Terms of use of this website (or, “who can post and what can s/he say?”)

Started by PaulJ6 • 13 replies • 640 views

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PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

In some posts that were emailed to me, GeorgeS21 states that the purpose of this website is (if I am paraphrasing correctly) to be a positive place for HOAs, and GeorgeS21 has attempted to hinder certain posters from posting as they wish.

The owner of this website has posted terms of use, available at https://www.hoatalk.com/Home/tabid/36/ctl/Terms/Default.aspx. Those terms of use, not GeorgeS21, set forth the rules for who can post and what the posts can include.

In particular, please see the website rules under “Use of Communication Services”, which state what can and cannot be posted.

If anyone objects to those terms of use (e.g., if they are too permissive), I suggest contacting the owner of this website and having them changed. Neither GeorgeS21 nor I can state who can post or limit content. That is up to the owner of this website, not GeorgeS21 or me.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

Maybe it's just me, but I really don't see where George or anyone else has prohibited other people from posting. Apparently, the website moderators don't either, because both of you continue to post. So let them do their job.

That said, I recall TimB4 saying he left the board for a brief period because people were getting too personal and nasty with their comments, and I have noticed a lot of that bubbling (again?) as of late. For what it's worth, here's one person's opinion. Ladies and gentlemen, none of us know each other personally, so what's with all the yelling? I admit I can be blunt in my comments, but I like to think I haven't resorted to name-calling.

For any comment, if you disagree with what's being said, that's fine, but grown people know or should how to disagree without behaving like assholes. Some of the back and forth on this site is beginning to look like something I used to see in grade school (and sometimes high school) and it's unnecessary. If you come looking for advice, you can accept, some, none or all of what anyone says, so stop throwing a temper tantrum.

You may not like living in a HOA, but everyone makes that choice to live in one or not. If you like the house or condo enough to hold your nose and move in, it's better to look for ways on how to make the experience more tolerable other than saying ALL HOA board members/fellow homeowners/property manager/association attorney, etc. suck. I think that's what the posting rules are getting at when they say "Topics from individual homeowners, who are not acting as association volunteers, may be addressed if the person has come here to learn in a positive way."

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

Thanks, SheilaH. Good points. I certainly can use an attitude adjustment sometimes.

For stopping people from posting: in some posts that were emailed to me, GeorgeS21 states (if I am paraphrasing correctly) that some people shouldn't post. I read that as an "attempt" to "hinder" people from posting.

It's not up to me to say who can post, or what can be said. Nor is it up to GeorgeS21. That's up to the board owners, as listed in the terms of use.

MarkW18
Posts: 1,290

Posted:

First, and this is just my opinion, but 95% of the people who post here are homeowners, "not" "other volunteers". They come here not to "share ideas and learn", but to vent and fight possible solutions to situations they are facing. Why doesn't George stop them right in their tracks before they even get started. This site would not exist if it weren't for those 95%.

George constantly states I hate HOA's and should go elsewhere to vent. For the record, I LOVE HOA's. My daughter and her family enjoy a very nice lifestyle working in this industry. I get to travel this country very nicely and comfortably from the work I put into this industry.

As some may or may not know, California made changes to how elections are conducted in HOA and now enforcing the code that each have a set of election rules that must be distributed to owners before ballots are sent out. Every one of her HOA's have updated Election Rules so there is no delay in conducting their elections. So, while I am retired, I still have a hand in this industry.

But, my wife and I will never live in another HOA as long as we live. We both, her more than me, tried to provide positive influence in the one and only HOA we ever lived in. Because of the acts of just a few homeowners, with the help of a management company and two law firms, she developed a irreversible medical condition.

Fool me once, shame on me. There won't be a second time!

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

For everyone's benefit, the portion of the terms of use that are particularly relevant are copied below (taken from the link I post above).

Users can't do the following. (I note that nowhere in the terms of use does the word "positive" appear, and GeorgeS21 should note the prohibition on "Restrict[ing] or inhibit[ing] any other user from using and enjoying the Communication Services." I am concerned that his statements that others shouldn't post could have violated this prohibition.)

"Defame, abuse, harass, stalk, threaten or otherwise violate the legal rights (such as rights of privacy and publicity) of others.

Publish, post, upload, distribute or disseminate any inappropriate, profane, defamatory, infringing, obscene, indecent or unlawful topic, name, material or information.

Upload files that contain software or other material protected by intellectual property laws (or by rights of privacy of publicity) unless you own or control the rights thereto or have received all necessary consents.

Upload files that contain viruses, corrupted files, or any other similar software or programs that may damage the operation of another's computer.

Advertise or offer to sell or buy any goods or services for any business purpose, unless such Communication Service specifically allows such messages.

Conduct or forward surveys, contests, pyramid schemes or chain letters.

Download any file posted by another user of a Communication Service that you know, or reasonably should know, cannot be legally distributed in such manner.

Falsify or delete any author attributions, legal or other proper notices or proprietary designations or labels of the origin or source of software or other material contained in a file that is uploaded.

Restrict or inhibit any other user from using and enjoying the Communication Services.

Violate any code of conduct or other guidelines which may be applicable for any particular Communication Service.

Harvest or otherwise collect information about others, including e-mail addresses, without their consent.

Violate any applicable laws or regulations."

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

To add: out of concern for GeorgeS21, I will be forwarding his statements that others shouldn't post to the owner of this website so that the owner can determine if GeorgeS21's statements violate the prohibition on restricting others from using this website. Out of concern for him, I'll let the owner and him work that out.

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

To add: for everyone who fights with GeorgeS21, please consider just ignoring him and reporting his posts to the forum moderator.

GeorgeS21, while I don't read your posts unless another participant emails them to me, please know that we're here to help you learn to get along with others and to follow rules. We're pulling for you.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

With all due respect, this is what I was talking about earlier. You and George disagree on various issues and that's ok. When people start getting personal, why not go one better and just ignore him or her, but stick to the issue being discussed and add comments based on that? Just because you two seem to get into it doesn't mean everyone else will - focus on what you're trying to do and ignore the noise.

Incidentally, Mark made a good point about some of the people who post here. I don't mind homeowners posting per se - sometimes their situations provide valuable insight on how to handle a similar situation in your own community (or not). I do get annoyed with people starting with an overly broad question and then adding information as they go. I don't like giving slapdash answers to serious questions, but people also need to understand this site isn't necessarily here to serve as an "amen corner" to your opinion. Sometimes the answer really is "yes, your documents say X" or "no, you can't do that" whether you think that part makes sense or not. However, these aren't the 10 commandments - documents can be changed, but you have to be willing to step up and persuade people to get together to make that happen.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

Thanks, SheilaH. Good points.

I'm sincerely trying to help GeorgeS21, by letting the arguments be taken offline and handled directly by a moderator, who can handle him. I'm sure that he has a lot to add to the board; we need to just get the behavior issues sorted out so that he can focus on answering questions and adding value. He's certainly welcome to post here, as we all are.

Sorry, didn't mean to come across otherwise.

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

To add, at the top of this page, the "Posting Rules" are:

"Rules for Posting Messages

Welcome to HOATalk.com!

This is a positive place for community association leaders to share ideas and learn. This forum is for community association Boards, Committees, Volunteers & HOA Professionals to discuss topics concerning their association duties.
Topics from individual homeowners, who are not acting as association volunteers, may be addressed if the person has come here to learn in a positive way.

We have only a few other rules:

(1) Post any relevant topic you like, but please keep it clean, helpful, positive and friendly.

(2) No Selling: No solicitation, advertising, or selling of any kind is allowed here, except for occasional announcements from official site sponsors.

(3) No Mention of Community/Company/Person Names: In order to fairly enforce (2) and prevent liability, we do not allow the mentioning of any community name, company name or product. Please also do not post the full name of any person."

I'll submit GeorgeS21's posts to the moderator due to the rules that require that posts be "helpful, positive and friendly". I am concerned by GeorgeS21's attacks on people, which I do not view as "helpful, positive and friendly".

GeorgeS21, this is done to help you. We like you and we're pulling for you. Warm regards.

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808

Posted:

Ha, sure. And, I clearly appreciate this angle, Paul and Mark.

I’ll be there when you are negative about HOAs ... please remember the purpose of this site.

PaulJ6
Posts: 990

Posted:

From my perspective, this thread is closed (at least to future posts by me), and I've made my points. Thanks, everyone. If others wish to continue with this thread, all yours to continue with.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

This entire thread is one of the most childish thing I've ever seen on any forum.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnT38 on 03/30/2020 6:48 AM
This entire thread is one of the most childish thing I've ever seen on any forum.

I agree.

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