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SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
At my property, I have a 6ft vinyl fence, and behind that, I have a 10ft hedge. I didn't get the fence approved by HOA but I had that set up for 10 years now which makes it fall under the statue of limitation. For the past year, I've been having problems with my HOA about my hedge height being too high because in the bylaws it states that hedges and fences cannot be higher than 4 ft if it's on a retention pond. I've contacted the river management district that maintains that pond and they've told me that the pond my house is on is a DETENTION (not retention) pond and the permits also state that too. When I found out about that, I've refused to trim the shrubs. The HOA decided to survey the pond to claim I'm off the boundary line just to continue to target my house. They've found that I'm off-line and also 10 other houses on that same pond are off-line with trees or hedges. I've attended their meeting and they basically want to ignore the houses that have a small gap in the middle of their hedge (which some of them are actually 6 ft hedges on the same pond that they also ignored) and they want to ignore regular trees that are off line but they want to go after only the houses that have a complete hedge with no gap and houses with fences. Me and only one other homeowner out of the ten have a complete fence or a hedge. Also, according to the board members, the builders of the community didn't respect the boundary lines because they have documents contradicting where the actual boundary line is. They mentioned something about them wanting to change the documents or make them align which I'm not exactly sure what documents they're referring to. When the survey was done every house have the original sprinkler lines beyond the survey flags. My fence is also right beside my sprinkler line, if I move the fence where the survey flags was placed, my sprinklers would be outside the fence.

Today I've received a pre-suit mediation from their lawyer to settle the hedge height and also the vinyl fence being erected on a common area. I don't know how legal is this, but they have literally never sent me any violation about the boundary line before the pre-suit mediation letter and they have not given me any documentation to review the survey they've done and give me a chance to get my own survey. So basically, I've never disputed the boundary line situation. They are not going after the houses with tress or the ones that have a gap in their hedge like I've mentioned and in my opinion if they want to go after boundary lines they have to hold every house accountable regardless of what structures the homeowners have that's enroaching. There's nothing in the bylaws that allows certain types of enroaching and not others. What do you guys think about this? Do you think they're doing the right thing? Also, Do you think they have a fight or they are just trying to use scare tactics?
BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273
Posted:
Pre-suit mediation sounds like a requirement for mediation before going to court. This is common for many courts in order to reduce dockets. This could be a scare tactic or it could be a formality before they file suit. I would suggest attending the mediation in good faith. You might actually be able to agree on a solution.

I also suggest getting an attorney. It sounds like there are a lot of legal issues here. For one, statutes of limitations (SOL) are not always what they seem. You may be mistaken in believing that the SOL started when the fence was built. Since the violation still exists, the SOL probably does not even apply. A better defense might be that the restriction was abandoned since the HOA let it go for ten years.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
This sounds like a possible "class action" lawsuit/mediation. So I don't see a problem here with the HOA asking for HOA mediation over the issue. It sounds like they want to group everyone effected to get a group agreement on terms.

Former HOA President
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/16/2021 9:40 PM
At my property, I have a 6ft vinyl fence, and behind that, I have a 10ft hedge. I didn't get the fence approved by HOA but I had that set up for 10 years now which makes it fall under the statue of limitation.
Would you please cite and quote the "statute of limitation" that you claim applies here?

Can you quote anything your HOA's governing documents say about pre-suit mediation or how to handle disputes?

From the net, I believe Wisconsin does not have a HOA statute for non-condo HOAs. Only the Nonstock Corporation statute applies. So far I see nothing in the latter statute requiring pre-suit mediation. There may be such a requirement for this situation buried in other statutes. Certainly nationwide judges would rather folks attempted mediation before filing a lawsuit. There's been a movement for pre-suit mediation for decades now.

Mediation is not a bad thing.

I tend to agree with BenA2 that your best chances by far will occur by using an attorney. Retaining an attorney won't be cheap, but it's cheaper than going to court. I'd estimate this will cost you $5000 to $20,000, and you may not win all you want to win. Justice does not come cheap.
SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
I don't believe it's a class-action lawsuit because I'm the only one that received that letter.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Courts require mediation only after a lawsuit has been filed. A lawsuit, if filed, would describe the HOA's claims in detail with the related exhibits attached.

So this isn't court-ordered mediation. But your HOA must have sent you some specific description of what they wanted to mediate. Can you provide us with the exact wording of what they say needs to be mediated.

Like others, I agree that mediation can be a good starting place. Both sides get to say their piece before a neutral professional who does not make a ruling. The mediator tries to get the parties to come to a mutual decision on their own. It would be a good idea for you to verify this with your HOA before participating.

Since the records they have compiled are relevant to the discussion, you should also make sure that you will be able to review those documents, preferably in advance of the meeting.

Also find out if there are any restrictions on who you can bring, and who will be attending to represent the HOA. If the HOA lawyer will be there, you should consider bringing your own.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
This house is actually in Florida, and Florida has a 5 year statute of limitations for enforcement of restrictive covenants. There is nothing in their governing documents that say anything about mediation. They have the weakest governing documents and they know that because they admit to it. They literally cannot enforce anything. I've been in this HOA for 15 years and they cannot force homeowners to clean the mold of their house or to stop parking on the street or stop blocking the sidewalk or to stop parking their boat here, which all is addressed in the bylaws. They have no fining committee so they cannot fine anyone and everyone is breaking the bylaws so they can't pick on one homeowner due to selective enforcement. I've spoke to some neighbors and everyone says that they literally have no power. All they do is pay $100 to their lawyer to send a demand letter and if the homeowner doesn't comply still then they just complain to the city if the violation breaks the city laws so the city can take care of an issue.
SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
It just says pre-suit mediation to settle the disputed violations: homeowner built a fence prior to approval from the ARC. Homeowner erected a fence on a common area and is trespassing association property. Shrubs need to be 4ft according to article so and so.

I don't even know how they are to settle something before that sending me a letter of violation to see if I will comply and correct the violations.
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NpS on 04/17/2021 9:41 AM
Courts require mediation only after a lawsuit has been filed.
Yeahbut covenants and statutes can require pre-suit mediation.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/17/2021 10:06 AM
This house is actually in Florida,
This would have been way helpful to know in advance, instead of making readers think you are a Wisconsin-ite.

Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/17/2021 10:06 AM
Florida has a 5 year statute of limitations for enforcement of restrictive covenants.
Condo or non-condo? Does FS 718 or FS 720 apply?
AugustinD
Posts: 3,698
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/17/2021 10:06 AM
Florida has a 5 year statute of limitations for enforcement of restrictive covenants.
This claim by SamJ6 appears to come from Florida case law, and in particular, Pond Apple Place III Condo. Ass n v. Russo, 841 So. 2d 526, 527 (Fla. 4th DCA 2003). From reviewing other cases citing the 2003 Pond Apple, so far it appears to me the OP is on good legal ground to invoke the five year limit.
BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/17/2021 10:19 AM
It just says pre-suit mediation to settle the disputed violations: homeowner built a fence prior to approval from the ARC. Homeowner erected a fence on a common area and is trespassing association property. Shrubs need to be 4ft according to article so and so.

I don't even know how they are to settle something before that sending me a letter of violation to see if I will comply and correct the violations.

Is there a requirement that you receive a letter of violation before the HOA files suit? Typically, violation letters are required before fining or other punitive actions by the HOA. There is usually no requirement for a violation letter before a lawsuit. I don't know Florida law but it is probably a safe assumption their attorney does.
SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
non-condo, FS 720 applies.
SamJ6 (Wisconsin )
Posts: 23
Posted:
I'm also thinking that since the sprinkler line has been in the common area since the house was built, which was 21 years ago, that would possibly give me a perspective easement to that common area.
BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SamJ6 on 04/17/2021 11:55 AM
I'm also thinking that since the sprinkler line has been in the common area since the house was built, which was 21 years ago, that would possibly give me a perspective easement to that common area.

If you have a prescriptive easement due to the sprinkler system being there for 21 years, it only applies to the sprinkler. An easement is for a particular use, it does not give you any other rights to the property.

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