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Can an Owner & his attorney-in fact or agent both attend board meetings?

Started by KerryL1 • 16 replies • 410 views

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KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
An Owner who resides nearby has his son-in-law as a tenant in our condo building. His son-in-law began attending board meetings. The Owner was told that tenents may not attend the in our Assn. The Owner granted his son-in-law power of attorney.

I know that both may not vote in elections. But can both attend board meetings?? The Owner insists his attorney says both may attend.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 12/02/2021 6:50 PM
An Owner who resides nearby has his son-in-law as a tenant in our condo building. His son-in-law began attending board meetings. The Owner was told that tenents may not attend the in our Assn. The Owner granted his son-in-law power of attorney.

I know that both may not vote in elections. But can both attend board meetings?? The Owner insists his attorney says both may attend.
If I were on the Board, I would suggest the following to my fellow directors:

First, ask for a copy of the power-of-attorney (POA) paperwork. Make sure the POA paperwork indicates that the son-in-law has the legal power to make decisions pertaining to the father-in-law's condo. Also make sure that, if the paperwork says a doctor's consent is required for the POA to be in effect, that the doctor's consent is attached.

Second, as long as the POA paperwork meets the requirements above, in my opinion your board should not sweat this and should let both attend. However, I would restrict input to only one or the other person. In California, I believe your Board has the right to make reasonable rules about owner participation. This rule is reasonable AFAIC.

Third, assuming the POA paperwork is in order, I think that the board should give the benefit of the doubt to the owner and his POA, and assume that the owner needs the assistance of the POA or perhaps is transitioning so that the POA will ultimately be making all the decisions about the condo.

Fourth, I do not care what the owner's attorney says. The owner's attorney is paid to argue the position of his client, even if the attorney ultimately thinks his client is wrong. It's a mistake to trust this attorney. The Board can hear him out, but take what the owner's attorney says with a box of salt.
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
If I were on the Board, I would allow the son-in-law to attend, whether or not they had a power of attorney, to attend a board meeting. Hell, they pay $1200 a month in dues, show a little courtesy. Nothing was mentioned if he was disruptive or anything. We used to have 3-4 renters attend our meetings.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The attorney should know better and does. Their attorney is NOT a member of the HOA. Which means as a non-member it is NOT open to non-members. The Son-in-law may attend if granted power of attorney. Just may not mean can do much more than just sit there and take notes.
Former HOA President
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Do your governing docs have anything to say about restricting board meeting attendance to members only?

As a practical matter, if you were holding your board meetings via Zoom it would be impossible to prevent non-members from sitting next to members and listening in. So technology may have made any rules about this unenforceable.

On the other hand: there are some states that have pretty strict rules limiting HOA's contact tenants (to the point where the HOA could open themselves up to legal action by the landlord if they ignore the rules). In such a case tenants would have to be kept out of board meetings.

General observation about POA: your owner may be so sharp that he cuts himself. This reminds me a bit of the poster who wanted to put her boyfriend on the deed to her condo to get around the community's parking rules. Still shaking my head over that one...
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
I would let the non member attend the meeting, just not "participate" Kerry, do you record the audio portion of the meetings for bookkeeping and minute recording purposes? If so, the member can always
request a "copy of the recording"
BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273
Posted:
I don't see any reason why both could not attend. Is it a problem having two people representing one unit attend? It is not unusual for co-owners to attend meetings together. There is really no difference.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
I say both can attend but only one can speak and vote. They have to decide which one.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Starting with Augie, I appreciate everyone's advice. Agree with Ben that it really is no different than spouses attending together. They each may participate during open forum, which one couple does fairly often.

The couple of times the son-in-law--in his 50s-- already attended, he was verbally hostile to the Board. But, as with any attendee, it's up to the Board Prez to remind him to be civil.

(Owners don't vote at Board meetings, JohnC)
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 12/04/2021 8:50 AM
Starting with Augie, I appreciate everyone's advice. Agree with Ben that it really is no different than spouses attending together. They each may participate during open forum, which one couple does fairly often.

The couple of times the son-in-law--in his 50s-- already attended, he was verbally hostile to the Board. But, as with any attendee, it's up to the Board Prez to remind him to be civil.

(Owners don't vote at Board meetings, JohnC)

My Bad. I was thinking Annual Meeting where there could be voting. For a BOD meeting I agree both can speak at the proper time.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
S' OK, JohnC. I figured you made a mistake. I'm always thinking, though, of those who're new to HOA life and try to clear things up for them.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
When I had to bring a potential suit against my HOA... (Shocker huh?) The lawyer informed me straight up that the HOA could ask he leave the meeting. I could bring him with me but if the HOA asked him to leave he had to.

The HOA may not know the person is a lawyer unless he/she identifies themselves as such to the board at the meeting. That is when it will be up to the HOA to have them removed. However, does not mean they can't have their lawyer to respond to them if they are in attendance as well. Both would probably just not do anything at the moment. So just there for moral support overall.
Former HOA President
MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109
Posted:
We simply don't allow any owners or anyone else to attend Board meetings.

We were elected to conduct the business of the HOA and that is what we do. If someone wants to attend they can run for a position on the Board.
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MikeB23 on 12/05/2021 3:55 PM
We simply don't allow any owners or anyone else to attend Board meetings.

We were elected to conduct the business of the HOA and that is what we do. If someone wants to attend they can run for a position on the Board.

My kind of an association!
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Some states, Mike, require that Boards hold open board meetings so that Owners may OBSERVE the discussions, deliberations & debates that directors engage in to make decisions. Only a very few decisions may be made in secret: fines, contracts in formation, payment plans, personnel issues, potential legal issues.

In my open-meeting state, owners may only participate during a required open forum. We have pretty tight controls over owner conduct during that time.

With Max being a property manager in CA, it must be really hard for him to hear Owners' comments at board meeting given his attitude.

I'm very happy to be in an HOA that has a board that abides by the open-meeting laws and who is not afraid to speak and debate frankly in front of owners. We've had previous Boards who skirted the law and hid decisions in executive session or made them before meetings. They basically became "decision announcers." What disgusting cowards!!

Hiding behind closed doors does not earn boards the trust of the rest of the owners. We've had poster I who live in closed-meeting states who DO hold open meetings now and then. or regularly. Good for them and their courage,

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 12/05/2021 5:28 PM

In my open-meeting state, owners may only participate during a required open forum. We have pretty tight controls over owner conduct during that time.

With Max being a property manager in CA, it must be really hard for him to hear Owners' comments at board meeting given his attitude.

Want to go at Carol?
MaxB4
Posts: 3,513
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 12/05/2021 5:28 PM
With Max being a property manager in CA, it must be really hard for him to hear Owners' comments at board meeting given his attitude.

You want to explain your continued attack against myself and my company? I am getting sick and tired of your BS!

My comment to Mike was a joke.

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