TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
I am disgusted with the Pm companies.
I want to lean more about what it take to manage the back end services; accounting payroll, etc
anyone using quickbooks for accounting, invoicing, will it interface with ADP?
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Started by TV • 30 replies • 517 views
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I am disgusted with the Pm companies.
I want to lean more about what it take to manage the back end services; accounting payroll, etc
anyone using quickbooks for accounting, invoicing, will it interface with ADP?
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,230
Posts: 14,230
Posted:
We have looked at self managing and while we are not a complex operation (no amenities, public road, single family and duplexes, 112 owners, $94K budget) our problem was no one was willing to step forward and put in the work required to get it off the ground and keep it operating, even with hiring a part time book keeper. Some say apathy. I say happy owners.
PatJ1 (North Carolina)
Posts: 567
Posts: 567
Posted:
You sound pretty complex if your have a payroll.
Do your governing documents require you to have an MC?
Rather than trying to go out completely on your own, are there certain areas the MC is lacking in? Perhaps look at evaluating those areas and taking them out of the MC's hands.
Our Board handles all maintenance requests unless we turn them over to the MC.
Do your governing documents require you to have an MC?
Rather than trying to go out completely on your own, are there certain areas the MC is lacking in? Perhaps look at evaluating those areas and taking them out of the MC's hands.
Our Board handles all maintenance requests unless we turn them over to the MC.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,967
Posts: 6,967
Posted:
If you're unhappy with the property manager, why haven't you sat down with him or her and had a chat about your issues? If the manager has a supervisor, bring him/her into the conversation and discuss ways to improve. If the manager wants to keep your business, this will get his/her attention.
That can be followed with a performance improvement plan (written and signed) where you can monitor things over the next six months or so. If there's lots of improvement over that time, hooray. If not, you can look for another company - You say you're interested in bookkeeping, so ask around for someone who's familiar with your software.
I say this because self managing a HOA is hard work and for some functions it may be easier to hire someone who does this for a living instead of relying on a board member. If that's you, I hope you have someone who can and will serve as backup, and you'll have to consider where all the records will be kept, protecting sensitive information from unauthorized people and so on.
If you want to learn best practices of self managing HOAs, take a look at the DAY website, which has lots of educational materials on a lot of HOA topics you and your board s can learn from. If you decide youd like to give a property manager a shot (a different one), do your due diligence - ask for references and check them, check it they require a bond and make sure it's still in force, etc.
That can be followed with a performance improvement plan (written and signed) where you can monitor things over the next six months or so. If there's lots of improvement over that time, hooray. If not, you can look for another company - You say you're interested in bookkeeping, so ask around for someone who's familiar with your software.
I say this because self managing a HOA is hard work and for some functions it may be easier to hire someone who does this for a living instead of relying on a board member. If that's you, I hope you have someone who can and will serve as backup, and you'll have to consider where all the records will be kept, protecting sensitive information from unauthorized people and so on.
If you want to learn best practices of self managing HOAs, take a look at the DAY website, which has lots of educational materials on a lot of HOA topics you and your board s can learn from. If you decide youd like to give a property manager a shot (a different one), do your due diligence - ask for references and check them, check it they require a bond and make sure it's still in force, etc.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,286
Posts: 6,286
Posted:
I've mentioned before how the top PM company in my area came into being.
Somebody was fed up with the performance of the PM in her community and complained to the board president so often that he finally said "can you do a better job?" She said "yes" and handed him a proposal - and the board hired her.
After some years and word of mouth, she started to pick up other communities in the area. More word of mouth, and now they have two offices and have displaced the former Top Dog. The developer I work for used to use Top Dog for most of our new communities, and now New Company is far and way the most frequently used. New Company currently has a waiting list of potential clients - they won't compromise the quality of service by taking on more clients than they can handle.
It's a tough job, though, and it takes a particular type of person with a specific set of skills. If you really think you can do this, I recommend working for a PM for a while to learn the ropes. You may discover that you can handle the mechanics just fine but can't handle the inter-personal stresses that go along with the job.
Somebody was fed up with the performance of the PM in her community and complained to the board president so often that he finally said "can you do a better job?" She said "yes" and handed him a proposal - and the board hired her.
After some years and word of mouth, she started to pick up other communities in the area. More word of mouth, and now they have two offices and have displaced the former Top Dog. The developer I work for used to use Top Dog for most of our new communities, and now New Company is far and way the most frequently used. New Company currently has a waiting list of potential clients - they won't compromise the quality of service by taking on more clients than they can handle.
It's a tough job, though, and it takes a particular type of person with a specific set of skills. If you really think you can do this, I recommend working for a PM for a while to learn the ropes. You may discover that you can handle the mechanics just fine but can't handle the inter-personal stresses that go along with the job.
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
I don't need opinions, I want answers to the specific question
not speculation by godlike creatures
not speculation by godlike creatures
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
most board members are a joke.
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,620
Posts: 1,620
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TV on 09/10/2021 2:14 PM
I don't need opinions, I want answers to the specific question
not speculation by godlike creatures
I don't need opinions, I want answers to the specific question
not speculation by godlike creatures
This forum is for HOA leaders and participants to discuss topics. If you don't like it go elsewhere. It ain't all about you.
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,038
Posts: 2,038
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TV on 09/10/2021 2:16 PM
most board members are a joke.
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
most board members are a joke.
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
Good luck, my friend, on finding a solution that suits you.
Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,734
Posts: 13,734
Posted:
Yeah you would be a board member if you got elected. So would you be a "joke"? Why in the world would you need ADP involved? HOA members are NOT paid. They are VOLUNTEERS ONLY. The only one that gets paid is the contractors which PM's are. So I have no idea why you are worried about providing payroll. A HOA doesn't do that typically.
Not even sure you understand how a HOA works or is set up if you can't grasp those simple concepts. The rest of "hell cats" in here have been there done that. My T-shirt is now being used as a cleaning rag...
Not even sure you understand how a HOA works or is set up if you can't grasp those simple concepts. The rest of "hell cats" in here have been there done that. My T-shirt is now being used as a cleaning rag...
Former HOA President
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
you are an idiot!!
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,734
Posts: 13,734
Posted:
Why yes I am. For trying to help one out...I recognize...
Former HOA President
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,967
Posts: 6,967
Posted:
Hey, you're the one who came here asking questions. That doesn't mean you'll get answers you like. You can accept some, none or all the suggestions here. We don't live in your community, so it's not going to affect us. Neither will name calling.
No wonder you got troubles running a HOA....If it was so damned easy, do you think WE'D be here????
Good luck in whatever you choose to do....personally, I see shitstorm in the forecast for you if you don't adjust your attitude.
No wonder you got troubles running a HOA....If it was so damned easy, do you think WE'D be here????
Good luck in whatever you choose to do....personally, I see shitstorm in the forecast for you if you don't adjust your attitude.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
if you have never heard of an HOA with employees then I think you might be mis-informed.
lots of HOAs have employees
lots of HOAs have employees
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,734
Posts: 13,734
Posted:
They are usually 1099's. Which means they don't need a handbook. They are independent contractors.
You do not give details of these God-like employees that have been brought onto earth for your HOA's employ.
Lawncare is NOT an employee of the HOA. A PM is NOT an employee of the HOA. A board member is NOT an employee of the HOA.
So is your HOA a non-profit or for-profit? Why do you need direct employees for your HOA.
We are not saying a HOA can't have employees. That does happen per that HOA's decisions/requirements. It's not necessarily the smartest thing to do #1. Also you offer no definition of what is considered an "employee" of the HOA.
Give details not ideology. Us Godlike creatures still need details.
You do not give details of these God-like employees that have been brought onto earth for your HOA's employ.
Lawncare is NOT an employee of the HOA. A PM is NOT an employee of the HOA. A board member is NOT an employee of the HOA.
So is your HOA a non-profit or for-profit? Why do you need direct employees for your HOA.
We are not saying a HOA can't have employees. That does happen per that HOA's decisions/requirements. It's not necessarily the smartest thing to do #1. Also you offer no definition of what is considered an "employee" of the HOA.
Give details not ideology. Us Godlike creatures still need details.
Former HOA President
MaxB4
Posts: 3,501
Posts: 3,501
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 09/10/2021 9:14 PM
They are usually 1099's. Which means they don't need a handbook. They are independent contractors.
You do not give details of these God-like employees that have been brought onto earth for your HOA's employ.
Lawncare is NOT an employee of the HOA. A PM is NOT an employee of the HOA. A board member is NOT an employee of the HOA.
So is your HOA a non-profit or for-profit? Why do you need direct employees for your HOA.
We are not saying a HOA can't have employees. That does happen per that HOA's decisions/requirements. It's not necessarily the smartest thing to do #1. Also you offer no definition of what is considered an "employee" of the HOA.
Give details not ideology. Us Godlike creatures still need details.
They are usually 1099's. Which means they don't need a handbook. They are independent contractors.
You do not give details of these God-like employees that have been brought onto earth for your HOA's employ.
Lawncare is NOT an employee of the HOA. A PM is NOT an employee of the HOA. A board member is NOT an employee of the HOA.
So is your HOA a non-profit or for-profit? Why do you need direct employees for your HOA.
We are not saying a HOA can't have employees. That does happen per that HOA's decisions/requirements. It's not necessarily the smartest thing to do #1. Also you offer no definition of what is considered an "employee" of the HOA.
Give details not ideology. Us Godlike creatures still need details.
Actually, in this instance, you have no idea what you're talking about.
TimB4 (Virginia)
Posts: 20,986
Posts: 20,986
Posted:
TV,
130 lots, private roads, sidewalks, entrance monuments and a couple of playgrounds.
We have been self managed from the beginning.
We would only hire independent contractors, not employees. This kept us out of the payroll business.
As others have said, it takes a lot of work.
As treasurer, I was putting in 20 hours a month.
As maintenance officer, I was putting in 10 hours a month, more when contracts were up for renewal.
That said, a lot of the time can be minimized by hiring a bookkeeper.
Concerned about payroll - the bookkeeper can do that as well.
The largest issue is, as others pointed out, consistently getting enough volunteers.
If it's deemed too much work by those who are willing to volunteer - they won't volunteer or won't stay around long.
We had a 5 member board (which wasn't always fully filled) and 3 member architectural committee.
130 lots, private roads, sidewalks, entrance monuments and a couple of playgrounds.
We have been self managed from the beginning.
We would only hire independent contractors, not employees. This kept us out of the payroll business.
As others have said, it takes a lot of work.
As treasurer, I was putting in 20 hours a month.
As maintenance officer, I was putting in 10 hours a month, more when contracts were up for renewal.
That said, a lot of the time can be minimized by hiring a bookkeeper.
Concerned about payroll - the bookkeeper can do that as well.
The largest issue is, as others pointed out, consistently getting enough volunteers.
If it's deemed too much work by those who are willing to volunteer - they won't volunteer or won't stay around long.
We had a 5 member board (which wasn't always fully filled) and 3 member architectural committee.
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
how did you pay the book keeper
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
No you don't.
you godlike creature.
you godlike creature.
TimB4 (Virginia)
Posts: 20,986
Posts: 20,986
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TV on 09/11/2021 5:22 AM
how did you pay the book keeper
how did you pay the book keeper
We were invoiced and paid the bill.
We hired the bookkeeper as an independent contractor.
This was specified when we sought bids for the job.
The bid was like any other contractor ($x per month for y years).
The bookkeeper collected assessments, tracked assessments and made deposits only.
The treasurer kept the checkbook and paid the bills.
TimB4 (Virginia)
Posts: 20,986
Posts: 20,986
Posted:
Oh, the Association would also have to file a 1099-misc with the IRS for the bookkeeper.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,230
Posts: 14,230
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SheliaH on 09/10/2021 5:51 PM
Hey, you're the one who came here asking questions. That doesn't mean you'll get answers you like. You can accept some, none or all the suggestions here. We don't live in your community, so it's not going to affect us. Neither will name calling.
No wonder you got troubles running a HOA....If it was so damned easy, do you think WE'D be here????
Good luck in whatever you choose to do....personally, I see shitstorm in the forecast for you if you don't adjust your attitude.
Hey, you're the one who came here asking questions. That doesn't mean you'll get answers you like. You can accept some, none or all the suggestions here. We don't live in your community, so it's not going to affect us. Neither will name calling.
No wonder you got troubles running a HOA....If it was so damned easy, do you think WE'D be here????
Good luck in whatever you choose to do....personally, I see shitstorm in the forecast for you if you don't adjust your attitude.
I agree. Well said.
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
1099s are a very litigious topic in my state. without thorough legal advisement then I would run away from that.
we have had direct employees for over 20 years. hiring outside does incur a lot more cost
we have had direct employees for over 20 years. hiring outside does incur a lot more cost
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
cheers
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,734
Posts: 13,734
Posted:
So how do you pay your employee? So far you have not provided any details. Sounds like paying them under the table which is more illegal than a proper 1099. I believe a few politicians got in trouble for that when hiring their nannies or housekeepers... Some states require to provide employees health care and pay taxes. Is your HOA doing this?
Former HOA President
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,038
Posts: 2,038
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 09/11/2021 5:10 PM
So how do you pay your employee? So far you have not provided any details. Sounds like paying them under the table which is more illegal than a proper 1099. I believe a few politicians got in trouble for that when hiring their nannies or housekeepers... Some states require to provide employees health care and pay taxes. Is your HOA doing this?
So how do you pay your employee? So far you have not provided any details. Sounds like paying them under the table which is more illegal than a proper 1099. I believe a few politicians got in trouble for that when hiring their nannies or housekeepers... Some states require to provide employees health care and pay taxes. Is your HOA doing this?
If you have employees, they would not get a 1099, they would get a W2. I see nothing in the OP's posts that suggest they do not properly report W2's for employees. In fact in the original post they ask the question about interfacing software to ADP, and I'm sure if they are interested ADP they would not be paying under the table.
Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
BenA2
Posts: 1,272
Posts: 1,272
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TV on 09/10/2021 2:16 PM
most board members are a joke.
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
most board members are a joke.
the whole premise of self government is laughable.
PM are out the extract fees, and often than not do a really poor job
It sounds like you are just looking for validation. Maybe you should submit a proposal to the board making you the manager since you are the only one who could possibly do a good job. Or maybe you are just projecting.
Projection - refers to unconsciously taking unwanted emotions or traits you don’t like about yourself and attributing them to someone else.
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
you poor baby
TV
Posts: 97
Posts: 97
Posted:
why would I provide details? for you godlike creature to try and validate it!
answer the specifics of the question asked, not hyperbole! HELLO!!
answer the specifics of the question asked, not hyperbole! HELLO!!
PatJ1 (North Carolina)
Posts: 567
Posts: 567
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TV on 09/12/2021 8:43 AM
why would I provide details? for you godlike creature to try and validate it!
answer the specifics of the question asked, not hyperbole! HELLO!!
why would I provide details? for you godlike creature to try and validate it!
answer the specifics of the question asked, not hyperbole! HELLO!!
We don't have an ignore button here. Obviously this "person" is not wanting suggestions to try to help with his issue.
He seems to me to be a troll who is getting his "jollies" off while good people try to help.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,734
Posts: 13,734
Posted:
Yeah they are a Troll or have the inability to communicate properly. Which falls onto the other post someone mentioned about projecting.
Former HOA President
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