JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Are you for or against and why so?
Thanks
Thanks
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Opinions On Proxies
Started by JohnC46 • 18 replies • 513 views
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GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
For general business, or just election of directors?
If votes, I would be for, unless there is another method for votes to be cast.
But, if nominations from the floor are not allowed, then there is no need for them - but some HOA/COA/POAs live on noms from the floor ...
If votes, I would be for, unless there is another method for votes to be cast.
But, if nominations from the floor are not allowed, then there is no need for them - but some HOA/COA/POAs live on noms from the floor ...
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
I'm for directed proxies.
Against general proxies.
For those who might not know, A proxy authorizes someone to vote on your behalf.
A general proxy allows that individual to vote how they think is best.
A directed proxy instructs that individual to vote a specific way.
Against general proxies.
For those who might not know, A proxy authorizes someone to vote on your behalf.
A general proxy allows that individual to vote how they think is best.
A directed proxy instructs that individual to vote a specific way.
GeorgeR8 (Arizona)
Posts: 182
Posts: 182
Posted:
No proxies in my state.
No need for them. Can't vote on something that isn't on the agenda. The agenda goes out with the ballots.
No need for them. Can't vote on something that isn't on the agenda. The agenda goes out with the ballots.
JohnC77 (California)
Posts: 562
Posts: 562
Posted:
Proxies should be banned..PERIOD
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
We haven't had any problems in my community during the 18 years I've lived here. I think the key is to make the instructions simple, pray homeowners READ them and then open and count them in front of the homeowners during a meeting.
We only use them for the annual and people can state they want them used to set quorum, designate some to vote on their behalf (otherwise the board president does it for them.). They can also nominate someone to run for the board of themselves.
I wouldn't use them for a vote to amend documents or a special assessment. For that, I think people need to speak for their damned selves and make the effort to vote yes or nea.
We only use them for the annual and people can state they want them used to set quorum, designate some to vote on their behalf (otherwise the board president does it for them.). They can also nominate someone to run for the board of themselves.
I wouldn't use them for a vote to amend documents or a special assessment. For that, I think people need to speak for their damned selves and make the effort to vote yes or nea.
If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 09/24/2020 2:56 PM
I'm for directed proxies.
Against general proxies.
For those who might not know, A proxy authorizes someone to vote on your behalf.
A general proxy allows that individual to vote how they think is best.
A directed proxy instructs that individual to vote a specific way.
I'm for directed proxies.
Against general proxies.
For those who might not know, A proxy authorizes someone to vote on your behalf.
A general proxy allows that individual to vote how they think is best.
A directed proxy instructs that individual to vote a specific way.
Forgot to add the reason why:
Although proxies (especially general proxies) can be abused (major soliciting to gather proxies to have the vote go your way), many members in an association (like our nation) simply don't take the time to vote (various reasons). Often, you need a certain percentage to adopt a policy or increase assessments. Proxies allow this to be obtained.
Directed proxies shows the members actual desire.
General proxies simply show that they cared enough to sign a form and return (or they trust the individual that they appointed to be their proxy).
JohnC77 (California)
Posts: 562
Posts: 562
Posted:
I gave my directed proxy that had BYEDON for president and gave it to the Trump campaign. What's the odds it gets counted.
JohnC77 (California)
Posts: 562
Posts: 562
Posted:
To add, your vote is NO LONGER secret.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
If online voting is not available, then I am for proxies, whether they are general or directed. Why? Because proxies have a long, well-established tradition for publicly held corporations, and because the only abuses I have seen of proxies are via a Board placing unlawful requirements on them.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC77 on 09/24/2020 6:44 PM
To add, your vote is NO LONGER secret.
To add, your vote is NO LONGER secret.
I could care less if my vote is secret.
GeorgeR8 (Arizona)
Posts: 182
Posts: 182
Posted:
In my state it's only secret when you vote for people such as a board election. Not secret when you vote for things. Separate ballots for annual meetings. One for the board and one for everything else. The everything else ballot must be signed.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
In many associations, if it weren't for proxies, they wouldn't make quorum for the annual meeting.
We use general proxies for that purpose only, and the proxies expire after the meeting. If there is a matter requiring a vote (eg. amending CC&Rs), we handle that via paper ballots sent to the owner's address.
And of course no proxies for board meetings.
We use general proxies for that purpose only, and the proxies expire after the meeting. If there is a matter requiring a vote (eg. amending CC&Rs), we handle that via paper ballots sent to the owner's address.
And of course no proxies for board meetings.
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posts: 880
Posted:
Proxies can be abused, so if they are used at all, proxies should have certain limitations, such as:
Proxies should be signed and dated,
only directed proxies,
no general proxies,
limited in time and/or limited to an event such as the annual meeting,
revocable by the signer by issuing a revocation or issuing another proxy with a later date or by showing up in person to the meeting.
Proxies should be verified by the folks conducting the vote.
Those conditions should ideally be in state law or in the bylaws so that parties cannot abuse proxies.
Proxies should be signed and dated,
only directed proxies,
no general proxies,
limited in time and/or limited to an event such as the annual meeting,
revocable by the signer by issuing a revocation or issuing another proxy with a later date or by showing up in person to the meeting.
Proxies should be verified by the folks conducting the vote.
Those conditions should ideally be in state law or in the bylaws so that parties cannot abuse proxies.
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posts: 880
Posted:
The nonprofit law in most states allows ballots to be used instead of proxies.
For example, South Carolina law
"Unless prohibited or limited by the articles or bylaws, any action that may be taken at any annual, regular, or special meeting of members may be taken without a meeting if the corporation delivers a written or electronic ballot to every member entitled to vote on the matter."
Many other states have the same law.
For example, South Carolina law
"Unless prohibited or limited by the articles or bylaws, any action that may be taken at any annual, regular, or special meeting of members may be taken without a meeting if the corporation delivers a written or electronic ballot to every member entitled to vote on the matter."
Many other states have the same law.
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
One limitation of directed proxies:
Our association allows nominations from the floor at the annual meeting. So persons submitting a directed proxy ahead of time would not know about these candidates, some of whom they may have wanted to vote for if they'd known about them.
Obviously if your association requires all nominations to be made ahead of time, this is not an issue.
And as I noted earlier, we don't vote on issues at the annual meeting but conduct a separate vote by paper ballots. If there is something requiring input from the community, we want to hear from everyone, not just the small subset of owners who attend the annual meeting.
So people have to decide if the benefits of directed proxies justify their few disadvantages. It will depend on your CC&Rs and state laws (as is usually the case with HOAs and COAs).
Our association allows nominations from the floor at the annual meeting. So persons submitting a directed proxy ahead of time would not know about these candidates, some of whom they may have wanted to vote for if they'd known about them.
Obviously if your association requires all nominations to be made ahead of time, this is not an issue.
And as I noted earlier, we don't vote on issues at the annual meeting but conduct a separate vote by paper ballots. If there is something requiring input from the community, we want to hear from everyone, not just the small subset of owners who attend the annual meeting.
So people have to decide if the benefits of directed proxies justify their few disadvantages. It will depend on your CC&Rs and state laws (as is usually the case with HOAs and COAs).
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By CathyA3 on 09/26/2020 5:12 AM
One limitation of directed proxies:
Our association allows nominations from the floor at the annual meeting. So persons submitting a directed proxy ahead of time would not know about these candidates, some of whom they may have wanted to vote for if they'd known about them.
Obviously if your association requires all nominations to be made ahead of time, this is not an issue.
And as I noted earlier, we don't vote on issues at the annual meeting but conduct a separate vote by paper ballots. If there is something requiring input from the community, we want to hear from everyone, not just the small subset of owners who attend the annual meeting.
So people have to decide if the benefits of directed proxies justify their few disadvantages. It will depend on your CC&Rs and state laws (as is usually the case with HOAs and COAs).
One limitation of directed proxies:
Our association allows nominations from the floor at the annual meeting. So persons submitting a directed proxy ahead of time would not know about these candidates, some of whom they may have wanted to vote for if they'd known about them.
Obviously if your association requires all nominations to be made ahead of time, this is not an issue.
And as I noted earlier, we don't vote on issues at the annual meeting but conduct a separate vote by paper ballots. If there is something requiring input from the community, we want to hear from everyone, not just the small subset of owners who attend the annual meeting.
So people have to decide if the benefits of directed proxies justify their few disadvantages. It will depend on your CC&Rs and state laws (as is usually the case with HOAs and COAs).
we also nominate from the floor.
Our directed proxy form allows for this:
"I further direct the proxy representative to case my vote in the following way and, if there are nominees from the floor, to cast remaining votes how they think is best."
Granted, this only works if there are less then the number of open seats available and there are remaining votes available.
ChrisE8
Posts: 454
Posts: 454
Posted:
I'm in favor of proxies. Otherwise a HOA election would rarely have enough turnout to be valid.
However, the property manager and the board should NEVER collect proxies. A property manager and board collecting proxies is the same as Donald Trump and Nancy Pelosi collecting ballots.
Proxies should be handled by an independent committee or, better yet, owners should just give proxies to friends who will vote how the owners specify.
However, the property manager and the board should NEVER collect proxies. A property manager and board collecting proxies is the same as Donald Trump and Nancy Pelosi collecting ballots.
Proxies should be handled by an independent committee or, better yet, owners should just give proxies to friends who will vote how the owners specify.
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