Stealing power

DavidP29 (California)
Posts: 100

Posted:

Got another one from the land of crazy.

We live in an old condo building in CA.

An owner emailed me about one of her outlets not working but everything else in the room was fine. This owner lives next to the office. The weird part is she asked if power was out in the office as they might be on the same breaker.

Being a little bit of a handyman this made no sense. Logically and legally.

Well I went to the office and the power was out. Flipped the breaker and power can back on in the office and her one outlet.

Come to find out a previous president lived in that unit years ago. She has been in it for 7 years and this is her first issue.

So now we have someone getting free power on one outlet. She was also very defensive and said I am not going to pay to fix this. I have had way too many issues with this place. Blah blah blah. 😑

More to look into.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

If it is in a shared wall, then maybe cover the outlet up on their side and turn it around into the office area. It's not their outlet if the HOA office is paying for it. Not an expensive fix. Take the cover plate off and put a piece of wall board in. That sounds like what the previous President did. Otherwise, I don't see an outlet causing that much of a power drain to cause any real issue. Even with a heater plugged in that could only be like $10 a year?

My old apartment they messed up the hot water heater. So my downstair's neighbor was my water heater. I could turn off the breaker in the panel to not pay. The apartment complex knew this as there was another one like it. Just didn't say anything as who would know?

Former HOA President

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

So you suspect, but have no proof, that the past owner of that building wired the outlet or had the outlet wired.

I agree, the current owner should not pay to fix it because it may have simply been a mistake by the builder and you have zero proof to the contrary.

I suspect that this would be an easy fix. The outlet is likely tapped off of the closest outlet in the office and disconnecting those wires would fix the issue you seem to be concerned about (electric use). However, it could take awhile to actually identify the outlet.
It could be a couple of hours of work.

Leave it or fix it. The choice is the boards.

DavidP29 (California)
Posts: 100

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 01/04/2022 5:03 AM
So you suspect, but have no proof, that the past owner of that building wired the outlet or had the outlet wired.

I agree, the current owner should not pay to fix it because it may have simply been a mistake by the builder and you have zero proof to the contrary.

I suspect that this would be an easy fix. The outlet is likely tapped off of the closest outlet in the office and disconnecting those wires would fix the issue you seem to be concerned about (electric use). However, it could take awhile to actually identify the outlet.
It could be a couple of hours of work.

Leave it or fix it. The choice is the boards.

Correct, I think we have the original building plans. Have to look into it.

Issue is that the owner doesn't want to give up the outlet either because of location in room. Lol She wants us to pay for fixing it.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:57 AM
Issue is that the owner doesn't want to give up the outlet either because of location in room. Lol She wants us to pay for fixing it.

Outlet locations are set per the building code at the time of construction or upgrade.

AFAIC, this is not the owner's problem to fix. Nor should the condo remove her rights to use the outlet.

Chances are good that her electricity use for this outlet is at most, on the order of $30 per year.

Are you on the board?

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 1:39 AM
Come to find out a previous president lived in that unit years ago.

... though if the President added this outlet, I would be calling an electrician for inspection and advice a.s.a.p., especially since a breaker was found open (and probably in the trip-free position, meaning a fault caused the breaker to open). And yes, the condo association pays, since the condo association's wiring is affected.

DavidP29 (California)
Posts: 100

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By AugustinD on 01/04/2022 8:51 AM

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:57 AM
Issue is that the owner doesn't want to give up the outlet either because of location in room. Lol She wants us to pay for fixing it.

Outlet locations are set per the building code at the time of construction or upgrade.

AFAIC, this is not the owner's problem to fix. Nor should the condo remove her rights to use the outlet.

Chances are good that her electricity use for this outlet is at most, on the order of $30 per year.

Are you on the board?

Treasurer for 1 month now.

DavidP29 (California)
Posts: 100

Posted:

The easy answer is to just unhook the outlet from the office side and put a plate blocking. But that us horrible owner experience since she has had the unit for 7 years.

Should we change the wiring her unit to add this additional outlet?

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:10 PM
The easy answer is to just unhook the outlet from the office side and put a plate blocking. But that us horrible owner experience since she has had the unit for 7 years.

Should we change the wiring her unit to add this additional outlet?

In my opinion, yes.

Do it and be done with it.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Well that would be the trade off. If they want the outlet, then just have it re-wired to be in their unit NOT the office. Now will tell you that it isn't as involved think it may be. Should be able to fish the wires through the wall or just connect to another outlet in her unit side. So they will have to enter both units. Make sure they understand that and agree. Otherwise since it's really owned by the HOA, it could just close it off on their side and the office keep it... However, I would just let them have it.

I would also not call this "stealing". It was just bad wiring job. Which you may want to get inspected overall. I would add that onto the bill while your at it. Don't need a fire hazard situation as well for everyone.

Former HOA President

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:57 AM

Posted By TimB4 on 01/04/2022 5:03 AM
So you suspect, but have no proof, that the past owner of that building wired the outlet or had the outlet wired.

Correct, I think we have the original building plans. Have to look into it.

Keep in mind that original design does not always equal as built.

Changes and mistakes occur that are not always documented.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:10 PM
The easy answer is to just unhook the outlet from the office side and put a plate blocking. But that us horrible owner experience since she has had the unit for 7 years.

... and maybe has easement or simimlar rights at this point.

This "just" stuff is ridiculous. I think we are talking fishing wires through walls and possibly some re-wiring at the breaker box. The HOA needs a licensed electrician to advise it.

MarkM19 (Texas)
Posts: 1,459

Posted:

David,
If this is a Condo with multiple similar Condos I imagine, can you check others and see if they normally have an outlet on the wall where hers is? If the other units have an outlet in the same general area on that wall, then it is just a wiring issue that happened when the building was being built. If not, then maybe something more sinister may have occurred.

As Melissa has stated it is not a huge deal to correct this issue. If I were on your board, I would recommend just paying for the fix and letting the issue be resolved.

DavidP29 (California)
Posts: 100

Posted:

Thank you everyone! Hopefully we can get this fixed and no cost to owner.

BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:57 AM

Posted By TimB4 on 01/04/2022 5:03 AM
So you suspect, but have no proof, that the past owner of that building wired the outlet or had the outlet wired.

I agree, the current owner should not pay to fix it because it may have simply been a mistake by the builder and you have zero proof to the contrary.

I suspect that this would be an easy fix. The outlet is likely tapped off of the closest outlet in the office and disconnecting those wires would fix the issue you seem to be concerned about (electric use). However, it could take awhile to actually identify the outlet.
It could be a couple of hours of work.

Leave it or fix it. The choice is the boards.

Correct, I think we have the original building plans. Have to look into it.

Issue is that the owner doesn't want to give up the outlet either because of location in room. Lol She wants us to pay for fixing it.

Why would the current owner pay to fix it if it was like that when she bought it? Especially if she does not have a problem with the way it is. Unless it is a a 220 volt socket and they are running a major appliance on it, it will cost more to fix it than it is worth. The most I would do is ask her to sign an agreement not to overload the outlet.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By BenA2 on 01/05/2022 2:02 PM

Posted By DavidP29 on 01/04/2022 7:57 AM

Posted By TimB4 on 01/04/2022 5:03 AM
So you suspect, but have no proof, that the past owner of that building wired the outlet or had the outlet wired.

I agree, the current owner should not pay to fix it because it may have simply been a mistake by the builder and you have zero proof to the contrary.

I suspect that this would be an easy fix. The outlet is likely tapped off of the closest outlet in the office and disconnecting those wires would fix the issue you seem to be concerned about (electric use). However, it could take awhile to actually identify the outlet.
It could be a couple of hours of work.

Leave it or fix it. The choice is the boards.

Correct, I think we have the original building plans. Have to look into it.

Issue is that the owner doesn't want to give up the outlet either because of location in room. Lol She wants us to pay for fixing it.

Why would the current owner pay to fix it if it was like that when she bought it? Especially if she does not have a problem with the way it is. Unless it is a a 220 volt socket and they are running a major appliance on it, it will cost more to fix it than it is worth. The most I would do is ask her to sign an agreement not to overload the outlet.

A good suggestion. Any fix might not be the cost of leaving it alone.