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LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Has anyone banned drones in their HOA? would it pass muster if the BOD put a drone ban in the Rules & Regs, and attach a $1000.00 fine for each violation?
Doing some gardening this morning and I found a micro drone by the spigot, on the floor above is the bathroom. I'm ready thinking the user was attempting to peer into a window, but I couldn't find a camera nor microSd card. Still none the less it makes me feel uneasy that someone is up to no good. Myself, I am an amateur electronics geek and used to fly RC planes. The micro drone I found is infrared controlled, not radio consoled, so the user had to have been an immediate neighbor.

Your thoughts???
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Even the people responsible for air traffic control has issues with Drones. What makes a HOA more powerful?

It sounds like some kid flying his drone around. My co-worker had a micro-one he flew in our office. Don't see anything bad about it. They fly them all the time with our local news whenever there is a catastrophe or road construction. We have a company that video tapes various things like this for even selling homes.

You may be a bit paranoid if you think a neighbor is spying on you via a drone. Kind of can hear them things coming. Plus if it gets in your space take a broom and knock it down. Their loss. Punishment enough to have lost it.

Former HOA President
CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
This is a summary of what we were told by our attorney:

* There are laws governing the use of drones, both federal and state. (In Ohio, hobbyists must follow FAA rules for model aircraft.) Boards should know what these are since community rules must comply.

* There are disagreements, though, on who owns the airspace above a community.

* HOAs and especially COAs can limit use of drones but may not be able to prohibit their use. For condos, any use of drones would take place on common elements, which is why boards can regulate them. There is also the safety issue: someone may lose control of the drone, damage personal or COA property, or even injure someone.

* Companies such as Amazon may use drones to make deliveries. For COAs, it will probably be necessary to designate a single delivery point or points for the community because you generally have multiple units per building, making front door delivery impossible. Realtors also are using drones to make videos of properties they are listing.

* Boards should get out ahead of this issue - otherwise they will be reacting after the fact, which may lead to unwise decisions. As usual, any rules should be "reasonable" and enforceable. For example, invasions of privacy should be prohibited. Also check with your insurance agent to make sure you're covered for any damages. Expect conflicts.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299
Posted:
Here is what NOLO has to say:

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/what-do-when-your-neighbor-has-drone.html
MarshallT (New York)
Posts: 414
Posted:
Hi,

An outright ban may be too extreme, and as someone else has pointed out, the HOA may need drones for some situations. You can create rules and regulations to help dissuade improper drone use.
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MarshallT on 04/17/2020 6:51 AM
Hi,

An outright ban may be too extreme, and as someone else has pointed out, the HOA may need drones for some situations. You can create rules and regulations to help dissuade improper drone use.

I agree that an outright ban would be extreme. Cases where I see a use of a drone necessary, realtors that want to showcase their listing, and contractors working for the association or individual property owner to inspect as assess the home.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
I think Melissa has a point - it may be a kid was playing with it and it landed in your yard, especially since there wasn't a camera or SD card on it. For now, hang on to it and see if the owner (who could be an adult) starts asking neighbors about it, and then you can deal with them personally. If nothing else, the owner needs to keep better track of the thing so it doesn't damage a neighbor's property, such as flying into a window.

If more people start using drones and you do start to see issues like this or people find drones armed with cameras, then you can start considering possible rules - Cathy's reference would be a good start for conversations with your association attorney.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
We amended our Rules & Regulations last year to include the following section. Eventually most of this will be added to our CC&Rs.

12. Drones

12.1 For the purposes of this section, the definition of “Drone” shall be the same as that found in Section 934.50(2)(a), Florida Statutes (2018). With regard to drone use, the Association will at all times comply with Section 934.50, Florida Statutes (2018), also known as the “Freedom from Unwarranted Surveillance Act”.

12.2 No one may launch, land or recover a drone from anywhere on the common property for recreational or hobby purposes.

12.3 No one may direct a commercial delivery drone to land on Common property.

12.4 Properly licensed operation of drones used lawfully by outside parties for commercial purposes (e.g. survey, inspection, insurance, etc.), to the extent authorized in writing by the Board of Directors or its designee in connection with the operation and management of the community by the Association may be operated within the community.

12.5 Properly licensed operation of drones used lawfully by real estate professionals or their employees/subcontractors assisting an owner with the sale of his/her home may be operated within the community provided that a copy of the drone operator’s “remote pilot airman certificate with a UAS rating”, as issued by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), is submitted to the Secretary in advance along with proof of liability insurance on the part of the operator.

12.6 Approved commercial use of drones shall comply with all provisions of the FAA’s “Part 107 Operating Rules”. Operators should be aware that all of XYZ HOA is within the Class D airspace surrounding the ABC Regional Airport.
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
GenoS, thanks for sharing this. I have a question on 12.3. In our condo community all land is common area. Is this the case with your community? If so, is the intent to ban Amazon and all other companies from using drones to deliver packages? I'm asking this out of pure curiosity because I've wondered how this will be handled.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnT38 on 04/17/2020 2:36 PM
GenoS, thanks for sharing this. I have a question on 12.3. In our condo community all land is common area. Is this the case with your community? If so, is the intent to ban Amazon and all other companies from using drones to deliver packages? I'm asking this out of pure curiosity because I've wondered how this will be handled.

Our HOA resembles a condominium in many ways. One of them is the homes are owned individually in fee simple and the lots were planned so that the individual lot boundaries conform to the slabs underneath the homes. So everything outside the walls of a home is common property. Even the driveways are common property. So yes, the idea was to restrict deliveries from Amazon and whoever else will be doing delivery-by-drone. There's at least one large grocery store chain that has started to investigate doing deliveries this way. We have one large retention pond that serves to collect overflow from the main ponds when there's a lot of rain. It would be perfect as a drone landing area, except when it's full of water

The idea is to head off any problems before they come up. What if an Amazon (don't mean to single them out) drone drops a package in that area and an hour later there's a torrential rain before the owner gets home and goes to collect his package? What if someone's dog interacts with a flying drone dropping down to deliver a package? We'd rather not get into all that, so we just say "No".

All of this drone stuff is constantly changing and still very new so we'll keep an eye on the changing regulatory environment and we could end up changing these rules if necessary.

We've had 2 incidents over the last few years. One was a drone with a camera came over the back fence near the clubhouse and seemed to be observing several women who were using the pool. Nobody saw where it came from, exactly, but it likely came from an adjoining subdivision. Can't shoot 'em down, so there wasn't much we could do about it. The local police are useless with this stuff and the FAA can't/won't do anything without some identifying information.

The other incident was a homeowner had a few guests one weekend last year and a teenage guest had a drone that he was flying around the neighborhood. Most people thought it was cool and interesting until it crashed into a parked vehicle and scratched up the paint. Every homeowner we spoke to when drafting those rules was in favor of some sort of restrictions.

You can't do anything if a drone comes flying over your property from outside the subdivision, but you can restrict the launching and recovery from inside the community, and that's what we did.
JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631
Posted:
Thanks for the information! We are in the process of rewriting our 40 year old governing docs and this topic was on my list to potentially address.
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Thank You Geno The template is wonderful starting point.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Geno,

Let me pile on with my thanks, as well!

Good stuff!
JimB37 (Florida)
Posts: 76
Posted:
Geno,
First, thank you for all of your insights. Most helpful. As a Part 107 pilot myself, I have to say I'm glad you're not in my neck of the woods.

I actually use my drone in the community to assist with mapping specific areas as well as doing surveys. I always fly by part 107 rules, so I stay over the streets or areas that do not contain risks should I experience a failure. I also help the golf course by doing surveys and mappings. I have a release by the course, I always fly with insurance, and I always check in before missions. Unfortunately, you can't rely on operators to do that, especially if they are flying recreationally, so I can understand the position.

With respect to the police being helpless, that may be a local thing. Our area happens to have a drone store who supplies many of the departments with whatever they need. So in the event of a drone "problem", they can pull out one of their own and follow it home. There are also other methods to terminate problem flights, but I'm not aware if any of our departments have gone that far yet.

Take care.

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