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ThadC2 (Florida)
Posts: 820
Posted:
What is the best way to preserve HOA single family records from year to year? Seems like paper records get lost too easily. Should board members sign agreement that all board work is to be done online on a google drive and every doc should be shared to all other board members? And using a gmail account they will hand over with username/password to their successor? How the heck can we hold a quitting tired (maybe pissed off) board member to honor that on their way out the door? Is there a way to back up an entire google account incase it gets deleted by accident or maliciously via a phishing scheme, ransomeware scheme?

background:

Recently got on the board, and was handed a binder that had a few budgets from previous years (same one's sent out at annual meetings) previous yard of the month winners, cost of getting upgraded signs and that's about it. Basically nothing of importance or value IMHO. No vendor agreements, not even an agreement with current management company.

Last time website had board minutes posted was 4 years ago. Previous board didnt' have any board meetings during the pandemic and did everything via email. Current secretary has the email account used during the pandemic.

SteveH35 (Washington)
Posts: 339
Posted:
Thad, the best way to preserve everything is digitally, but there is an abundance of human work required to organize the digital repository to make it viable.

You will be hard pressed to get get volunteers to sign an "agreement" to perform all their volunteer work a certain way. That said, your CIC can adopt a digital platform and pay someone to ensure all your records are stored and organized appropriately. Having a CIC-based electronic repository is key to ensuring that your management company does not control access to every file (and helps prevent chaos when your CIC changes managers), but figuring out ONE place to store the files on your side of the fence is also a good idea. Many organizations store documents in their CRM tool, but CRM tools are not yet capable of integrating with Google Drive, MS Sharepoint, etc. in a meaningful way to establish a repository AND a collaborative document editing environment. That capability is in the works at several vendors.

Regards,
Steve
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,044
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SteveH35 on 06/11/2022 8:11 AM
Thad, the best way to preserve everything is digitally, but there is an abundance of human work required to organize the digital repository to make it viable.

Amen to that.

When I started digitizing the Association records, it took hours to sort, organize and scan.
I then put all the records each officer would need on a flash drive.
The Secretary had copies of all records.
Almost everything was uploaded to the Association website.

For Treasurer info, I realized that there had to be a worst case option to rebuild.
Since we were mainly paid by check, I would include the lot number on the deposit slip and make sure the checks also had lot numbers on them. The bank always photographed the checks, so that was our emergency method to rebuild if something was lost.
In addition to the secretary having a copy, I burned data dvds as another backup.

Mind you, we kept paper copies for 7 years and digital copies forever.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I just wanted to make sure your not expecting more paperwork than may actually exists. Have found people go on a "records hunt" that is a bit more "imaginative" the "reality". Sometimes I think some want records that are complete "fantastical". The reality is it's most not likely all you think it is. Just pointing this out so don't get too lost in the weeds assuming things that are not there.

When I had to gather the records for our HOA, it was a simple box in a closet. This covered 20 + years of the HOA records. It was just a normal file size folder box. It mostly contained like records of old contracts, ACC approvals, Awards, and odds/ends. Nothing blind blowing. We had the same vendors for years so there wasn't much exchange of contracts.

Our PM/Treasurer gave us a few copies of expenditures/collection reports for our meetings. Mostly handed out to owners. The actual records were electronic. So there would not be alot of financial records stored in box.

The CC&R's and Articles of Incorporation documents are Public. They were kept at the courthouse or state. By-laws were our records but they were also a copy along with the CC&R's. Not required to be filed but copy was filed with them. That would rule out seeing any kind of documents like that.

Knowing where and who is responsible for what documents/records is most of your issues. The Secretary is rewsponsible for many records like POC. The President does not act as "Secretary". The Board meeting notes may be Secretary. The financials Treasurer. if you have an MC they most likely have the financials/POC lists.

There is no real solid best practices as each HOA is different. It's just best to make sure those responsible for records know and have them.

Former HOA President
ThadC2 (Florida)
Posts: 820
Posted:
My HOA has also been around for 20+ years and while I wasn't expecting much, I was expecting board meeting minutes for the last several years at a minimum. Instead I get copies of the governing documents, which every one has already and zero information on how to run an HOA, no board minutes, no reserve study, no notes on different management companies and thier benefits/drawbacks. Clearly last board didn't think very far into the future.
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Much depends on who is maintaining the records, the board/association, or a management company. If a management company, they may receive many boxes, but will only input current information, within the last 12 months. The rest they will just keep in boxes. I just terminated an association after 6 years, and no one has yet to ask for their records, after two months.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Sorry to say, but we have little to no old records including Minutes.
SteveH35 (Washington)
Posts: 339
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/11/2022 10:34 AM

There is no real solid best practices as each HOA is different.

There are definitely best practices for record retention, retrieval, collaboration and general continuity.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I am so confused... How is it that you were handed the governing documents - CC&R's, Articles of Incorporation and By-laws and then say "Did not get anything telling how to run the HOA". Uhm did you READ these documents? It is EXACTLY HOW you are to run a HOA. Did I miss something???

Former HOA President
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
I'm sure our property manager keeps a good pile of records for us and has a process to hand them to the next board, but I don't put trust in a property management company because we might fire them at any time and then we would lose all of those records. So......

I keep records on my Microsoft OneDrive cloud storage. I just checked and at the moment we have 24.3 GB of records. This is a little insane, about 21 GB are renderings of playground structures from a vendor (should be deleted) and the remaining 3-4 gb are actual association records.

In the event that I depart the board, I will put all of these records on a thumb drive, mail to the current property manager, and ask that he or she provide it to the point of contact for the next Board of Directors.

Easy peasy.
MarkR21 (North Carolina)
Posts: 710
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/11/2022 6:22 PM
I am so confused... How is it that you were handed the governing documents - CC&R's, Articles of Incorporation and By-laws and then say "Did not get anything telling how to run the HOA". Uhm did you READ these documents? It is EXACTLY HOW you are to run a HOA. Did I miss something???

So there’s no need for this forum? Lol everyone that has documents should be all set!
Pretty sure you know what they meant.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,044
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SteveH35 on 06/11/2022 2:40 PM
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/11/2022 10:34 AM

There is no real solid best practices as each HOA is different.

There are definitely best practices for record retention, retrieval, collaboration and general continuity.

Yet you don't share what they are, which was the question from the OP
ThadC2 (Florida)
Posts: 820
Posted:
thank you!
SteveH35 (Washington)
Posts: 339
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 06/12/2022 3:38 AM
Posted By SteveH35 on 06/11/2022 2:40 PM
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/11/2022 10:34 AM

There is no real solid best practices as each HOA is different.

There are definitely best practices for record retention, retrieval, collaboration and general continuity.


Yet you don't share what they are, which was the question from the OP

I previously answered the question, but to go even further, you can take a look at this Records page: https://www.(LINK-NOT-ALLOWED-PER-POSTING-RULES)/governance/RECORDS. As I've stated previously, this forum is essentially incompatible with the provision of holistic references that are better kept in a journal article, blog or webpage. Nobody should expect answers here that are as comprehensive as already detailed elsewhere.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
Here's an example of the file folder structure on my computer

https://imgur.com/a/FeYgdvq
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
Here is the same example as an inline image. As you can see, I have a lot of HOA documents on my OneDrive.

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MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Wow, I wish I was as organized as you.ROFLMFAO.
MichaelT21 (Arkansas)
Posts: 501
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MaxB4 on 06/12/2022 8:35 AM
Wow, I wish I was as organized as you.ROFLMFAO.

I am not sure why you find my HOA involvement to be so laughable. Our association is well run. yes, I am proud of the work that I have done, for free, in our community. It clearly rubs you the wrong way but I guess that is your choice.

Our homeowners appreciate what we as an HOA have done in our community.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
From my days as a former Quality Manager, it should be noted that your governing documents are to act as a "how to" guide on how to run your HOA. Imagine if the world stopped for 100 years. New people came in to take over your HOA. The documents they would have? Your CC*R's, Articles of Incorporation, and by-laws. If you have any ACC documents that would apply too. Having records is just documentation of what took place. It is in now way a guide on how to operate HOA.

So again not sure what other documents you desire that would make things operate. Again, make sure your not looking for things that don't exist.

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,044
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelT21 on 06/12/2022 8:49 AM
Our association is well run. yes, I am proud of the work that I have done, for free, in our community. It clearly rubs you the wrong way but I guess that is your choice.

Our homeowners appreciate what we as an HOA have done in our community.

You should be proud of the work you have done.
I applaud you for it.

Keep in mind that most on this site have done or a doing the exact same work and feel it was simply part of the job.

ThadC2 (Florida)
Posts: 820
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/11/2022 6:22 PM
I am so confused... How is it that you were handed the governing documents - CC&R's, Articles of Incorporation and By-laws and then say "Did not get anything telling how to run the HOA". Uhm did you READ these documents? It is EXACTLY HOW you are to run a HOA. Did I miss something???

sure, lol. and congressmen just have to read the constitution. it's all in there.

yeah you missed a lot, but I fear it's not worth my time to answer your questions since you just want to get off topic again instead of answering the original question.

you got a records policy? then share it! you got a different opinion then start a new thread.
BancsS
Posts: 269
Posted:
Your file folder organization is quite impressive.
BancsS
Posts: 269
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BancsS on 06/12/2022 10:42 AM
Your file folder organization is quite impressive.

To MichaelT21

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