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JenniferD8 (Michigan)
Posts: 141
Posted:
Hi,
I've posted various topics on this website regarding my condo HOA board. I'm always so thankful for the advice and insights!

My condo development was self managed until January 2022. In January, a property management company was hired and uncovered that the treasurer misused the association's credit card. The treasurer repaid @ $7400 and resigned.

The property management company has been posting the financials each month and it shows that we are in the red by $25,000 in monthly dues. The property management company said that they are trying to determine if it's due to residents not paying or poor accounting practices by the ex-treasurer. The property management company has assured everyone that it's not due to embezzlement. (Personally, I'm not too convinced.)

Anyways, I was speaking with a resident today and he said that he received an invoice from the property management company approximately 6 weeks ago. The property management company indicated that he missed a monthly payment. The resident called the property management company and they instructed him to call the ex-treasurer to discuss the missing payment. This doesn't sound right, since the ex-treasurer misused the credit card and should not have any access to the association's financials. I plan to attend the next meeting in a couple weeks. Shouldn't all of the association financials have been turned over at the time of resignation?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
They are still a member of the HOA correct. So they still have rights to copy of the financials as any other member. They just can not be involved with spending any finances. They still should have records and some knowledge during their term of treasurer.

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
The extreasurer is still the one with corporate knowledge of the financials.
Hence the reason to talk with the ex-treasurer.

I would expect that the financials were turned over to the management company when they took over the financials.
If not, why not?

I would start with the MC and see if they did or did not receive the financials.

Worst case - the owners paid in cash and it wasn't recorded.
Best case - it's sloppy work.

Members should always pay by traceable means so they can, if needed, prove that they made the payment.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Let me add, when I took over as treasurer, I was handed a box that contained envelopes of receipts, bank statements, check book registers, ledger sheets for each lot and an excel spreadsheet for the actual financials. They were not organized and it took me a good 3 months to identify what was what. It took another 3 months to properly organize all the paperwork.
MichaelS56 (Minnesota)
Posts: 858
Posted:
I would think you would like to work closely with your management company to determine the accuracy of the documents you received and what is still missing or in doubt. In worst case scenario an outside accounting company may have to be hired. Very serious financial situation that needs a solution.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Yes, the financial records should have been turned over. If the person is flat-out refusing to do so, that's a job for the association's attorney. Perhaps the threat of legal action will get the person's attention, especially if they were allowed to quietly resign without admitting wrongdoing. On the other hand, there may not be much in the way of records - you still need to find out, though.

No, residents should not be directed to the ex-treasurer to resolve disputes over who owes what. The new PM and the board will have to discuss this with each individual homeowner who claims that they've paid - with luck the individual will have some kind of record of payment. If not, then you'll have to wait to see what sort of info the ex-treasurer produces.

I'm also skeptical about the shortfall being due to something other than embezzlement. On the other hand, the ex-treasurer was a bit of a nincompoop for using the HOA's credit card for personal expenses - I mean, you have a written record of his actions, no deniability there. So given this, some of the shortfall could be due to lousy record keeping plus a board that also was asleep at the switch (every board member should review the monthly financials, not just the treasurer).

You may be stuck if neither side can produce records, but that would be a discussion with the HOA's attorney and/or insurance agent. If you were carrying the proper level of fidelity/employee dishonesty insurance, the insurer may make the association whole again as far as the embezzlement goes. Your CC&Rs should address what types and what level of insurance the HOA should be carrying - but you'll want to discuss this before making a claim since $7500 could be under your deductible amount.

FWIW, several years ago an association in my area "lost" $200,000 - nobody had any records, nobody knew where it went. The homeowners eventually had to make up the shortfall, I think.
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JenniferD8 on 06/04/2022 5:49 PM
Hi,
I've posted various topics on this website regarding my condo HOA board. I'm always so thankful for the advice and insights!

My condo development was self managed until January 2022. In January, a property management company was hired and uncovered that the treasurer misused the association's credit card. The treasurer repaid @ $7400 and resigned.

The property management company has been posting the financials each month and it shows that we are in the red by $25,000 in monthly dues. The property management company said that they are trying to determine if it's due to residents not paying or poor accounting practices by the ex-treasurer. The property management company has assured everyone that it's not due to embezzlement. (Personally, I'm not too convinced.)

Anyways, I was speaking with a resident today and he said that he received an invoice from the property management company approximately 6 weeks ago. The property management company indicated that he missed a monthly payment. The resident called the property management company and they instructed him to call the ex-treasurer to discuss the missing payment. This doesn't sound right, since the ex-treasurer misused the credit card and should not have any access to the association's financials. I plan to attend the next meeting in a couple weeks. Shouldn't all of the association financials have been turned over at the time of resignation?

Unless this was a long time ago the homeowner should be able to produce a record of the payment being made either through a copy of the cancelled check, electronic payment made, etc.
JenniferD8 (Michigan)
Posts: 141
Posted:
Thanks Everyone for the response! The invoice didn't indicate which month has the missing payment. The resident pulled their records for the past 15 months to provide to the property management company.

While I understand that the ex-treasurer has the financial knowledge, I find it disturbing that residents are being referred to him for missing payments. With the ex-treasurer already being found guilty of misuse of the association credit card, it's not a far-fetched notion that he could behind some of the missing $25k from October- January. (The association's fiscal year is October-September. The property management company was hired in January. The treasurer resigned the end of February.) Since the property management company came on board, there's only been @$1000 in dues that haven't been collected during the months of January thru May. From October-January, $24,000 wasn't reported as being collected. Definitely a head scratcher.
ND (PA)
Posts: 792
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelS56 on 06/05/2022 5:18 AM
I would think you would like to work closely with your management company to determine the accuracy of the documents you received and what is still missing or in doubt. In worst case scenario an outside accounting company may have to be hired. Very serious financial situation that needs a solution.

Good input here . . .
You've got a proven $7.4K misuse of HOA credit card by ex-treasurer. Red Flag.
You're $25K short (for reasons unknown) in assessments during (perhaps starting prior to) the ex-treasurer's time. Red Flag.
Info not provided on expenses and overage/shortfall/appropriateness. Uncertain, but should be part of the overall financial picture/discussion/investigation.

If overall this equated to a small amount of money, I might advise that time and effort is best spent forgetting the past and figuring out how to move forward. But this seems to be a pretty substantial amount of money that needs to be resolved and collected as well as establishing better processes moving forward to ensure that similar issues don't happen again.

For however long you need to go back in time, your Board and/or MC, and/or professional accounting/auditing personnel need to examine the books, recreate history, and determine with factual certainty where errors may have occurred; money not collected; money misappropriated; etc.

Usually, where there's smoke, there's fire. The credit card = smoke. Unaccounted for $25K shortfall and any other uncertainty over m fire. Need to know if issues are due to money not being collected or money being collected and instead misappropriated.

Once it's determined how badly and why financials are jacked up, you can then determine the Courses of Action to try and rectify things as best you can.

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