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Ongoing noise dispute with upstairs neighbor, can video footage of her being offensive towards me help my case?

Started by DanielleG4 • 25 replies • 457 views

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DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:


The tenant living above me has been nothing but inconsiderate, I try to keep it civil (avoid her at all costs) for the sake of not making it worse. I had security come by recently to listen in & they sent report to office. So far they have sent her a violation & last week they sent her hearing notice. The board members at hearing notice will decide whether or not they will fine the owner I think. Mgmt said that any other noise reports will help with my case but I also have two video recordings of her being just ratchet. I have a camera on my windowsill to see my front door which is also facing hers. The other day she had a friend over, pointed at my camera and her friend danced. This morning, I have footage of her looking into my camera and giving me the middle finger…she has a doorbell camera but no one has given her shit about that. I know it’s nothing to do with noise but I wonder if seeing her ghetto come out possibly helps with them just proceeding with fine.
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/11/2022 2:52 PM
I wonder if seeing her ghetto come out possibly helps with them just proceeding with fine.
It certainly could help any Board with a predilection against "ghetto" 'just proceed with a fine.' But then your neighbor might rightly file a Fair Housing complaint based on any and all of your and the Board's ill-thought out (to say the least) references to her being "ghetto" and how, according to the Board and you, dancing in front of the camera is evidence of this 'ghetto coming out.'

Your neighbor may very well be annoying and violating rules for other actions of her. But the instant I heard you describe a neighbor in these terms, I'd view you, and not your neighbor, as the potentially far bigger liability to the COA.

DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
I had no plans to call her that in front of board or mgmt. you’re saying this footage will not help my case at all? It is ghetto, how can you do that knowing you’re being recorded? That’s just stupidity
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/11/2022 3:15 PM
I had no plans to call her that in front of board or mgmt. you’re saying this footage will not help my case at all? It is ghetto, how can you do that knowing you’re being recorded? That’s just stupidity
Ma'am, respectfully, "ghetto" is a pejorative term that many will put on the same level as the N-word.

Apart from the ghetto word, if I were on your board and you insisted the board see this video, I would say, "So what? We do not have a rule against dancing and making lewd gestures directed to a camera."
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Federal communication "Tapping" laws can vary per state. You can't just randomly "tap" someone's phone. One of the parties has to know the conversation is being recorded. Some states this does not apply. I am mentioning this because it can bleed over to recording activities. You need to find out what the laws are in regards to that. It is something we here would not be experts in.

You can't record someone in their own home necessarily. That can be considered being a "Peeping Tom". You have a right to privacy in your own home. I can walk around naked in my home with the expectation of not being recorded or taken pictures of. I can't expect that same if I am outside naked hugging a light post. (Don't ask). That would be against the law for public nudity and maybe some public drunkeness. (It's called being Nekkid).

Your not helping your case with the HOA by showing the video. If anything you could be breaking the law. Plus calling anyone or a situation "ghetto" is indeed racist. Which is offensive and wrong.
Former HOA President
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
What’s the difference between me using a camera in my window vs her with doorbell camera? Our cameras are monitoring both of our front doors…
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The knowledge one is being recorded for one. Not all door bell footage is admissable in court. There is no crime being committed here. It's just you spying on your neighbor to gather evidence for your complaint.
Former HOA President
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/11/2022 3:33 PM
What’s the difference between me using a camera in my window vs her with doorbell camera? Our cameras are monitoring both of our front doors…
I am not up to speed on your and your neighbor's camera issues and am pretty sure I do not want to get up to speed on it.

Most importantly, it appears you have captured other things on camera that have legitimately got the board's attention. If the neighbor truly is violating rules and covenants, then your documentation gives you the best chance of the association taking action.
BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821
Posted:
Get. Therapy.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
What Barbara said.

I'm sorry, but this is the same damned song with slightly different verses. You keep asking if this or that will help your case - we aren't judges, so you want to find out one way or another, go to small claims court, make your case and find out. There are no win guarantees and to be honest, I think you have a good sense of what's likely to happen, don't like your odds and so you keep coming here every few months.

We can suggest all day long, but until you actually get off your ass and take action, nothing will change. Either go to court and settle this one way or another Or learn to live with this (headphones have been suggested several times - why you can't or refuse to invest in a pair, I'll never know). Or move.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
I think it sick that the OP is spying on her neighbor's door. The OP needs some time on the couch.
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
I have gotten off my ass and taken action…I got legal advice, spoke to HOA board, am in contact with the office Mgr, gotten officers involved what else is there to fucking do?
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
Fuck you
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
And eff you too
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I would suggest putting your racist attitude on the back burner and drop the Karen act ... Oops not an act?
Former HOA President
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/12/2022 6:58 PM
Fuck you

That's a hard pass for me.
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/11/2022 2:52 PM
I had security come by recently to listen in & they sent report to office. So far they have sent her a violation & last week they sent her hearing notice. The board members at hearing notice will decide whether or not they will fine the owner I think.
I appreciate your getting documentation of this neighbor's allegedly improper behavior and posting the update. I believe other threads you have begun have spoken of the importance of sound documentation. Those who participated constructively in the latter threads, encouraging appropriate documentation, should take a bit of credit.

As for where things stand now, even if the Board does not fine this person, I think being called to a hearing may push her to behave better (if truly needed).

On the other topic here that is now not getting a constructive response (duh):
Posts that insinuate with derision that a hoatalk member is mentally ill merely may reflect those posters' inability to deal appropriately with situations where a HOA/COA owner is disabled. Imagine if a HOA/COA manager responded to a mentally ill person as BarbaraT1 did in this thread.

The OP asked whether providing certain evidence would be appropriate. All people had to do was say, "Yes, in my opionin" "No, not in my opinion" or some other direct reflections on proceeding thusly.

A lousy 1.5 cents for the herd that is now in the habit of deriding this hoatalk member.
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
With board not administering fee, how would that be a positive outcome? The owner wouldn’t be fined & it would go over his head.
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/13/2022 9:56 AM
With board not administering [a fine?], how would that be a positive outcome?
I would call a hearing 'not a negative outcome.' As I tried to indicate, the hearing may act like a warning to the owner who was alleged to violate a covenant.

Ya just gotta keep documenting, either by calling security as needed or other ways, and reporting violations when they appear to you to be actual violations of the CCRs or Rules, and being prepared to cite the specific CCR or rule being violated.

It's not easy. But it's considered to be the only fair way for all parties involved.
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
The owner is the neighbors landlord, he would be the one passing down the fine to her. Unless he decides to waive it, assuming the board will fine her in first place.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
As you've been told reportedly, the OWNER will potentially be fined, NOT the tenant (unless your documents say otherwise). What the Owner does if fined is not your business. But we can be pretty sure the Owner won't be happy with the tenant and will tell her to knock it off.
DanielleG4 (Florida)
Posts: 131
Posted:
I’m just speculating, I don’t get why alot of people on this forum are condescending towards me. What if the owner isn’t fined, do you think he’d still warn her?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
A owner's hands can be tied. If they did not write into their rental agreement the tenant has to follow the HOA rules, then they can't evict them. The owner can't just evict their tenant for any random reason. It has to be written in the lease agreement. So even if the owner gets fined out the wazoo, that isn't grounds for eviction.

Plus the owner may not like you either. They may be okay with what their tenant is doing.
Former HOA President
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/13/2022 8:02 PM
I’m just speculating, I don’t get why alot of people on this forum are condescending towards me.
I think it's because your writing could be better? More focused on exactly what violations of the rules and CCRS are occurring? Also, you have started new threads and often repeated pretty much the same complaint? Lastly there's the joy some people take from joining a pile-on. This is their unfortunately problem, not yours.

Folks have told you repeatedly, in so many words, you are not guaranteed the outcome you want here. It's a hard lesson but many (most?) people have to experience being messed over before they learn that justice is never guaranteed.

Your seeming to take a tangent to the race of the alleged violator, and in a pejorative way could, perhaps rightly, really hurt your campaign, both here at hoatalk and at your condo, and yield the condescending attitude of others here. I would call condescension a generous response. Anyone who thinks in terms of someone being "ghetto" needs some education, in my opinion.

Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/13/2022 8:02 PM

What if the owner isn’t fined, do you think he’d still warn her?
I do not think speculating about this is worthwhile. I think continuing to document real violations of the rules and CCRs is worthwhile. Continuing to contemplate that the Board will not help you, and so your options get worse and worse is worthwhile. Said options being to lawyer up; move; or tolerate whatever is happening that you do not like.

Did you say in another thread that the President of the COA is the neighbor's landlord?
BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/13/2022 8:02 PM
I’m just speculating, I don’t get why alot of people on this forum are condescending towards me. What if the owner isn’t fined, do you think he’d still warn her?

I'm not trying to be condescending or unkind.

I have seen your posts on other forums as well.

What you post indicates disordered thinking.

The noise you complain about is walking and talking - these are normal sounds in an apartment. No one can live in complete silence. It is not reasonable to expect your neighbor to never make any noise. Ambient noise is part of multifamily housing.

Based on other posts you've made, it seems like you hyperfocus on things, and that is what you are doing here.

At one point you heard your neighbor laughing and assumed she was laughing at you. You found a discarded tissue near your door and thought your neighbor placed it there to torment you. This is disordered thinking.

How you come off online is likely how you come off in person as well.

The property manager seems to have taken you seriously at first, but less seriously as the complaints continued and spiraled.

Your current situation is not going to change.

I wish you peace.
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BarbaraT1 on 03/14/2022 7:37 AM
What you post indicates disordered thinking.

The noise you complain about is walking and talking - these are normal sounds in an apartment. No one can live in complete silence. It is not reasonable to expect your neighbor to never make any noise. Ambient noise is part of multifamily housing.
?

Quote:
Posted By DanielleG4 on 03/11/2022 2:52 PM
The tenant living above me has been nothing but inconsiderate, I try to keep it civil (avoid her at all costs) for the sake of not making it worse. I had security come by recently to listen in & they sent report to office. So far they have sent her a violation & last week they sent her hearing notice.
This thread began with the OP's above report that security at the OP's condo agreed with the OP. Furthermore, it appears so did the board.

I do not see "disordered thinking" in this thread on the OP's part for the main point (as quoted above by me).

If you want to rake the OP over the coals for the "ghetto" reference (et. cetera.), be my guest.

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