Condo condemned for mold in attic. Help!

I am hoping for suggestions on what to do when your home located in an HOA community becomes uninhabitable because of issues that are located in the building outside of the portion you own as an individual.

I helped my daughter buy a small condo in 2016. It was a free-standing building amongst a group of two- and three-story condos. It has 533 square feet and had at one time been the pool house before the complex was remodeled and changed from apartments to Condos. About a year ago it was noted that there was moisture leaking in next to a water heater located in the bedroom closet. In addition, the gutters had not been cleaned and the roof appeared to be damaged from trees that had not been trimmed away in many years. This was all communicated to the management company. They sent out a company to look at the issue and give a bid, but they said the bid was too high and they were looking for another opinion. After responding to numerous communications from us, and promises to look into the problem, that management company was dropped by the HOA and a new one was hired in January. When they were contacted, they said they were unaware of prior communication, and so they were forwarded copies of everything. We had to start all over. As far as I know, no one from the management company ever came out to personally look at the moisture problem.

My daughter moved out of state with her job in early 2022 and after having the unit updated with new floors and paint, she put it up for sale. It sold within days and that is when the nightmare began. The buyers requested an inspection. We had let them know about the moisture issues and that the Association had promised to take care of them, since it was the HOA’s responsibility. We were told that we could not do anything ourselves, it needed to be addressed by the HOA. The buyer’s inspection found problems well beyond a little moisture in a closet. The attic was so contaminated with mold that the inspectors said no one should be allowed to live there. The damage to the roof had been allowed to continue until even the rafters were compromised and the builders had failed to ventilate the roof and or appliances such as the microwave. The also noted the water in the closet appeared to be leaking in from a bathroom for the pool that was located behind the closet wall. I talked to them by phone hoping to get pictures they had taken in the pool room bathroom which was closed for the season at the time. This was apparently the same company that had been sent out 314 days earlier. They had already given a bid for repairs and been rejected.

My daughter can’t live there, rent it or sell it, but must continue paying HOA fees including garbage sewer and water, even though no one can use those services. All of this while also paying rent and utilities in her current location. The mold remediation company I talked to seems ready and willing to go to work, but the HOA seems to be dragging their feet and looking for more bids. The roof is apparently a problem in other units as well and that project is out for bids now, but it will likely be late fall before that project begins if they agree to accept a bid. What are we to do? I call every few days and although the new management company is sympathetic and pleasant, it seems like there are still no real plans to do anything to correct the situation in the near future. Does the Association have any liability in this situation? We lost a sale, no one can live there and we have to continue paying for services we can’t use. The market has turned now and we will likely take a loss, all because the HOA failed to respond to repeated requests for help. Any suggestions on what our next step should be?

I don't know that it is. That is why I am asking. If they had addressed that issues when they were first notified, things would never have reached this point.

Well then if that is the case which I assume is also stated in the CC&R's, then the HOA does have to fix things related to the attic, walls, and roof.

Now my question is who allowed the HOA to convert a pool house into a residence? Who did the work and paid for that to happen? It's very unusual for a HOA to take on such a project. It's not really a financial prudent decision IMO. The best the HOA could gain is another dues payer. The profit if any of making a home is even questionable due to the tax implications.

I am not sure why you think you would not have to pay dues. Plus you still own the property so gas/electric/water goes with it. It sucks the situation you and your daughter is in. It's also something that had enough red flags for me to have not gotten involved in.

I would make sure to approach the HOA board for your needs and not the MC. The MC s a hired contractor that works for the HOA. They do what the HOA tells them to do. The HOA is only funded by it's owners for it's owners. It may be they should consider a possible insurance claim for the repairs if they can't afford to make them. I am sure their deductible is rather large.

Honestly, when I read the part they converted a pool house to a condo I cringed a little...First thought was it's got to have a water or mold issues just by the nature of what it originally was...

The Pool house was converted to another Condo by investors who purchased the apartment complex in 2005. They then sold the units as condominiums. When we purchased it in 2016 the place appeared to be in excellent condition and the reserve fund looked to be adequate to cover future maintenance including a roof replacement that was suppose to happen at the time. I encouraged my daughter to join the board, but she was working extremely long hours and she did not choose to do so. We live over 300 miles away, so I was only there occasionally. I have pointed out to her that she might have been more aware of what was happening had she volunteered to be on the board, but it is too late for that now. We had no idea of the conditions in the attic, but did know the roof was appearing to deteriorate and she had been bugging the company that managed the HOA about cleaning the roof and gutters for several years. She had complained a number of times about the noise of the trees scraping on the roof. They did finally have the roof and gutters cleaned last week. I believe many of the problems were due to the prior management company not following up on their responsibilities. There are a number of other units in different buildings that also experienced water damage, although I understand it was for a different reason. They are still able to live in them though.

By the way, I am not sure whether calling it a pool house is accurate, but we once heard someone else refer to it as that. It was apparently a small common gathering room for the apartments and was located about 20-30 feet from the pool. It does not actually face the pool with any windows, and a fence surrounds the pool but does come up against the back of the building that contains her condo. To get to the pool she must walk for several hundred feet around shrubs and that fence. I don't know what it may have looked like prior to 2005. I only recently heard that there was a community bathroom in the back of her condo. My daughter was not even aware of that, and had always assumed that area was just a utility closet of some sort. The few times she used the pool she returned to her Condo to use a bathroom.

You should also prepare for the worst case and start talking to attorneys so you have one if you need one.

FYI for KathyL8: Below is an explanation of why this situation is more complex than the typical condo question.

Assume the community started with some multi-unit buildings plus a small pool house/clubhouse next to the pool. In order to convert that small community facility into a condo, here are the changes that would have been needed to be made in the Declaration:

* The section where the condo property is defined.

Common elements (the pool house) would have had to be converted to some mixture of common elements/private property. We don't know where the dividing line is in this case.

* The section(s) where percentages of ownership and assessments are defined.

Each owner owns a percentage of the total property, and all of these percentages add up to 100%. Adding another condo means all of these have to be adjusted to make the new total add up to 100%. In addition, the percentages of the other units will have to reflect the fact that a separate unit is probably "nicer" and would be assessed at a higher level than one of the attached units.

* The section where unit owner and association responsibilities are defined.

This section tries to list all of the components of the property and who is responsible for maintaining them, so would need to change how the converted building is described and who is responsible for what.

* Homeowner vote and recording of amendment!

Amendments to the Declaration/CC&Rs require approval of a majority of unit owners of the community, and usually a super-majority of 67% or 75%. Changes to commonly-owned property or to assessments typically require approval of 100% of the owners. (I question whether a change like this would get 100% approval. The other condo owners would have ended up paying slightly less per month, but in exchange for that they lost ownership of and use of an amenity.)

If this amendment wasn't done properly, there could be even bigger problems.

OK, that's a tough situation.

It does sound like people want to solve the problem, so that's good. You still may want to buy a couple hours of a lawyer's time, though. The lawyer will act in your interest, while the management company works for the HOA and answers to the board - there is still the potential for an adversarial relationship, although with luck it won't come to that.

Normally you do not use a Real Estate attorney for HOA issues as a general rule of thumb. It's a bit confusing. However, in your case you may need a lawyer with real estate knowledge due to the nature of this issue. It is also an HOA issue. HOA attorney is a bit expensive. A "general" lawyer may be where I would start to ask which direction would best serve you. It isn't a clear cut issue necessarily. May find a legal service in your area that could assist in suggestions.

Here is the deal I believe happened. It is something I try to warn HOA's to avoid as they are NOT in the Real Estate business. My best guess is that some "investors" within the HOA saw an oportunity to convince the HOA to convert a laundry/bathroom building on the grounds. We had one in an apartment complex I lived in. It was next to the pool as well. Since they were converting to condo's anyways why not add this piece to the pot?

Well it is not that easy. They now added an additional property to their condo/HOA. Did they recognize it in their documents? The CC&R's? Cathy's posts touches on this part.

The additional issue is that the construction is most likely faulty here. That is why I lean toward needing a Real Estate attorney due to the construction issues. It does not sound like the conversion was done correctly or to code. Knowing construction as I do, suspect they did not do that great of a job. Basically probably threw up some drywall and insulation to call it a day. A former bathroom or possible laundry room is not built the same as the condo building. It would be prone to mold an moisture issues.

So this HOA basically stepped in it with their greed to make the mighty dollar. I am sorry you got involved in this. However, it should be a lesson to other HOA's to THINK before doing something similar. Bad construction in a conversion could make the whole HOA eat everything.

Since the unit has been deemed unlivable, AND your unit insurance policy has said that it's not under your policy since it's an HOA issue, I would be calling them every, single, day. Vendors are difficult to locate at this time, but there is someone out there, they just need to be found.

I agree with getting your own attorney involved at this point knowing it is going to cost you money out of your pocket.

Look for an attorney well versed in condos and HOA's. Since you are in a position having lost the sale of the unit, money spent on an attorney can maybe cause things to happen sooner than later. If you're willing to wait for a volunteer HOA board to figure out how to handle this, you may be waiting for a very long time.

Get another opinion. Don't assume it is unlivable based on one opinion. Get a mold test. Inspectors are hired to find problems and often exaggerate in order to get work. Have someone else evaluate the situation. Perhaps you can rent it while it is for sale.

I would not suggest buying any property without a mortgage/bank loan. Even if you can afford paying straight cash for a home. It's best to get a loan. That offers several benefits in the long term. No one says you can't pay it off in a year or 30. However, banks tend to offer some protections during the process for various situations. It also helps build credit. It's what is called a "healthy debt". Buying the condo with cash did not help your situation your in now. It probably made you more prone to encounter this situation. The seller especially if they were an investor did nothing but benefit and wash their hands of the mess. This is not meant as a lecture. Just why the situation maybe as it is now. Little protections a mortgage may have offered. Depending where you live lead and/or mold testing could have been required. Our state there is a lead free requirement for houses. If built before 1979 may have to incur some lead removal/inspections before loan goes through.

It sounds like the issue is where suspect it is. The closet/bathroom on the other side in the common side for the pool. My best guess is poor ventilation. I wonder if there is even a ventilation fan in there or one that is working. Mold could be caused by poor ventilation. Considering it is most likely to be ventilated through the roof/attic area. I would send someone to the roof to examine if there is an exhaust situation for that closet/bathroom. That is most likely the source that needs remediated.

I know you can spray some bleach combo on some mold to stop or kill it's spread. Although my guess is that maybe they did treat it with bleach and then painted right over it. If you remove that board, it is probably soaked in mold. Although you don't want to do that unless prepared to encapsulate it. Mold if you seal it up or kill it should provide some safety while the professionals get to work.

My guess is they will have to remove the dry wall. Reinstall some ventilation. Do some spraying to kill the mold. Re-do the insulation. I am sure will need to run a fan to air the existing mold out. I would look at putting in an air purifier near the area or in the area where the moisture is. It may help during the process to limit it spreading too much throughout the condo.

Melissa
The last owner had only owned it a few years before going through a divorce and returning to Canada. They had nothing to do with the investment group that filed for the Condominium Declaration in 2005. That was Northstar Development Associates LLC. They were registered as a corporation in May of 2005, and are no longer listed as such in Washington. I believe the HOA attorneys have already determined that is a dead end. You are likely correct on what will need to be done to correct the moisture situation. The new property manager said something similar when we discussed it a week ago. I was under the impression they were working on getting something done, but I need to follow up again. She had not actually been to the property yet, but said she had plans to go. Most of our most recent conversations have been about the mold and the roof. I just found out on Friday about the moisture noted in the adjacent bathroom from my realtor who was there with the technician who discovered it. I don't know all of the details yet, but I will talk to the management company again on Tuesday to determine if they were notified. The pool was just opened for the season this weekend according to an email I received. It is hard to believe someone is not aware of a problem.

You may also be correct when you say it might have been better to get a mortgage, but that is in the past, so we will go forward from here. My daughter had money saved for about half the purchase price and we were looking for somewhere to invest some of our savings. It seemed like a win win. There was a good deal of competition for this unit when it was up for sale in 2016 and our ability to close fast with cash was what made the difference. I guess we would have been better off had we lost that competition.

This is not a short term issue. It has been happening for a long time. If the area is near that bathroom the HOA still owns, then that benefits you. Once they tear into that wall it will go into your unit. Meaning the HOA remediation to that bathroom should extend into your unit. You may need them to work that angle than your unit out. It is more of their unit into yours. May have a better chance of work getting done.

I don't know what it looks like on your side of the unit. It is probably looking more like "growth" on your side. My guess is that they will have to bid out the bathroom job to include covering damages going to be caused to yours. This may be an area where you and the HOA can work together. Let them claim insurance but allow access to your unit? I don't think either party is going to get away with no damages to pay. You have already had to re-imburse the potential buyer.

Hoping after the 4th you get some more answers. I helped my brother move a few years ago. It was a small house. Looked up in their hallway. There was a huge amount of black substance all over the top area! Almost look like the place had been on fire. They said a previous tenant had cooked meth in that house. They suspected it was left over from that. The city they live in has a strict ordinance about drugs in houses. They condemn them. Eventually tearing most of them down. Guess their landlord was keeping it hush hush so they did not lose the property. I was shocked! Not too surprised that even an HOA may be dragging their feet considering how serious the situation can be. They could really be on the hook for alot...