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JohnW52 (Illinois)
Posts: 4
Posted:
We are about to break with our management company and transition to a self-managed condominium community. For the last 15 years all documents such as invoices, bank statements, payroll records, legal correspondence, contracts, etc. has gone to the management company's offices. Our previous board trusted the management company and never even saw the invoices or bank records, let alone reviewed them. The reports the previous board was receiving from the management company don't make sense and don't even mathematically add up.

Our question is: if we go to the management company and ask for all the hardcopy records, we have a feeling they won't give them to us. They have offered to make copies of the documents for us and charge us for the copies. Are the original records legally the property of the condo association or are they the property of the management company? We would like to just go to their offices with boxes and take the original records. Can we do that?
ChrisE8
Posts: 454
Posted:
Does your property management agreement have a provision about who receives and owns records?

I'd say that you could certainly ask for the records.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
JohnW
About going self managed, I am curious about a few things:

1. Type of your building(s)? High rise, townhomes, standalone, etc.
2. How many units/owners?
3. How many units are rented?
4. Anyone own and rent out multi units?
5. Size of budget?
6. Monthly dues?
7. Size of Reserves?
8. Reasons for going self managed?
9. Expect cost savings going self managed?

Only professionally, not personally, interested.

Thanks
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Unfortunately, I can see an argument each way and would defer to the contract.

You may need to involve an attorney if the contract isn't clear or if the MC is reluctant in providing the info.
JohnC77 (California)
Posts: 562
Posted:
I have been told by a couple of attorneys, the records, all the records, paper produced, are the sole property if the client you serve. The software that is used in conducting our business is proprietary, so we would not provide an excel spreadsheet to make it easier for the next management company.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
First, you should have already read the contract you have with the management company to see how the contract is supposed to be terminated - that language should also include how transfer of the records is to be handled. If you and your board haven't read it, I strongly suggest you do that immediately - You shouldn't have to guess how this works. Review the contract with your association attorney who should guide you through the transition.

I have a hunch you haven't made a transition plan either, so while you're going about getting the records, you'll need to prepare one in a hurry.. Self management can be effective if you have people who are willing and able to do the job. You can hire contractors to do things like bookkeeping, but if you've left everything to the property manager until now, you may be in for a surprise - and I don't mean a pleasant one.

You were asked basic information about you community, so start there. That will give you some sort of idea as to what documents should be there. It may also help to get someone to organize what you get before you begin to review them to see if the record keeping makes sense - and where the holes are.

By the way, you want to pick up the documents using a bunch of boxes. Do you have any idea how you will preserve these records? Do you know what needs to be preserved forever vs. a year or two? This is the type of thing that's addressed in a documentation policy - do you have one? If not, that's another task for you.

Your entire board and perhaps some others will need to work together to see where you are before you start the self management route. I'm not saying not to do it but sometimes people think they can easily take over what the property manager did without thinking the thing all the way through. Happy New Years and saddle up - you're in for a long strange trip.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
SueW6 (Michigan)
Posts: 814
Posted:
Starting from scratch?

Your bank can give you the statements for the last 12 months. You will need a personal visit to the bank anyway.

Contact all the vendors and ask them to forward you a copy of the contract that they have with the HOA.

Even if you are self managed you should have an accountant. The accountant can look up any kinds of records with the state or other local agency that might need payments from you. That person should know the ropes.

I don’t know what else you mean by “originals.”? The secretary should have all of the minutes plus the originals such as your CCR‘s and bylaws should be in the possession of the secretary also.

Prepare to do a lot of work.
JohnW52 (Illinois)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Thanks for the great ideas everyone. I should clarify that we probably aren't truly "self-managing." We have two full-time staff people who are each going to take on some new responsibilities plus we have a law firm and accountant on retainer for items when they come up. One of the full-time staff people was just hired and he will coordinate most repairs, maintenance, outside contractors and work orders. The other full-time person is very willing and able to take on billing owners and depositing HOAs. We're going to give it a try and see how it goes. If we decide we want to add a management company again, at least we will have a better understanding of their systems.

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