Curious - how long after a monthly board meeting until the meeting minutes are available to the community

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Hi,
Ok, I have searched and read ALOT of the posts on this site concerning Board Meeting minutes. There are alot more variations on how different HOA's handle the minutes, the involvement of management companies, the duties completed by the Board secretary and good old Robert's Rules of Order.
I manage the website for our communities HOA. It seems like every few months (often after a heated meeting), I am asked many times "when will the meeting minutes be posted". The answer is always the same "a week or so AFTER the next board meeting". This is due to our Board's process of accepting a motion to not read the minutes from the last meeting and then accepting the minutes from the last meeting, and usually a week or so later, the property management company sends me the minutes.
In reading the searches on this site, I have to wonder - how many provide "draft" or other methods of informing the community of the business of the HOA without a 4-5 week delay?
Last Wednesday, one of our Board members resigned (nasty scene). So far there has not been any public email or website News post as to the resignation, appointment of new Board member, etc. I repeated the same message to 10 neighbors this evening on my walk - Yes a board member resigned, yes it was Joe, yes Peter was appointed by the Board, Yes they were following the rules, etc. I can say this information because the HOA President sent me an email on Sunday to change the Board membership page on the website, so that information is "public".
My wife is laughing as I type this because she pointed out, that since the community newsletter is published the first of each month, some of the information from the board meeting trickles out in articles in the newsletter, but not everything.
How many days after a monthly meeting does it take for the information to reach the community?

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

30 days if your doing monthly meetings. Minutes have to be approved at the next meeting. They are taken at the meeting and then reviewed on the next meeting. Once agreed upon they become official notes of the HOA.

Former HOA President

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

The real answer is, it may never reach the owners. One, it depends on the frequentcy of the meeting, some are monthly, some every two months, some quarterly, some when they feel like it. Many boards will not send ouy minutes unless hey ask for them. Some don't have web sites or web portals. Some HOA's, you have to go beggng for them.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

Yes, lots of variability depending on the frequency of meetings, state laws, availability of a web site, etc., etc.

You have to remember that the minutes won't be "official" until they are approved at the following meeting. Some communities make the unapproved minutes available before then, but homeowners have to understand that things could change. (And consider the annual meeting. Minutes for the previous meeting aren't approved until the next meeting, which typically means a year later.)

Also, no matter what the rules say, when you're relying on volunteers to do this stuff, sometimes it won't get done quickly enough or professionally enough to suit others. If you feel that those volunteers aren't doing their jobs, perhaps it's time to step up and serve on the board yourself - then you can see to it that things happen in a more timely fashion.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Henry

Simply say the BOD has until its next meeting to approve the minutes. Anything done prior to that is "rumor", not the Official Minutes.

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

Henry,

I'll post unofficial meeting minutes within 2-24 hours of the regular HOA meeting. If the meeting minutes change demonstrably when we officially approve them weeks later, I'll adjust it. No website version of meeting minutes will count as official documents but they're accurate.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KellyM3 on 06/22/2021 7:26 AM
Henry,

I'll post unofficial meeting minutes within 2-24 hours of the regular HOA meeting. If the meeting minutes change demonstrably when we officially approve them weeks later, I'll adjust it. No website version of meeting minutes will count as official documents but they're accurate.

Good for you, but unnecessary. Personally I do not like unapproved Minutes as they can be "slanted" leaving many to think they are "correct".

BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821

Posted:

We post draft minutes. I find the more information you make available, the less people clamor for it.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Good article and sample Minutes:

https://www.hoamanagement.com/hoa-meeting-minutes-template/

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

First, it depends on your state statutes. There also might be something your Bylaws.

In CA, we must provide draft minutes to owners 30 days after the relevant meeting. DRAFT is stamped in big letters on them.

We are not required to post them, but we do on our website a few days after they're approved at our regular monthly board meeting.

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 06/22/2021 7:30 AM

Posted By KellyM3 on 06/22/2021 7:26 AM
Henry,

I'll post unofficial meeting minutes within 2-24 hours of the regular HOA meeting. If the meeting minutes change demonstrably when we officially approve them weeks later, I'll adjust it. No website version of meeting minutes will count as official documents but they're accurate.

Good for you, but unnecessary. Personally I do not like unapproved Minutes as they can be "slanted" leaving many to think they are "correct".

I can understand that perspective. Our particular operation is fairly straight-forward and not complex as a property maintenance-focused master association. I'd bet most people here would view our minutes as very spartan and action focused.

MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109

Posted:

We don't publish or otherwise share BOD minutes with the owners. The Board was elected to conduct business of the HOA which we do in accordance with the bylaws. Annual meeting minutes are shared at the next annual meeting.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/22/2021 5:05 PM
We don't publish or otherwise share BOD minutes with the owners. The Board was elected to conduct business of the HOA which we do in accordance with the bylaws. Annual meeting minutes are shared at the next annual meeting.

How would I know that you are conducting business in accordance to the bylaws if I can't review the minutes from the board meetings?

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/22/2021 5:05 PM
We don't publish or otherwise share BOD minutes with the owners. The Board was elected to conduct business of the HOA which we do in accordance with the bylaws. Annual meeting minutes are shared at the next annual meeting.

So, who elected you? And you don't think you own an responsibility to the same people on how you run their business?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Maybe LA is a closed meeting state where Boards don't have to share meeting minutes with owners?

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Well, guess I can cross off LA as a suitable HOA community state.

MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109

Posted:

All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109

Posted:

All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109

Posted:

All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/23/2021 12:58 PM
All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

I think what may be important is that Louisiana statutes do not require corporations to share Minutes. From https://www.hoatalk.com/Search/ForumSearch/tabid/87/forumid/1/postid/295252/view/topic/Default.aspx:

Quote:

Posted By n/a on 12/08/2020 7:43 AM

Posted By TimB4 on 12/08/2020 4:32 AM

Typically, Associations are incorporated.
If incorporated, they must comply with Corporate statutes as well as property statutes.

The right of inspection is typically identified within corporate statutes:

LA Rev Stat § 12:1-1602

§1-1602. Inspection of records by shareholders

A. A shareholder of a corporation is entitled to inspect and copy, during regular business hours at the corporation's principal office, any of the records of the corporation described in R.S. 12:1-1601(E) if the shareholder gives the corporation a signed written notice of the shareholder's demand at least five business days before the date on which the shareholder wishes to inspect and copy.

LA Rev Stat § 12:1-1601

PART 16. RECORDS AND REPORTS

SUBPART A. RECORDS

§1-1601. Corporate records

A. A corporation shall keep as permanent records minutes of all meetings of its shareholders and board of directors, a record of all actions taken by the shareholders or board of directors without a meeting, and a record of all actions taken by a committee of the board of directors in place of the board of directors on behalf of the corporation.

I saw this, too. But to me, the problem is that the statute limits what the shareholder (or HOA member) may view to only what is in 12:1-1601 (E). Part (E) does not list the Minutes of Board meetings.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/23/2021 12:58 PM
All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

It may depend on whether you live in an open meeting state or not.

If yes, it's entirely appropriate to publish minutes from meetings that owners are entitled to attend in person. If not, then I can maybe see the rationale behind not publishing them. On the other hand, my state does not require open meetings but many of the HOAs I'm familiar with have opened their meetings regardless. Transparency is a good thing, and people tend assume the worst when things are done behind closed doors.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CathyA3 on 06/23/2021 1:22 PM

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/23/2021 12:58 PM
[snip]I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

It may depend on whether you live in an open meeting state or not.

If yes, it's entirely appropriate to publish minutes from meetings that owners are entitled to attend in person. If not, then I can maybe see the rationale behind not publishing them. On the other hand, my state does not require open meetings but many of the HOAs I'm familiar with have opened their meetings regardless. Transparency is a good thing, and people tend assume the worst when things are done behind closed doors.

CathyA3 is correct, as far as I am concerned. Best practices calls for publicizing Minutes to the members. Transparency builds trust.

I believe most HOAs/COAs do make Minutes available to members, with many of these HOAs/COAs actually either (1) emailing; (2) mailing; or (3) posting (on say a web site) the Minutes and not waiting for, say, a formal records request.

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Thank you MelissaP1

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Thank you

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Cathy,
Thank you for the reply.
Our minutes are captured by the management company I have learned.

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Sure seems like a good idea...unfortunately it is not accepted here nor most of the posts on HOA Talk

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

Thank you.
I will try to find something in the Florida statues. Our Bylaws to not mention it.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HenryD3 on 06/23/2021 8:24 PM
Thank you.
I will try to find something in the Florida statues. Our Bylaws to not mention it.

HenryD3, if this is a Florida non-condo HOA, then in Florida, it is subject to FS 720. See http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0720/0720.html

Search the above site for "minutes."

Also your HOA is almost assuredly also a nonprofit corporation. As such, it would be subject to the Florida Nonprofit Corporation Act. See http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0600-0699/0617/0617.html . Search the latter site also for "minutes."

These two statutes are the main ones about which your Board and HOA membership should be concerned.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/23/2021 12:58 PM
All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

That's fine, but I still think homeowners should be able to get copies of the minutes. even if your state allows closed board meetings, I think transparency is more important. After all, you were ELECTED by the homeowners who also help pay the bills.

If you have a community website, what's wrong with posting minutes after they're approved? I wouldn't worry about people questioning the decisions - actually I think It's a good idea to ask questions about things you don't understand. Homeowners don't have to agree with the decision,but I believe they should be able to go to you or any board member and ask about the thinking behind the decision. I don't think they'll question EVERY decision - usually if they can get a clear explanation of why something is necessary, the homeowner will be ok with it, even if he or she still disagrees.

You're correct in that the board is elected to make decisions that are best for the community and sometimes that means making hard obes. If people don't like it, they can always run for a seat in the next election and see if they can do a better job.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

DavidF22 (New York)
Posts: 91

Posted:

We never get the minutes. Our state law requires that they be made available to homeowners, but you would have to make a request to our Board and it could take some time to get a response. Then, they'd make you travel 20 miles to the management office where you could sit in a conference room, look at the minutes and take notes. But you could not make copies and the property manager would sit there and watch to make sure you're not photographing anything with your phone. It's probably kind of how things are in China.

And, of course, our minutes are likely engineered to provide as little information as possible. Our monthly newsletters are such a joke that some of us in the community have developed back channels for real information that we share among ourselves. We often learn of important decisions that should be relayed to the community (or even put up for a community vote), but we see no mentions of them in the newsletter.

Sorry to vent. Our community is a mess.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

While we do not distribute Minutes, we will provide anybody asking for them a copy of them. No one has ever asked us.

BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MikeB23 on 06/23/2021 12:58 PM
All own ers are furnished copies of the bylaws and the Rules and Regulations. Believe me, when they see someone not complying the board hears about it, and when we do we communicate in person with the person with the complaint.

I have homes in two HOA's in Louisiana and had a home in an HOA in Utah. I've never seen or heard of Board meeting minutes being published or shared with the owners.

It really works quite well, and avoids hours of endless complaining and challenging of decisions.

Some decisions should be challenged.

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

AugustinD,
Thank you. Yes, our HOA Board falls under FS 720 and is a nonprofit corp.
Henry

HenryD3 (Florida)
Posts: 49

Posted:

DavidF22,
We are in the same communication vacuum.
As I stated in the original post. We have a rules violation that was due to wrong information provided by the management company. As a result of how things were handled by the Board. One Board member has resigned. At the Board meeting last week, his replacement was appointed.
I asked the President the sequence on how the infraction was reported, discussed by the board, a resolution decision made, the Board member resigned and THEN the monthly meeting. I asked if minutes were available concerning the board member meeting held to resolve the issue - I was told NO. The monthly public board meeting was held, but the minutes will not be available to me until Mid / Late July. If this had occurred during the July meeting, the minutes would not be available until late September, as our Board does not meet in August.
Ten days since the June Board meeting, the Board has asked me to put the photo of the new Board member up on the website. There has been no announcement or email to the homeowners (the normal method of communication). The Board did send an "Letter to the Community" by email describing the rules infraction and the fault being the Property Management Company. They did not make any menton of the resignation of the Board member or a new board member appointed.

EvelynW (South Carolina)
Posts: 13

Posted:

Transparency...transparency...transparency is vital today....draft minutes should be distributed and then when voted on at the next meeting the final version is sent out with the secretary's signature...

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

I am all about transparency but releasing draft notes causes LOTS of confusion. If they are wrong or action not taken yet, people will get upset quick. So it's best to not release draft notes because they are not official decisions of the HOA board yet. Otherwise it could leave the impression they are.

Former HOA President

BarbaraT1 (Texas)
Posts: 821

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/25/2021 9:04 PM
I am all about transparency but releasing draft notes causes LOTS of confusion. If they are wrong or action not taken yet, people will get upset quick. So it's best to not release draft notes because they are not official decisions of the HOA board yet. Otherwise it could leave the impression they are.

They certainly are decisions.

If the board approves a bid, I call the vendor the next day. If they levy a fine, it’s sent the next day. You don’t wait to act until the minutes are approved.

If you are taking your minutes properly, there is no drama to be mined. When was the meeting called to order, who was there, what was decided, when it was adjourned. That’s it.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By BarbaraT1 on 06/25/2021 10:16 PM

Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/25/2021 9:04 PM
I am all about transparency but releasing draft notes causes LOTS of confusion. If they are wrong or action not taken yet, people will get upset quick. So it's best to not release draft notes because they are not official decisions of the HOA board yet. Otherwise it could leave the impression they are.

They certainly are decisions.

If the board approves a bid, I call the vendor the next day. If they levy a fine, it’s sent the next day. You don’t wait to act until the minutes are approved.

If you are taking your minutes properly, there is no drama to be mined. When was the meeting called to order, who was there, what was decided, when it was adjourned. That’s it.

AMEN!

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

CA, Melissa, requires draft minutes be given to owners who request them 30 days after the relevant meeting. DRAFT is stamped in huge letters on each page. Others states or governing docs may have this requirement too.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

CA, Melissa, requires draft minutes be given to owners who request them 30 days after the relevant meeting. DRAFT is stamped in huge letters on each page. Others states or governing docs may have this requirement too.

MikeB23 (Louisiana)
Posts: 109

Posted:

Since my last post we have had our annual meeting and elected one new board member. I was providing him some background info for our first board meeting which will be tomorrow. His comment to me was, "Wow, thanks for allowing us all to live here without bothering us with all the things you have been dealing with."

As I think I said earlier, the owners elected us to run the HOA. We do that and answer all questions in a timely manner as they are asked and share information that affects all owners.

We have a happy HOA with little conflict in the 40+ units.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Kerry I have said 30 days after a meeting would be expectation to getting the meeting notes. However, usually AFTER the meeting if it's monthly. I don't think it's reasonable or smart to distribute meeting notes immediately after a meeting. Too many misinterpretations can be made.

Former HOA President