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EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
I am a homeowner with a landscape buffer easement in my backyard. My plot line actually extends past that berm to the main road. Our HOA Declarations state that the HOA has the right and duty to build, repair, and maintain the buffer easement area except for the portion that extends from the centerline of the berm inwards to the homes.

My question as a homeowner is that I am paying taxes on land that I have no rights to and I'm wondering if I can make an adverse possession case against the HOA to basically force them to take my property. Sounds goofy, but I really can't do anything with that roughly 80x20 strip of land.
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 8:36 AM
I am a homeowner with a landscape buffer easement in my backyard. My plot line actually extends past that berm to the main road. Our HOA Declarations state that the HOA has the right and duty to build, repair, and maintain the buffer easement area except for the portion that extends from the centerline of the berm inwards to the homes.

My question as a homeowner is that I am paying taxes on land that I have no rights to and I'm wondering if I can make an adverse possession case against the HOA to basically force them to take my property. Sounds goofy, but I really can't do anything with that roughly 80x20 strip of land.

I'm confused. If they are going to repair and maintain it why give it back? Also, for a 80x20 strip of land what type of tax break do you think you would get? Sounds like it would be peanuts. compared to the legal costs to get this done.
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
You're not going to force the HOA to take your land. HOAs are often stuck w/ pieces of land which they own but have zero control over due to easements, setback rules and other regulations beyond the community's control or input.

EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
The berm and landscaping makes the land useless. With Illinois taxes I'm not sure what that would do for me on my property taxes, but I'm thinking it would be something. If this is something that can potentially be done, we're talking at least 70 homes that could potentially participate.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Talk to tax assessor and see what kind of response you get!
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 8:36 AM
I'm wondering if I can make an adverse possession case against the HOA to basically force them to take my property.
Google on "adverse possession" and you will see this is not possible. Also most likely a vote of the membership would be necessary for the HOA to take ownership of this land.

It seems a stretch to suggest you enjoy no benefits from the land.
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
I truly gain no value from having that extra land under my ownership other than the fake number that says my lot size.

The HOA doesn't pay taxes on the parcels they hold, so if the land that they've maintained for 20 years is something I have no rights to, and I don't see why there would need to be a vote of the members to have it under HOA ownership.
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
I truly gain no value from having that extra land under my ownership other than the fake number that says my lot size.

The HOA doesn't pay taxes on the parcels they hold, so if the land that they've maintained for 20 years is something I have no rights to, and I don't see why there would need to be a vote of the members to have it under HOA ownership.

So your argument is that you should be able to dump any tax costs onto your neighbors without them having a vote?
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
I don't know what you are referring to. The HOA does not pay property taxes on open space parcels.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
I truly gain no value from having that extra land under my ownership other than the fake number that says my lot size.
I see. And like many of us, you did not study the covenants before you bought your home and lot to see that the acreage is this "fake number."
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
The HOA doesn't pay taxes on the parcels they hold, so if the land that they've maintained for 20 years is something I have no rights to,
Can the HOA build on this land? If not, then this is just one (of likely many) rights you have.
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
I don't see why there would need to be a vote of the members to have it under HOA ownership.
Do you have a copy of your HOA's Declaration of Covenants? Typically this is recorded with the County Clerk. Many states require that the Declaration be disclosed to buyers of land and homes.

For hundreds of years, courts have viewed covenants as contractual terms. Declarations of covenants often talk about (1) what property the HOA controls; and (2) what a HOA has to do to add property. To change the covenants in a HOA typically requires a vote of the membership.
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
I don't understand the hostility. I'm not mad about the situation because it is a nice to have the trees blocking the road, but if I can't build or plant anything, then why would I have to pay taxes on it?

Here is what the Declarations states:

" The association shall have the right and duty to build, repair, and maintain the Common Area, the Landscape Buffer Easement area,......., except for that portion of the Landscape Buffer Easement Area that runs from a line at the top of the berm and extending inward towards the respective homes, which shall be the respective Owner's duty to maintain."

"The Association shall have the right of ingress and egress over and upon the Common Area and the Landscape Buffer Easement Area for any and all purposes in connection with the use, maintenance, construction, operation, repair and reconstruction of the Common Area and Landscape Buffer Easement Area including but not limited to maintenance of landscaping, monumentation and storm water management areas."

So based on that writing, I understand that they have the right of ingress and egress for landscaping, but if I have no rights to do anything with that land, it seems plausible that I can make a case to cede that over to the HOA (along with the other 70 homeowners on the buffer).
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
Better question: Since that is my land, if someone gets hurt playing in the trees on that berm, who is liable? I don't maintain those trees or anything around it since it's the HOAs obligation.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 2:28 PM
... if I have no rights to do anything with that land, it seems plausible that I can make a case to cede that over to the HOA (along with the other 70 homeowners on the buffer).
In my experience, the law of covenants is what is standing in the way of your 'ceding' the land to the HOA. Respectfully, I suggest googling and studying this law.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 2:32 PM
Better question: Since that is my land, if someone gets hurt playing in the trees on that berm, who is liable? I don't maintain those trees or anything around it since it's the HOAs obligation.
Because of the covenant declaring that the HOA has a duty to maintain these areas, the HOA is going to be liable for injuries resulting from a failure to maintain. Also the HOA's insurer likely has deeper pockets. Attorneys are often much more incentivized to go after a HOA (and its insurance) rather than an individual.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
I truly gain no value from having that extra land under my ownership other than the fake number that says my lot size.

If it's on a recorded deed or plat then there's nothing "fake" about it. Just because you think it's "fake" does not make it so.

Quote:
Posted By EricB13 on 05/01/2020 12:35 PM
The HOA doesn't pay taxes on the parcels they hold, so if the land that they've maintained for 20 years is something I have no rights to, and I don't see why there would need to be a vote of the members to have it under HOA ownership.

That's the case in Florida, too. Typically HOAs don't pay tax on common property because the value of that land is already considered to be apportioned to the individual owners who collectively DO pay tax on it. Our county tax assessor told us, in person, "If you took your HOA home and lifted it up and placed it down in another area of the county where there's no HOA, you would pay less property tax."

Having said that, the value of owning real property is measured in more than just the need to pay taxes. A vote of the homeowners would most assuredly be required and they'd most likely ALL need to approve the change.
BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273
Posted:
Easements are so common I would be surprised if you could do anything to change it.

I would not say you have no rights to the land. You own it and can use it as long as it doesn't interfere with the easement.
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
I really don't have any rights to that land past the topline of the berm as I mentioned above. Heck, even if I tried to build a fence up to that top line, the board would veto the plans. Out of those 70+ homes along the berm, not a single one has a fence going up to the top of the berm. But I get why - aesthetically, it wouldn't look nice when driving along the main road.

So all I'm saying is, they Hoa is very restrictive on the land use surrounding the berm.
EricB13 (Illinois)
Posts: 29
Posted:
So while I may have 'rights' to say my lot size is x% bigger, I have no ability to do anything with it. If it was ceded over to the HOA as a common area, no ones life would change because even the landscapers cut the grass on the side of the berm that I'm supposed to maintain lol.
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
You can offer the easement land to the HOA and see what they say, if they accept, great. If not, I don't think there is any way to force them to accept it.

The bottom line is that you bought property subject to at least one easement, and you're probably stuck with it/them. It is also common to have utility easements on the front, sides, or back of a property, so you might have one of those too.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.

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