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

If you think it's hording, you can contact the local authorities (dept. of health perhaps) to see what they can do.

It's not really an HOA issue with only concerns.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

I think Thad's correct. It's no business of your assn. or Board unless their messes are causing problems in the common areas or other units.

If you have a nuisance clause in your CC&Rs, and most if not all Multi-story HOAs do, and their messes are causing bad odors in your hallways. I do think your board can act. I don't know what you mean when you ask if you personally can "tell" them to clean up?? Something like this would take a board decision.

TonyN2 (Illinois)
Posts: 62

Posted:

Okay, my inclination was that it was wrong to "force" anyone to clean their home.
The odor isn't making it into the hallways, but the home itself smelled like a total dump.
I think I saw rotting food on the floor. Yikes.

I guess we'll just have to keep an eye on the negative effects if any ever arise.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

So exactly how do you think you can "force" a clean up? What are your legal options? Look at what could actually be done legally. It's not what you may think it is.

Former HOA President

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

I'm going to disagree a bit with the other responses. When a filthy interior of one unit causes issues such as rodent or insect infestations, fire hazards, damage to the common elements and adjacent units, nuisances or risks to other residents and similar problems, then it's absolutely an association problem and the board has a duty to deal with it. Here's what our attorney said:

"All associations have governing documents that prohibit residents from creating safety hazards and nuisances. Most documents require residents to maintain their homes in safe and sanitary conditions. As a result, boards can make rules that discourage residents from creating and maintaining unsafe conditions and allowing potentially hazardous situations in their homes. Having rules in place in an effort to prevent hoarding or prior to hoarding being discovered, allows associations to enforce those rules the same way they would for any other rule breaker."

That doesn't mean it's an easy problem to deal with. Hording in particular is viewed as a form of mental illness, meaning that Fair Housing laws will come into play and the typical board member is unlikely to have the necessary knowledge and skills to handle the problem.

If the OP believes that this could be a hording situation or that there is any hint of mental health issues, they should consult with the association attorney before taking any steps. The last thing an association needs is to get hit with a Fair Housing complaint on top of everything.

JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880

Posted:

I agree with Cathy.
Many condos have a restrictions against odors, vermin and the like. This is perfectly reasonable for an apartment-style condo where one unit may affect another. What restrictions do your documents have about it?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

We have a nuisance clause that can cover a lot of issues our CC&Rs. We also have a noxious odors clause in our multi-story condo building. The assn. can enter units if a water leak is suspected to be coming from it. We have no CC&Rs or rule about keeping one's unit clean.

From what the OP wrote, no damage to the common areas or other condos has occurred. Yes, sure, instruct the custodians to report any insect vermin or odors in the hallways to the director who handles these things.

Per Cathy, it probably is a good idea to get the opinion of your HOA attorney. Perhaps an inspection by the fire marshal could be advised.

Crafting a rule against hoarding is an interesting idea. Did your attorney supply sample wording, Cathy?

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

What cathy said. It's one thing to be messy but when messy crosses over into rodent or insect infestation, horrible smells (which can set off problems for people with respiratory issues) and possibly create a fire hazard, the matter needs to be investigated.

The OP didn't say if he's visited these residents to see whats going, so that might be a start. Don't go in with your hair on fire, but make it a friendly visit to see what's going on. Maybe you have an elderly resident who's having trouble with upkeep because of physical problems, beginning stages of dementia, maybe both. Sometimes the resident has depression or other emotional or even mental illness. Or they could be does who don't care about anything ir are unaware that their lifestyle is causing a problem.

The main thing is to talk to them (or try to) and observe what you can. It nay be time for a wellness check by police ir the adult protective service in your area. You could also refer the resident go an Area Agency on Aging who could help the person get services. By the way, there could be abuse or neglect of animals, so you may need to contact animal control.

If the person just doesn't care, you'll have to consult the association attorney and review your options.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

I don't have any sample rules, unfortunately.

I noticed that the blog post i quoted from mentioned a lawsuit in Ohio where a tenant asked for eviction to be delayed long enough for the tenant to clean up their unit, and the landlord denied the request. The tenant sued and the court ruled in the tenant's favor.

I also noticed that the blog post repeatedly said that the rules have to encourage good behavior and discourage undesirable behavior. I interpret that to mean that the rules have to be flexible and allow the board to work with homeowners on remedying their particular situation.

Our attorney always encouraged us to contact their office whenever we got a hint that Fair Housing issues could be in play. They handled things like verification of need for an accommodation as well as making sure the board followed all of the necessary steps to comply with the law. They included a reminder to act promptly since dragging your heels on approving the accommodation can also be a violation of the law.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Jodi' top paragraph looks good.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

There's nothing vague about cleaning up after yourself, keeping junk cars off the lawn (the ones with the expired plates, flat tires, a smashed windshield and motor oil creating an oil slick), not letting the trash cans overflow or letting the grass grow up to your eyeballs- are you really that obtuse???

I know you said you're a new board in one of your posts, but sometimes I read your responses and wonder if ANYTHING on this website is sinking in with you...

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

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